Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be annoyed at being told to be considerate of disabled people

693 replies

DefendingPan · 13/12/2024 13:48

This sign was in the disabled toilet in a restaurant (which is also the only baby change in the restaurant).

What’s the point of this sign? What might parents be doing that they will stop after reading this?

To be annoyed at being told to be considerate of disabled people
OP posts:
Thread gallery
8
Livingthedream1978 · 13/12/2024 16:02

Rosscameasdoody · 13/12/2024 15:53

Still doesn’t entitle you to spend overly long in the disabled toilet , or, as I have witnessed many times, parents leaving the table down and all sorts of crap left on it, and things moved around the room. A bit of consideration costs nothing. Baby changing doesn’t trump disability.

This with bells on!

OP the reason the sign is up is because clearly people are not being considerate and it needs pointing out.

I agree the baby changing facilities should be elsewhere but this thread is so ableist and frustrating as someone who’s DD has a hidden disability (one of many) which means when her meds wear off and she need to go, she cannot wait,

VegTrug · 13/12/2024 16:02

@EmmaMaria If that genuinely isn't what you meant then you need to think about the words you use and the descriptions you give as that was very much the impression.

Also, whilst I'm not suggesting for a second that nobody ever fakes a disability. However you cannot possibly know who is or isn't. In your previous post you said

sometimes I wonder if 99% of the population has suddenly developed invisible disabilities

and

Apparently everybody and their cousin now has a lanyard for their invisible disability (mostly being too tight to pay for the expedited queue)

And you wonder why people drew the conclusion they did!?!

phoenixrosehere · 13/12/2024 16:08

JustMyView13 · 13/12/2024 15:17

Seems pretty pointless because it indicates you’re either a parent, or you’re disabled. When in fact there are many disabled parents, and many parents of disabled children.

All parent and child facilities should be disabled friendly to cater for this.

We need to move away from a world where we pop people firmly in one bucket and stereotype their needs on that basis.

Really just quite an odd sign.

Agree. Definitely could have been worded better and I doubt it is only able-bodied parents using those facilities inconsiderately so singling parents out alone is silly.

NoahsTortoise · 13/12/2024 16:11

Funny enough, I was in a baby change with my little daughter and niece this weekend and a woman hammered on the door and, when I opened it, asked me if I knew how many people with babies were waiting to use the toilet and accused me of not even having a baby with me! I was stunned and she didn't even apologise when I showed her I actually had 2 with me needing changing.

So I imagine it's just to remind ignorant parents like this woman that it is a shared facility, not just for parents. I could easily have been disabled and needing to use the accessible toilet, but because she (somehow?!?!) didn't see a child with me she felt entitled to be incredibly rude and aggressive.

So maybe the venue has had instances with disabled people being confronted by parents in this manner.

renoleno · 13/12/2024 16:12

I'd see it as asking people to use the space more considerately- cleaning up, putting down the table and not spending ages in there. But what I find odd is considerate use of all facilities should be the message. If my IBS has been triggered, I still have to queue ages for someone using the cubicle for a phone call, to breastfeed, play on their phone etc. I'm not disabled but still at risk of shitting my pants - in which case I would argue my need trumps both a disabled person without bowel/urine issues and a dirty nappy. But obv I'm considered to have multiple toilet options (irrelevant as i'm also sharing with a much larger group of people) - so don't qualify for the disabled toilet.

I agree that no one should be breastfeeding in there, and always cleaning up after the nappy change and leave the loo in the accessible way after use. However, I don't think being disabled means automatically being unable to queue for some time, given waiting times in regular loos are just as long esp now that so many are unisex meaning even more people ahead of you. Would the wait be considered equally bad if another disabled person was taking ages or leaving a mess, or is it only parents who need to use the space considerately?

