Should everyone be forced to show they aren’t able to rescue a dog before they can buy a puppy?

[Coffeealwayshot]

Just that really

I see my local shelter is full again and saying they will need to euthanise if they can’t find homes.

Everyone I know (bar 2 or 3) who has a dog has bought from a breeder.

Im not rude enough to ask people if they considered a rescue. I know some say they were turned down but some that they just wanted a puppy or a specific breed.

So my question is as above?
I get we can’t say no breeding at all but should taking on a rescue be the only option for those who are suitable and reduce the breeding to just cater for those who can’t have a rescue dog?

I don’t read this as patronising at all. Purely correcting an apparently misunderstanding that you have to take, as you say, ‘what the rescue offer you.’ Nothing more, nothing less.

It’s not like ‘The Dog House’ on tv, you can visit, walk the dogs, wait, register your preferences and adopt a puppy or an adult dog.

I've had a few rescue dogs and every single one had some behavioural issues.

This ranges from extremely nervous around people to escape artist.
Even the 6 months old rescue pup I took in has had some pretty minor but very hard to correct issues like toilet training- took me 18 months to get to 8p% toilet trained. So no visits to Auntie Sarah or a cosy holiday cottage....
A rescue really isn't for everyone!

... the dogs I raised from puppies have no such issues.

This 💯

My dog had a very strong pray drive but used to stay with a sitter who got cats without me being aware, she panicked me when I was dropping him off, I thought he was going to kill them or they would rip him to shreds but he didn’t see her cats as something to chase, they lay with each other - afterwards he still chased every cat on the street. Later on we stayed in a holiday home with a kitten next door who was very curious about my dog, so I did what the sitter had done and I carefully introduced my dog to the kitten, he no longer was interested in chasing it and thankfully we left the house without incident. Still chased street cats afterwards.😂

These are animals we are considering, not crockery

Which surely means it's even more important that you pick the right one for your family and your situation as the impact if you don't can be pretty devastating?

We tried to get a rescue dog but like others, we didn't have enough experience. We'd had dogs as kids but not adults. Otherwise on paper, we were told we were perfect-no kids, husband retired, home owners, secure garden. We ended up getting a dog from a breeder.

Looks like there are something like 10 to 12 million dogs living in UK households. So you would need a pretty significant bureaucracy to set something like this up. I really couldn't imagine who could take on that role.

You've also got to imagine it would be pretty easy to game the system. Knock some holes in your fence, tell the shelter you'll be out at work all day everyday or just come across as generally negligent and, hey presto, they'll reject you and you'll have your permit to get a dog from a breeder.

I was going to say something like this. How much involvement do you want the government to have in your life and decisions?

Unless puppy breeding (not puppy farming) is outlawed then this is going to create a new layer of bureaucracy. It will probably make puppy farming even more common.

My dog absolutely ADORES other dogs. She loves playing with them. The happiness I see on her playing with dogs on the beach or on walks etc....I love to see it.

She's happy when she plays with me on walks or in the garden of course... but it's a totally different happy when she is playing with other dogs.

Even if I didn't go to the office those days per week I'd still send her to day care, because I can see it makes her happy.

And like you say - it's about making her happy.

Ha! That was my thought too!

We fostered a dog last summer and it was an absolute nightmare from hell.

For context, we already have a dog (from a puppy) of the same breed, and both are experienced dog owners; my husband in particular has vast experience with this specific breed. We both WFH permanently and were able to dedicate a tonne of time and resources to this foster dog, but his behaviour was out of control and, at the risk of sounding dramatic, it was probably the most stressful period we've ever been through.

We absolutely went into this with the intention of settling him in, then keeping him forever. It was such a heart breaking and disappointing chain of events, and it really unsettled our own dog. We had little to no support from the rescue throughout.

Before this, I'd have 100% encouraged people to rescue rather than shop, but now I don't think I could in good faith encourage a friend to do so without exercising extreme caution. My heart breaks for all the doggies in rescue, but they are all in rescue for a reason and it's just too risky IMO.

Some but not all

I am sorry that you had that experience but it is simply untrue to say "all dogs are in rescue for a reason". The "reason" is often nothing to do with the dog and everything to do with the previous owners (can't be arsed to look after it, have kids and then don't want the dog, can't afford it, it isn't a cute puppy anymore, they have replaced it with a cute puppy etc). I have no doubt there are some nightmare examples but for context, we have adopted 40 rescue dogs so far. Never had a problem yet.

