To not let my sister bring her own meat on Christmas day!

[FelizNavidadAmiga]

First off, we are a strictly vegan household for moral reasons. I invited my sister for Christmas lunch as she is recently divorced and has nowhere else to go. I usually put on a magnificent spread with roast vegetables, tagine, stuffed peppers, vine leaves, falafel, home made hummus etc. My sister has just sent me a message saying she's going to bring her own chicken to cook. AIBU to say no way! I don't want chicken cooking in my nice clean vegan oven! Plus the smell makes me feel ill 🤢 I don't want to upset her as she's very sensitive at the moment but surely she can do without chicken for 1 day.

That sounds delicious. Strong contender for the next main meal I cook once Christmas is over. I made something similar recently based on a NYT recipe somebody mentioned here. Yours sounds less fiddly.

I know there are some who will cook meat for other people, but would you really enjoy meat cooked by someone who has no experience of cooking it and won't taste it for seasong etc?

Not to mention the health implications. Badly cooked meat is a fast track to food poisoning.

What's the difference? (the taking of the meat, not the cooking of it)

It's also shouldn't be difficult for you to understand other views but here we are.

I do understand that other views exist, thanks. That doesn’t mean I have to think they’re anything other than nonsense.

Because some vegans and vegetarians don't want meat in the house. They find the idea of it repugnant.

I get that you have various food intolerances, but your diet can't be exclusively meat at every meal. What do you eat with meat?

If I was vegan or vegetarian I would still find a way to feed guests with foods that they enjoy. It just wouldn't be meat or related food products that I wouldn't have in the house.

Then you would not go for the meal easy.

But it’s a magnificent spread

So, let me get this right, you declare any view other than your to be 'nonsense'?

I know a lot of people who really don't like turkey but insist on having it every Christmas.
There is a very funny Christmas episode of the Royle family that illustrates this. Barbs asks all the family in turn if they enjoyed the turkey. They all say no, she then says I won't buy one next year no one likes it. They all look horrified and complain! It's so funny because it is very true to life in some households

If I was the DS, I'd enjoy the snacks & have my real dinner either before or after the visit.

You’re being ridiculous. I’m clearly talking about specific views.

Because as mentioned in OP the sister is recently divorced, presumably miserable and presumably OP loves her?

"Fuck off your Christmas food is your own problem" isn’t the kind of reaction that leads to goodwill and an atmosphere of loving family supportiveness. Helping DSis to find an option that she will enjoy is the loving sisterly thing to do. Telling her to like it or lump it is entirely legitimate by mumsnet standards but not loving or caring.

Fellow vegan here! I don’t think you’re being unreasonable but also I wouldn’t call your sister unreasonable for asking/wanting meat. I personally am a disgusted by meat and the concept of it, but also do allow people to bring meat into my house provided they cook it with their own pots and pans.

I think there is also the element of this being post-divorce. She’s probably feeling a bit lost in your house, and probably a bit like a beggar/like she’s intruding on your space. I think that coming down on her like a ton of bricks about the meat situation might make her feel unwelcome/like she doesn’t really fit in, and you don’t want that. In my (completely uneducated) psychological analysis, she might have a set idea of what ‘Christmas dinner’ looks like, and want to keep it as an anchor of normality, as so many things about Christmas for her this year will not be normal. So if you are going to say she can’t bring meat (which is fair), I’d let her know in a nice way.

hope you all have a lovely Christmas together x

People are kidding themselves if they think there is an ethical argument for meat consumption. Several posters have brought up food miles as a justification for claiming that no one diet is more ethical than another. It’s a comforting lie people tell themselves - that because of food miles, a vegan diet is worse for the environment than an omnivorous one, and so their choice to eat meat and animal products (so long as locally sourced) is an ethical one.

The truth is that a vegan diet is infinitely better for the planet, even if you were to exclusively eat produce from your own farm. You can read about it here if you’re interested: https://ourworldindata.org/food-choice-vs-eating-local

Food miles are only a very small part of the environmental cost of the food we eat, and the environmental cost of locally produced meat products vastly outweighs the environmental cost of things like avocados and bananas (which tend to be among the most environmentally damaging vegan foods).

Even vegan foods which do have a tangible negative impact on the environment, like almond milk, are significantly less environmentally harmful than cow’s milk.

That’s not to say eating local isn’t a good idea. I’m suspicious of just how local most people’s produce actually is - I doubt whether the majority of posters claiming to only eat local produce are actually consistently doing so - but it is better to eat locally than not. But even eating local produce doesn’t come close to equalising the environmental impact of animal products compared to vegan products.

And I’m not even vegan! I eat some dairy, and I keep my own chickens whose eggs I eat. So I’m fully aware that many people, myself included, follow diets that aren’t based on an ethical justification. But there is so much misinformation perpetrated by people who want to eat the diet they like and simultaneously feel morally superior to those who chose to follow a different diet for ethical reasons. If you want to eat meat, do it. Literally nobody is stopping you. But if you want to eat meat and simultaneously argue that people choosing to be vegan for ethical reasons are getting it wrong because of something spurious like food miles, you’re just completely misinformed and should be aware of the true position.

Excellent post @HocusFord

That’s not to say eating local isn’t a good idea. I’m suspicious of just how local most people’s produce actually is - I doubt whether the majority of posters claiming to only eat local produce are actually consistently doing so - but it is better to eat locally than not.

I know a woman who genuinely believed she was only eating local produce because she bought everything from Sainsbury’s Local 😄

I can't say i would be looking forward to the food you have planned but i also wouldn't expect to be able to cook meat in a vegan household! I would either ask to bring some pre cooked meat for myself or make myself something more traditional for my supper when i got home. I would smile politely and pretend to enjoy the food you have made.

Absolutely this - I think a lot of people assume that if they buy produce from a local supermarket they’re buying local, without actually checking the packaging of the meat and veg to see where it comes from. It’s very rarely from the farm down the road.

That's not what I mean by eating locally.
I've already explained it but it seems to have fallen on deaf ears.

And equally a lot of people do check the packaging. Or buy from independent butchers or greengrocers who say who their suppliers are.

Nobody ever, ever checks where the food of the livestock animals was grown either.

Most animals in this country are fed fodder grown in the former Amazon rainforest region.

To be honest I think eat local is more of a marketing thing. Also the sentiment stems from America where they actually have sufficient land to feed themselves and theoretically make those kind of choices. The UK doesn’t have that luxury.

My household is a mixture of vegan and veggie and we have a fairly traditional Christmas dinner with vegan alternative to turkey. Visiting family bring sliced cold cooked turkey on a small plate. No cooking it/smells/ sight of giant bird, and everyone is okay with it. Ultimately I think it's fine to make your own household rules, but we kind of figured people could have all the things they like as long as we don't have to deal with it.

We are a vegan household, we choose to live that way but I have absolutely NO problem with my parents bringing a plate of already cooked Turkey and ham with them for Christmas. Everyone should be able to enjoy their Christmas meal and I know for a fact they would not enjoy mine and that is ok. They would never ask if they could cook it at ours however but I would never enforce a vegan meal on those who do not eat it. It's all about give and take and not eat my food or don't come. That is just plain rude and unkind.

Yeah I don’t like casseroles either. Or stews. Also don’t like any tagine style dish I’ve ever tried. Maybe there’s a correlation as I sort of see tagine as a Middle Eastern stew/casserole. 🤷‍♀️