Mirandawrongs · 13/12/2024 16:13

SleepingStandingUp · 13/12/2024 15:08

It isn't always a case of just putting them somewhere else or that parents are shit, lazy entitled dicks. Our coffee shop has two loos - a toilet-wide loo and the accessible loo. If I had my three kids with me we simply couldn't fit in the single loo together. And no, I couldn't baby wear twins plus manage my son and his O2 cylinder and yes I also insisted on catching the bus with my pushchair (and yes I moved). So whilst I'd have offered to let you go ahead of me, unless they make the doors glass I can't see you once I'm sat down peeing. If you'd knocked I'd have called to hang on and come to the door once I'd finished peeing. Can't put another loo in as there simply isn't room.

Op I wouldn't be offended by the note of you use the loos considerately. Obviously someone isn't. I've seen nappies left on the side of sinks when there's bins 3 ft away for example. Just accept that someone needs to see that message.

I’m quite obviously not talking about people with disabled child.
mum falling about the people with pushchairs and older children grabbing the radar key doors as I’m leaving because ‘normal’ loos aren’t big enough.

that is not a disabled persons problem.

EmmaMaria · 13/12/2024 16:13

VegTrug · 13/12/2024 16:02

@EmmaMaria If that genuinely isn't what you meant then you need to think about the words you use and the descriptions you give as that was very much the impression.

Also, whilst I'm not suggesting for a second that nobody ever fakes a disability. However you cannot possibly know who is or isn't. In your previous post you said

sometimes I wonder if 99% of the population has suddenly developed invisible disabilities

and

Apparently everybody and their cousin now has a lanyard for their invisible disability (mostly being too tight to pay for the expedited queue)

And you wonder why people drew the conclusion they did!?!

I don't appreciate you telling me what I should and should not do or say. I have plenty of thanks for these posts from people who agree with them, so I don't need your condescension, thank you. I will not be responding to your posts - there is clearly a difference of opinion here and I will be continuing to post as I wish when I wish. You will read it how you want. That is your problem, not mine.

SavingTheBestTillLast · 13/12/2024 16:18

renoleno · 13/12/2024 16:12

I'd see it as asking people to use the space more considerately- cleaning up, putting down the table and not spending ages in there. But what I find odd is considerate use of all facilities should be the message. If my IBS has been triggered, I still have to queue ages for someone using the cubicle for a phone call, to breastfeed, play on their phone etc. I'm not disabled but still at risk of shitting my pants - in which case I would argue my need trumps both a disabled person without bowel/urine issues and a dirty nappy. But obv I'm considered to have multiple toilet options (irrelevant as i'm also sharing with a much larger group of people) - so don't qualify for the disabled toilet.

I agree that no one should be breastfeeding in there, and always cleaning up after the nappy change and leave the loo in the accessible way after use. However, I don't think being disabled means automatically being unable to queue for some time, given waiting times in regular loos are just as long esp now that so many are unisex meaning even more people ahead of you. Would the wait be considered equally bad if another disabled person was taking ages or leaving a mess, or is it only parents who need to use the space considerately?

Agree with comments here
Its also worth mentioning a larger toilet that disabled people can use is officially an accessible toilet so for anyone that needs more space, including families with children et all.
Odd to put a comment like this just on this facility, surely everyone should leave all toilet facilities in a clean and ordered condition.

stripeyshutters · 13/12/2024 16:19

@EmmaMaria you have not done any favours by questioning hidden disabilities and lanyards.

Persianpaws · 13/12/2024 16:21

TheCoolOliveBalonz · 13/12/2024 14:41

You wouldn't let a disabled person use the disabled loo in front of you?! 😮

There are lots of people who think like this.

My best friend has struggled with mobility for years but her condition has recently deteriorated so that she needs a wheelchair. Both of us were shocked at how people behave.

She’s been pushed out of peoples way in her chair.
People address me rather than my friend like she doesn’t exist.
She struggles so much with selfish people but one of the worst examples was with a disabled/baby change toilet.

My friend has bladder issues as part of her condition and the need to wee comes on suddenly. She has frequent urine and kidney infections and so when she needs the toilet it’s important she goes quickly.

