Dissections in Y7

[Mepop]

My DD had to do a dissection in her Science class today. She’s Y7. She asked not to take part but got told she had no choice but to do it. She has been very upset and teary about it this evening. I’m vegetarian. I also have a biology degree and managed to obtain it doing zero dissections so struggle to see why a Y7 has no choice but to do one in Y7 in a state school, I am considering complaining to the school. But am I being unreasonable?

It’s not compulsory. OPs child asked not to do it and was told she had to. She didn’t have to so was lied to. It is therefore appropriate for OP to complain if she wishes. It may come up again, it was done twice in my children’s Biology classes in secondary school, so it will mean OPs child will be listened to next time. It will also help other children who don’t want to do it in future.

Eyeroll.

"We never do any practicals". "I don't want to do THAT practical". "This is too dangerous/ doesn't sit right with me". Does demo to try and please all "We never do any practicals!"

Speaking as a science teacher, we can never do right. Few schools have the budget to have one piece of dissection equipment for all kids anyway, so they will likely have worked in pairs or small groups, therefore they will likely have had the option of not handling the meat.

I don't allow kids to sit out (because to them, it means doing nothing while sitting very far away), they have to at least watch.

I also doubt the PP who did a degree in Biology without ever having done any dissections has passed an A-level in Biology, seeing as safe dissections are a required part of the course.

The normal year 7 practical is cutting up chicken wings (bought in a large barbecue pack from Asda) when learning about muscles and bones. I’m not sure I’d even class it as dissection. Was this what she did?

It’s not compulsory. OPs child asked not to do it and was told she had to. She didn’t have to so was lied to.|

Surely she was told she had to because it's what the class was doing. I doubt any of the individual science experiments are specifically compulsory, but if you asked not to do it, you'd be told you had to because that's what you're doing in that lesson.
I'm surprised the teacher didn't allow people to opt to just watch though, if only to save the whining.

What was she dissecting OP?

Even in the dark ages that was the 80,s I remember doing disections at secondary school.

I was allowed to not take part in dissections on rats back in 1977 as I was and still am vegan and opposed to animal experiments. It was a general science lesson and not something I had chosen as an "option". I knew I wouldn't need science qualification for my career. I'd not complain but explain to the school and tell them your daughter will not be taking part in any future dissections.

Both my kids have done this in year 7.
I can vaguely remember doing it too.
I think in year 9 we had a set of sheep's lungs that we pumped up.

As far as being a vegetarian fairs, I'm not sure whether they'd be accepting of that reason. I suppose the whole class could say they were vegetarian and sit the class out.

My daughter’s science teacher has allowed her to sit out of lessons involving dissection (there have only been a couple, she’s in year 9 now). She’s an animal lover, vegetarian and hasn’t touched meat since she was 6 out of choice. She’s been given the choice of watching, or going to the library and doing equivalent learning from a textbook.

I used to teach science, she should have been allowed to sit at the front / back of the room with a book to do related work. I'd email the HOD. This works in everyone's favour as the last thing you need midlesson is a fainter.

Some schools dissect chicken wings in year 7. Students might see the respiratory system in year 8 and 9, year 10 is heart and triple is an eyeball if doing Triple (AQA). Either from the supermarket or sourced by a local butcher from an abbatoir as a byproduct of the meat industry.

I dissected an eye as well, either year 8/9 (cant remember) and in 6th form biology we watched the dissection of a lamb.

Indeed. That's a very unusual state school doing dissections in yr7.
My DC went through their entire secondary education not doing a single one!

I only remember a lesson dissecting a heart in maybe year 10 or 11, but I’d been veggie for around 2-3 years by then so was allowed to sit it out and did the equivalent learning from textbooks in the lab next door supervisised by a lab tech.

the only reasons allowed for missing it were religious or veggie, and at a Catholic school in 2002 there were not many of us in either catagory…

Ok to clear up some questions.

They dissected chicken wings in pairs to learn how muscles work. When she said she did not want to do it she was given gloves. She is very rule abiding and would not have refused when told she had no choice.

And to those doubting my ability to achieve an A-level and biology degree without doing any dissections I promise you it is true. I got very good grades in both and the degree was at a well regarded university. It wasn’t that I refused to do dissections, none of my courses required them. Mind you this was some time ago now, I am sure things have changed.

How does it matter if somoene is vegetarian? It's not like they're are forced to eat the dissected object. Being able to do dissections in school is a privilege. Not fun or pleasant but educational and informative. I am unsure where the notion came form that we have to reside right in the fluffy cushy middle of our own personal comfort zone at all times? How do people open their minds, get experience or learn to deal with minor discomfort?

You sound uninformed about education and unsympathetic to call it whining,

Children are allowed to opt out of it. A school acting correctly would not just tell a child they had to are dissect a heart or whatever, so you’re wrong.

There are required practicals in GCSE Biology but they do not involve dissection of animal parts. In fact, in some cases, such as not having enough resources, even for other required practicals, the teacher can do it at the front of the class with children just watching. I know some schools that have just showed videos of the practicals to children for various reasons. The children just need to understand the practical. In the case of dissection, it’s not even a required practical.

Some vegetarians/vegans do not want to handle animal body parts either, it’s not hard to understand. It wouldn’t have been a minor discomfort to at least one of my children.

Can I just point out that you don’t know the teacher said she had no choice but to do it. If she said to the teacher she didn’t want to touch it - being given gloves is a reasonable response.

What your daughter meant is “I don’t want to do this, from a moral viewpoint”but might not have communicated this,

So without being there it is hard to know how the conversation went. It could still be a misunderstanding. A conversation to your daughter about what she said would be helpful as would some guidance in how to say no politely in this situations and make her feelings heard.

All the schools I have worked in students have the option to sit out, some feel faint, some have moral / religious objections.

Interesting, you say you are veggi not your daughter is. Would she have had the same reaction if cooking chicken wings in a food class?

Me too. I wonder if she specialised in plants or something.

When I was at school in the 90's, I was excused from dissection as I was really distressed at the thought. I wasn't the only one to sit it out.

DS is in Y7 and they had a rat dissection competition a couple of weeks ago. Totally optional. DS didn't take part.

We have at least 5 out of 30 children who choose not to do dissection involving wings, hearts etc each time we do it. We let students know we’ll be doing it the week before and tell them to contact us if they don’t want to. It’s not a problem.

Have a chat with the school, see exactly what has happened. If they told her she had to do it when she said she didn’t want to, I would complain.

We all did that back in the day but it was made quite clear that if, for whatever reason, we didn't want to we could sit it out.

That was an all boys State Grammar School.

I would object to the school if I was you OP.

Let's hope we don't get a veggie surgeon who has only ever operated on carrots 😂 🥕 🥦 🥔

She should not have been forced to take part. I would complain to the Head and governors and LA. It's wrong on every level. The teacher lied about it being compulsory.