You clearly dont know anything about puppies/ breeders /rescues. Youve come up with a hairbrained idea based on nothing but your feelings and are disbelieving of the people who are telling you why it wont work

1 you have to have experience to rescue a dog
2 most rescue centres wont allow dogs to go to homes with young children
3 administering this mad scheme is impossible
4 people like to raise and train a puppy so they can have as long a time as possible with it, and so they know its history
5 the person who breezily said "adopt a greyhound!" clearly has a large home. Many homes are not big enough to accommodate dogs over a certain size
6 personal factors like allergies and disabilities can rule out a lot of breeds

Want to add behavioural and medical issues, which are often the reasons they were given up to rescue centres in the first place

I often see posts of people saying ‘my dog can’t wait to go to day care or see their dog walker’ - failing to realise that a dog that really loves it owners doesn’t long to get away to daycare or the dog walker.

What a load of absolute tosh.

Nope. You clearly don’t know much about rescue dogs

1. you DO NOT need experience to rescue a dog. For some dogs, yes of course. But if you work with a reputable, decent rescue they will place a suitable dog in your home. Out of the 40 dogs I have adopted I would say half had no issues AT ALL. House trained, no aggression in any circumstances, good with people and other dogs, no separation anxiety, not destructive. Nothing. Just dogs that have been let down by people. They slotted into our life liked they had always been there, no problems. The other half had a variety of “issues” but nothing particularly difficult. Crap recall, fear of people, food aggression, resource guarding. All easily solved with time and a very small amount of effort. Far less effort than it would take to train a puppy from scratch.
2. there are rescues that will allow families to adopt young dogs with young children. You just have to make a bit of effort to find them
3. Don’t disagree that it would be hard to administer. Doesn’t mean we shouldn’t try to improve the current totally shit situation though.
4. Yes people are selfish. And honestly? Massively missing out. Giving a dog that has had a shit start in life a new life? Where it feels safe and can thrive? Is rewarding in ways I never imagined. Best thing ever
5. Lol! You’ve clearly never had greyhounds. I once had 4 in a very small house. Most of them don’t actually DO much! They are super lazy. An hour in a safe space to run around like loons everyday then they sleep the rest of the time, curled up into unfeasibly small balls. From experience, 4 can easily fit on a 3 seater couch. Not all obviously. But most.
6. Allergies? I’m sceptical about “hypo allergic” dogs and I have seen far, far, far too many dogs given up for supposed allergies (that actually were couldn’t be arsed to look after the dog. Believe me. You can tell the difference) Disabilities? Maybe? But I can’t see how an untrained puppy is going to be better in that situation?

You are right and I do feel we were a bit unlucky- a friend of ours has fostered 15+ and met the dog we had, and said she had never seen anything like it 😂

"Lol! You’ve clearly never had greyhounds. I once had 4 in a very small house. Most of them don’t actually DO much! They are super lazy. An hour in a safe space to run around like loons everyday then they sleep the rest of the time, curled up into unfeasibly small balls. From experience, 4 can easily fit on a 3 seater couch. Not all obviously. But most."

Ds1 and his wife have a rescue greyhound, who is the loveliest dog. He can curl up pretty small, but his preference is to have a whole sofa to himself, whilst the humans sit on the floor. His farts can make paint blister, though, and have been classified as a chemical weapon!

If we didn't have a cat, we would get a rescue greyhound.

I've had dogs all my life, I'd say it's been roughly 50/50 how many we had from a puppy and how many were older.
Non of the older ones were from organsised rescues due to overly strict adoption rules.
The last time I tried for nearly 2 years (and why I gave up on rescues as a viable option): 3 adults living in the property, no children. All working full time but with different shift times and days off - only one day in 7 would all 3 be working, when one of the adults was a carer working split shifts, and another worked from home full time (the third had the option to take the dog to work with them). Large fenced in garden both front and back including a sheltered outside area for bad weather. Large dog friendly park/field across the road. No holidays abroad, and holidays in the UK always included taking the dog/s with us.