Last month she went to use the disabled toilet with a woman in front waiting to change her baby. She asked if she could go ahead in the queue and the woman with the baby glared and told her to wait her turn.
I was waiting with her and asked if she was just waiting to change her baby (I wasn’t sure if she had a hidden disability and didn’t want to assume) she said yes and started ranting about how hard it was to be a parent and changing nappies out and about.

I lost my temper which I’m not proud of but I said being a parent is a choice and being disabled isn’t, I pretty much told her to move out of the way to let my friend use the toilet.

I do have sympathy and understand that sometimes a nappy can leak or there can be a poo explosion, a baby won’t feel the same humiliation though as if an adult can’t control their bladder and wets themself in public because of someone else being selfish or gets an infection from being forced to wait.
My friend has also been forced to wait due to a woman breastfeeding and said a queue was building up, this was in a place where there was no reason for the woman to breastfeed in the toilet and she was unapologetic when she came out and saw the people waiting.

Someone else commented about the abuse of hidden disability lanyards at the airport, I noticed this as well. I was at the airport yesterday and DP was treated with slight suspicion by staff when wearing his lanyard, when it became a bit more obvious he was genuine attitudes changed.
Almost half the people on our flight had a lanyard on and I gave the benefit of the doubt until I saw a woman with 5 children all wearing them. Someone else questioned it and she said she had borrowed them from a friend as there were 3 adults with the five children and sometimes the group spilt and they all wanted priority/fast track entrance. This woman was almost bragging about it like it was some sort of life hack and not making a mockery out of a service designed to help vulnerable people.

It really makes me angry that people seem to see it as disabled people “having perks” rather than them needing these things for accessibility reasons. I am sure no one would swap being able bodied for these things so why resent them and try to take over?

People seem to be becoming far more selfish and self centred and it’s unpleasant to witness. Look at the fact the OP has failed to understand what the sign in her OP can possibly mean and seems to have taken it personally and has had to have the possible reasons behind it explained rather then work it out herself.

I just hope none of the people who are selfish and thoughtless ever genuinely need to use disabled facilities, they might then feel ashamed about their behaviour or insensitivity.

OneBadKitty · 13/12/2024 16:22

I would imagine that small independent restaurants are short of space- lots of restaurants don't have an accessible toilet or a baby-change facility. Don't eat there if they don't provide the facilities you want.

VegTrug · 13/12/2024 16:25

@EmmaMaria I've had over 50 thanks myself so clearly people agree with me!

You do need to look at your attitude towards disabled people, it stinks. It's not a game of top trumps.

TheCoolOliveBalonz · 13/12/2024 16:25

I'm really shocked by the results on that poll. I can only imagine it's because lots of people don't have direct experience of being out and about with a disabled person.

ThatFluentTiger · 13/12/2024 16:25

OneBadKitty · 13/12/2024 16:22

I would imagine that small independent restaurants are short of space- lots of restaurants don't have an accessible toilet or a baby-change facility. Don't eat there if they don't provide the facilities you want.

Yes disabled people how dare you have the audacity to want to eat at a certain restaurant like everyone else. Just stay home will you.
What an awful attitude.

Nolegusta · 13/12/2024 16:28

ThatFluentTiger · 13/12/2024 16:25

Yes disabled people how dare you have the audacity to want to eat at a certain restaurant like everyone else. Just stay home will you.
What an awful attitude.

Edited

I think it's more 'vote with your feet' and frequent places which try their very best to provide suitable facilities?

betterangels · 13/12/2024 16:30

ThatFluentTiger · 13/12/2024 16:25

Yes disabled people how dare you have the audacity to want to eat at a certain restaurant like everyone else. Just stay home will you.
What an awful attitude.

Edited

It really is so incredibly depressing. We should be thankful to be able to go out at all, I guess.

renoleno · 13/12/2024 16:31

ThatFluentTiger · 13/12/2024 16:25

Yes disabled people how dare you have the audacity to want to eat at a certain restaurant like everyone else. Just stay home will you.
What an awful attitude.

Edited

Oh come on! My friend has a baby and will carefully research places that have baby change facilities and are breastfeeding friendly. I will check to only visit places that have multiple cubicles because of my IBS. It's entitled to expect the entire world to cater for you when it doesn't cater completely to any group of people, disabled or non disabled.

