People who think weight loss injections are cheating

[AuntieDote]

I've seen this viewpoint over multiple threads recently, and I'm just really curious to understand it a bit more because it makes no sense to me whatsoever.

What do you think people using the injections are cheating at?

As in - what's the competition and who are they gaining an unfair advantage over? What do you think the rules of being allowed to lose weight are/ should be?

Is it more important to you that overweight people/ those struggling with obesity lose the weight, become healthier, reduce the burden on the NHS, stop taking up more than their allocated amount of space in the world, or just stop doing whatever it is that upsets people so much about the existence of fat people -- or is it more important that they struggle and suffer whilst doing so?

Or would you secretly prefer them to remain fat so you can feel superior?

Is it that you feel you've worked really hard to either lose weight, keep it off or never put it on in the first place, so nobody else should be allowed to achieve this without the same amount of struggle?

What do you think the weight loss injections actually do, and do you not recognise that those on them are also doing all the usual things people who are trying to lose weight e.g. modify their eating, exercise etc? Does it not count that they're doing these things because it's made easier in some ways by the drug?

What types of weight loss support or tools are not 'cheating'? e.g. I used hypnosis once and it worked for a bit, to the point that I felt pretty much the same way I do with the injections i.e. reduction in food noise and compulsion to snack etc. It didn't last anything like as long, but it worked for a time - was that cheating?

Would it still be cheating if they weren't as effective as they are?

FWIW, I really couldn't care less if people think I'm cheating - who cares? Who does it impact only me and my bank balance? If someone said here, press this button and you'll be a healthy BMI overnight and stay there forever I'd press it with both hands and not give a shit about how anyone felt about it.

But it's just the logic of it that baffles me - I've never seen it as a competition and have never felt like getting to or being a healthy weight only counts if it's done in a certain way - I suppose I'm not much interested in what size anyone else is or what they do to get that way, so I can't imagine for a second ever thinking another person was 'cheating' - only ever being happy for them if they're happy and hopefully healthy too.

I understand about the regain concerns. I have them myself. But my thinking is, that's a nicer problem to have. I'd rather lose the weight in the first place and then have the worry about how I'm going to keep it off, than just stay where I was or even go up from there.

Also, I've finally got to experience what I think a normal relationship with food feels like - one that isn't obsessive or driven by constant intrusive cravings. I don't think I've ever felt quite so unbothered by it - whilst still enjoying what I have - in my entire life even childhood. So hopefully there's some learning gone on deep within my psyche about what's actually possible!

Yes, I am acutely and painfully aware of eating disorders aside from anorexia and bulimia. That was kind of my point - curing an eating disorder is extremely difficult. I would say, in my experience, it's impossible to do through therapy alone. But medication + therapy is a different matter. So taking the injections and also continuing with psychological support for the eating disorder is helpful.

However, many people blithely say on these threads 'oh you just need to get therapy to fix the underlying cause of your obesity' without any understanding of how hard that is and what it feels like when that therapy doesn't fix the cause at all.

I don't think that it's cheating and people should do whatever they want, but personally I would rather eat less than have stuff injected.

No.
Here's some of my plates for your critique. Oh master of thinness. I bow down!

And some more for good measure.

It’s interesting, isn’t it? I think there’s a cultural element that says thin = able to show restraint = morally superior whereas overweight = overindulgent/lazy = morally inferior — so there’s an element of resenting the fact that people who were overweight can now join the thin brigade without (so the narrative goes) fundamentally changing who they really are — that is, they’re still morally inferior at heart, but we can no longer tell just by looking at them. Does that make sense? (It’s not what I think btw!)

Yes, yes that’s what we do. We just live off of smaller number of donuts and maccy d’s.

FWIW, I really couldn't care less if people think I'm cheating - who cares?

So why the thread? If you don’t care that people think you’re cheating why would you want to hear their reasons why they think that? If you don’t care ignore and move on

I think it is more that it's not necessarily sustainable, AFAIK you're suppressing something that will likely come back after you stop, rather than working on permanently changing the related behaviour underlying it. Whereas to diet properly is much harder, you're fighting a lot of willpower and cravings.

I don't see it as cheating whatsoever, I do have concerns about supply availability for what the drugs were developed for (diabetics) and how sustainable it is long term.

