Tired of the performative beggars and alcoholics this time of year

[Onand]

Is anyone else sick and tired of the huge number of ‘homeless’ beggars, alcoholics and addicts that descended on the streets since the Christmas rush started this year?

Manchester is rife with them- this year there is a particularly ropey bunch of alcoholics/ addicts that are obnoxiously ‘sleeping’ or sitting with their bags pointing directly out into the street instead of being against a wall, they’re building ‘dens’ in shop doorways which stink of human faeces and piss, dealers go from spot to spot, dogs forced to sit in uncomfortable situations (often not even their dog as the same one gets passed from beggar to beggar).

It’s a self perpetuating problem because soup kitchens serving buffets set up and cater meals for them whilst they’re generally being a nuisance and making the streets look an absolute shitty mess. Why are they tolerated? People need to stop giving them money as it just encourages them to keep doing it when there are services in place to help them.

Bah humbug I know, but It’s beyond grim.

I know that donating to shelters and homeless charities is the best way. I was saying that IF the person mentioned above HAD to give Lunde's brother something, make it a hot meal, not a bloody bottle of whiskey!

Charities for the homeless employ professionals to help their service users. People with multiple and severe needs require consistent and professional help if they are to stand any chance of improving their circumstances. It’s incredibly naive to think otherwise.

This is why I have a monthly direct debit to a charity who does exactly this. They work with the local council to source temporary accommodation, help with benefits, and with mental health / addiction.

Donating to charity doesn’t stop anyone from also making the time to chat kindly and respectfully to someone who is begging. That’s also helpful if it feels safe to do so.

You appear to care very much.

Calling people ‘beggars’ repeatedly is de-humanising and stigmatising.

Compassion does indeed help people; it is often what leads to the ‘investment’ you reference and informs social policy and social change. Not to mention how compassion helps understanding vulnerable and marginalised groups. Compassion literally saves lives - look at frontline workers, third sector workers, food bank volunteers. The fact you don’t know this speaks volumes about you.

Hello Suella! Talk about a lack of empathy.
We all like to think it couldn't happen to us but it could happen to any one of us.
There but for the grace of God and all of that.

I was disputing the assertion that handing over the contents of your pockets to every beggar you see is the only way to be compassionate or helpful.
Beggars is not dehumanising. It is a noun to describe someone who begs.
Compassion itself isn't helpful. Speaking as someone with experience in this and similar areas in multiple continents. Compassion isn't what gets you out the door to work in this area for years and years.
Don't put words in my mouth.

It is dehumanising, the same way as calling someone an ‘addict’ is. You are defining someone by an action. Rather than saying a homeless person.

Compassion itself is totally helpful. It absolutely motivates people to work in the field of addiction and mental health. It is not the only factor, but it is an important one. Compassion is a key part of the healing process in terms of healing from trauma too, which most homeless people have experienced.

There is an incongruence between the lack of empathy you display and the experience you profess to have.

I really wasn't criticising. How do you give someone a hot meal when it's possibly not something that they want - or will leave on the floor somewhere (see posts in this thread)? Buying sandwiches? How would you know if they're vegetarian/gluten free or whatever? All of those points have been made on previous threads and it really is a minefield.

I'm really sorry for Lunde's brother, it's a situation of the worst kind and I can't imagine how difficult it is for Lunde. I wouldn't have a bottle of whiskey on me but giving money would lead to the same thing. An addict would buy what they wanted. The point I was making is that really, posters have said that they will give money directly and criticised those who won't.

Everybody should follow their conscience. Mine is no longer to hand over money, not ever. I donate to shelters/charities and I believe that they're doing the job that they said they would.

I think it's too risky not to be mugged or pressed for larger amounts and for a woman to have an open purse is just asking for trouble. I'm talking of my own experience, we all are. We all have the circumstances we know of in mind when we post here.

There's troll hunting on the thread now so I think I'll leave it there but thanks for your post back to me, ThatKhakiMoose.

Fine. People with addictions who beg on the streets amongst other hobbies and interests. Is that better?

…or just homeless people.

Exactly this.