MerryMaker · 13/12/2024 16:31

TheCoolOliveBalonz · 13/12/2024 16:25

I'm really shocked by the results on that poll. I can only imagine it's because lots of people don't have direct experience of being out and about with a disabled person.

I am not. Lots of people think people using wheelchairs are catered for and have it fairly easy, but parents have it much harder. They don't have a clue.

Deja321 · 13/12/2024 16:32

m00rfarm · 13/12/2024 15:04

No - mothers are feeding children in the toilets when they could have done this elsewhere. My mother was waiting for over 10 minutes one day - I knocked on the door as she really needed the facilities, and the lady inside said to wait as she was breastfeeding!

It's a real shame the mother felt as though she had to breasfeed in the toilets. Society need to be more accepting of breastfeeding so mothers don't feel they have to hide.
Also babies need changing, people would soon complain if a mother changed babies nappy at the table. It's a shared facility for disabled and mothers so yet again pitted against each other.

VegTrug · 13/12/2024 16:33

MerryMaker · 13/12/2024 15:52

Lots of people with visible disabilities also have invisible disabilities. It is not a clear dividing line.

Exactly! 👏🏻

betterangels · 13/12/2024 16:34

renoleno · 13/12/2024 16:31

Oh come on! My friend has a baby and will carefully research places that have baby change facilities and are breastfeeding friendly. I will check to only visit places that have multiple cubicles because of my IBS. It's entitled to expect the entire world to cater for you when it doesn't cater completely to any group of people, disabled or non disabled.

It's cute that anyone should think that disabled people expect the world to cater to us.

I'm pretty sure most disabled people know better.

WillowTree33 · 13/12/2024 16:35

@DefendingPan I work in disability advocacy, sorry haven’t read whole thread so someone may have said, but one example is that parents have on occasion tucked the emergency pull cord away if the child has been playing with it and forget to put it back which obviously means people with mobility related disabilities can be stuck if unable to reach or access the cord. Also many incidents of people (not just parents) judging people with non-visible disabilities using the loos which can be especially impactful if they have an urgent need e.g due to IBD.

To be honest the whole world needs to be more mindful to disability, accessibility and inclusivity, not just parents, and dual use facilities don’t exactly help!

BobbyBiscuits · 13/12/2024 16:38

@Rosscameasdoody yeah. That's true. I'm not sure if I've noticed before, but there's never been a conflict, so to speak. I'm disabled but only sometimes actually realistically 'need' the disabled loo. My mum always needs it. So yeah, the baby changing ideally should be separate.
I guess I do know the popular 'mummy' cafes in the area and me and mum would choose not to use them.
Though many small cafes etc would claim space isn't adequate for both.

Jimmyneutronsforehead · 13/12/2024 16:39

Don't know if it's been pointed out yet either but a lot of parents wind the red alert cable around a handle or tie it up out of the way so their kids can't reach it, but it completely defeats the purpose of it being accessible from the floor in case of a fall or a slip or even reachable from being seated.

I find this happens in almost every disabled facility I use that has shared public usage like being a baby change or being the only toilet in a corridor and the normal access toilets being further away.

I would want non-disabled people using these facilities to be extra aware of this and to make sure they leave the bathroom accessible when they leave, don't leave toilet paper on the floor, unwind the cable if you see it tied up, mop up any spills etc.

MerryMaker · 13/12/2024 16:41

Deja321 · 13/12/2024 16:32

It's a real shame the mother felt as though she had to breasfeed in the toilets. Society need to be more accepting of breastfeeding so mothers don't feel they have to hide.
Also babies need changing, people would soon complain if a mother changed babies nappy at the table. It's a shared facility for disabled and mothers so yet again pitted against each other.

It is being considerate. Its fine to quickly change a babies nappy. It is not okay to use the only toilet disabled people can sue for ages to breastfeed.
People would create merry hell if a mother shut off access to all the ordinary toilets to breastfeed.

Swipe left for the next trending thread