It's great if they help people who have struggled in the past with weight loss. But that's only going to help long term if that person then addresses the issue in order to maintain a healthy weight.

The other concern I have is the secondary knock-on demand of the NHS with quick and lots of weight loss. Mainly the requirement of then needing skin removal surgery for a higher number of people and adding to the already massive waiting lists.

Do you not see the nuance, I also don’t give a shit, but find it fascinating why people would think this. The two are not mutually exclusive

I think it comes down to the fact that a lot of people think if you're overweight it's your own fault and therefore you must earn being a health weight by stopping your lazy greedy over eating ways. I paraphrase. I love how people say how they've managed to be a healthy weight all their lives on threads about weightloss which actually says loud and clear why they think this is a cheat. Its said to make the point that we lack the self control to do what they did and that this is our failing and our fault. It wouldn't need to be said if they didnt believe this.

And about 95% of people who go on a diet regain the weight and more. Dieting 'properly' is also not sustainable for the vast majority of people. Most obese people have extensive experience of dieting - including all the diets that pretend they aren't diets and that calling it 'a lifestyle change' or 'way of eating' makes it different.

Do you really think anyone decides to spend £150 a month on injections without even trying to lose weight a different way first? Do you think people get to obesity without ever attempting to lose weight along the way? Do you think they just wake up with a BMI of 30 and go 'oh better get injections!' with zero experience of battling willpower and cravings first??

It’s a great new innovation which I applaud for being good for the society and individuals who get permanent life changing results. However I do feel a bit left out in a sense that it suppresses hunger and removes the food noise which then allows individuals to make diet and exercise choices, whilst I have to make those life choices with constant non-stop temptations, resisting it to a point I want to scream, daily restrictions. I just want that noise to stop, but I can’t make it stop as the injections are not recommended for me since I’m not overweight. Even right now I’ve been fighting the temptation of buying a bag of crisps to top up my lunch so the food noise is constant and I hate it. So it’s not so much about caring what others do with their weight, for me it’s unfortunate I have no method of silencing the noise. I wouldn’t say any of this out loud to anyone using injections.

I think the drugs are great.

But I do think that some conversations around obesity on here misjudge 'food noise' and how it affects most people. Society is set up to bombard us with junk food, and it takes the vast majority of slim / medium sized people a lot of will power / exercise / hunger / self denial to avoid it. I spend an inordinate amount of time thinking about and craving food. But I don't give in to those cravings.

The point being that if you are obese, presumably you do 'give in' to those cravings a lot more often than the average slim person. We are literally all living in the same world surrounded by food noise.

So the moral argument has a basis, if you'll allow me to be devil's advocate. I've finished work for the day early and at home on my own. All I want to do is snuggle with crisps and watch telly but I'm going to haul myself to the gym instead and have a coffee afterwards. That is the hard option.

People tend to respect people who take hard options.

I mean, gluttony is literally one of the seven deadly sins so it's not a new societal thing.

It's a silly argument. If it works why not.

After all, if anyone can be slim now, how is it of any value?

Humans compete for status and we've just upended how easy it is to get a certain status. It's the same reason there were sumptuary laws to say who can wear what. It's the same reason people were fighting over bottles of Prime or paying silly money for them on eBay.

And in fairness, a lot of people have put a lot of work into being thin. It must feel a bit like someone just upended your jigsaw puzzle. Even if you didn't you felt special because you had the coveted thing. Scarcity drives perceived value.

So no judgement from you then huh.

Ah cross post with BurrosTail, same thing really.

More about obesity in general than the drugs and why obese people feel - and are judged negatively and as 'weak'.

Not everyone who’s fat eats junk you know.

You presume wrong. For many it is portion size. Not as they sit and eat crisps on the sofa.

surely no one is this ignorant of obesity? This is the second post about how fat people eat junk. It is shocking in its ignorance.

Thecoralshark- well it applies to portion size too. If I'm dishing up dinner for me and the kids, I have to put less on my plate than I really want, and drink water and fill up on veggies etc.

It's not an easy thing.

Do you think that people with depression should just go for a walk and cheer up as well?

"...but being overweight is something you can solve by eating less."

OMG!! is it really?!!? Wow, if only I'd known it was as simple as that!! 🙄

Some people...

It's pretty obvious you can get fat from eating too much of anything, 'healthy' or not.