They need to take responsibility for themselves -addiction or not. The homeless charities in Manchester won’t accept many of them because of their poor behaviour and utter contempt for living within the system. Instead they blight the streets like something out of a horror film with druggie alcoholic gatherings- it’s beyond grim and quite frightening especially for young child being exposed to someone shooting up outside Boots or pissing themselves in the middle of the pavement outside Spar.

Those who are in a genuinely dreadful situation have the sense to seek help and do better for themselves.

Waving that mental health card to excuse homelessness and addiction is mute in my view.

Your last point about us not excusing other bad behaviours due to MH is especially poignant, I hope it makes a few people think.

But I'm not talking about homeless people. I'm talking about people who beg.
You can laugh @Plastictrees , but the words are not interchangeable. Surely someone as knowledgeable as you would know that.

Yes - this ⬆️

As I pointed out upthread, the majority of homeless people do not beg. At least two thirds do not. They are invisible to the general public, and are more likely to be young people.

And the majority who beg are not sleeping rough. Most have serious problems, such as addiction, and are vulnerable to exploitation, so still be kind to them if it feels safe.

Please can this thread be taken down.

Its deeply saddening.

OP i pity you with your sanctimonious views.
I hope you have the Christmas you deserve and end up sad and alone

@NantesElephant having distain for someone who is begging is really something else.

Liberals are an absolute menace. People giving money to beggars are a scourge to society.

@User135644 virtue signalling is a hollow act, when people are living by what they say, it's not virtue signalling. This thread has brought out some very ugly opinions. Try speaking to an addict, find out their story and you'll often fully understand why they're on drugs. Do you know how difficult it is to access a drugs rehabilitation programme via local authority in the Uk? To pay privately it is 7k. You have no idea at all.

@User135644 'people giving money to beggars are a scourge to society'...of all the scourges to society, you pick people giving money to beggars. Dear me. I give up.

If you give money to an addict, cut out the middle man and give the money straight to organised crime.

Look what's been done to California. It just doesn't happen in Republican cities and states.

Begging should be criminalised.

Rough sleepers should be provided secure accommodation- get them off the streets

Rehab/addiction centres have to be more accessible. Get beggars off the streets.

There needs to be a will to deal with it properly. Giving money to addicts makes people part of the problem.

Those in a genuinely dreadful situation have the sense to seek help and do better.

Yes. Nobody ever gets entrenched or stuck in dreadful situations. Nobody ever loses either the desire or motivation to get out of those situations. Nobody ever eventually doesn’t expect/want better.

Dear god. What an awful way to think.

I totally agree.

I have "checked" my privilege.
It's working OK thanks.

[Now go away and look up the UK definition of the word "check".]

I live in central London near a large shelter
If I was to step out my door I would see homeless people within 2 minutes
At the moment there are 3 main types:

The well established all year round- they come and go a bit. Beg outside the local shop- hang around together. All British- a few women but mostly men. The younger ones do drugs in the tube (in full view) and some sleep there. I get them coffee, very occasionally cash, quite often give them a can of cider/beer from a 4 pack. Occasionally I see them elsewhere in London and they are as surprised as I am- they have a patch. I know who is there at 2 am and who sleeps where as I see them every day. Not aggressive- usually say hello. They do go into the shelter- they get clean clothes very regularly and usually have decent trainers and coats on (donated I assume). They sometimes get rehomed but usually it fails and they tell you that they are back. They used to hang out outside Pret and when the 5 coffees a day thing was on everyone got them drinks. I have had to call ambulance/police many times when someone is injured/overdose. I found someone dead (I Think) one morning when walking the dog.

A quick walk to the more touristy areas and the Roma are there. I am sure that some are trafficked and that they receive benefits and they are taken from them. The police say that they are all legal. They are not there at 2am. You do see them being dropped off. You also see the same people all over central London- so no set patch.

In the past few weeks there have been young and quite well dressed beggars on the tube and on the streets. Never seen the like before in the years that I have lived here. Women in tracksuits, trainers and with handbags just walking up and asking for cash. Commented to a colleague about it only last week. They are quite aggressive. Seem to be beggars but not homeless.