Reasons we were given for being repeatedly turned down across about 5 different rescues:
everyone worked full time (didn't care that someone was home 99% of the time).
one of the 3 smoked (outside only).
the house was on a main road (ignoring the large front garden and that the dogs could be secured in the back garden without access to the front of the house).
we were inexperienced because we hadn't had a rescue dog before (one of the 3 had previously worked in a dog/cat quarantine centre, boarding kennels and training centre - all had cared for multiple pets for most/all their lives).
we lived in a 'high crime' area (we didn't but the council road around the corner had a poor reputation 30 years previously).
we had a pond (which was both fenced in, and had a safety grid).
health 'concerns' and an assumption that we would not provide enough exercise for a dog (this was a jab that 2/3 of us were overweight, 1 near retirement age).
we already had an elderly dog who would need too much attention.
later followed by 'we didn't have a companion dog' (we asked to adopt a bonded pair then, and was still refused).

While I understand the damage that a failed rescue placement can cause to the animal, unless things have changed drastically, too many rescues are looking for reasons to refuse - and won't entertain a placement with people who aren't perfect-on-paper.

I do know what you’re saying. However, my sister has a rescue dog and her life is really impacted. The dog can’t be around other dogs, has all sorts of other problems and is on antidepressants. My sister struggles to go on holiday because of no one to take the dog, etc.

It’s selfish, but I LOVE having a dog and my dog is a happy, settled and peaceful soul.

I don’t want the hard work associated with rescuing a dog, sadly. (I know not all rescues but a lot of them.)

Rescue dogs aren't always suitable as family pets, unfortunately.

This. Sadly a hell of a lot of dogs in rescues are poorly bred dogs with behavioural issues, trauma from neglect & maltreatment. They require incredibly careful support and training to become suitable as pets. Few are safe for homes with children.

Even where they can be safe, they can be a difficult and not pleasant pet that require a lot of work. You can't force people to take on the work of a difficult animal. Reality is they are not getting a dog because they want to rescue/help a dog, most people simply want a pet dog for the pleasant side of it - companionship etc. They will not want a challenging dog with lot of bad habits to be worked on.

Dog rescues needs to be seen as a separate function than the provision of pet animals. They exist for animal welfare and protection which is separate to breeding animals as pets.

"The "reason" is often nothing to do with the dog and everything to do with the previous owners (can't be arsed to look after it, have kids and then don't want the dog, can't afford it, it isn't a cute puppy anymore, they have replaced it with a cute puppy etc).

A pleasant, well trained adult dog with no expensive health needs is easy to sell or give away if you aren't able to care for it/can't afford etc. People want dogs! The ones people can't sell or give away there's almost always a reason - undesirable behaviours, ill health, high needs eg needs a lot of exercise or mental stimulation or becomes destructive, bad around other dogs, bad around children, separation anxiety etc. It can require a massive amount of work.

I own a rare breed the current incumbent is my third. I like them they suit my life style, I understand the breed, the breed society has a rescue group none ever come upon because 1. they are rare and 2. generally they are owned by breed knowledgeable enthusiasts people know what they are getting when they buy one. And because they are not bred by puppy farms but breed enthusiasts the breeders offer life time support and will take back any dog they’ve bred.
Im approaching 60 😟 I’ve was brought up with dogs I’ve owned other breeds of dog mainly gun dogs my friends all have a variety of dog breeds but I like my breed end of story I don’t want too and in fact wouldn’t rescue a dog if it wasn’t my breed.
So no one is going to “force” me to rescue a dog rather than buy a puppy of my chosen breed frankly Id rather not have a dog.

Yes, a small minority of dogs in rescue require intensive rehabilitation. But this is the exception rather than the rule.
As well as the 40 I have adopted myself, I am also a volunteer assessor. I visit dogs in their own home whose owners want to rehome them, because thankfully, a lot of people do not want to sell there dog or give it away. Rescues ask for this to be done so they know what kind of dog they are taking on and where to place it. Of the many, many assessments I have done, only one dog wasn’t suitable to be homed immediately.
The rest were, as I said, just unwanted primarily because they couldn’t be arsed to look after it. Oh, they give all kinds of reasons (dog is too excitable, which it is, but they never walk it so what do they expect. Alllergies, but unfortunately the child lets slip that they’ve got a new puppy so they don’t want the 7 yr old they’ve had all its life) So this trope about rescue dogs is just utter rubbish.

Oh and the most difficult dogs I’ve taken on? Ex breeding bitches. So for everyone saying “I want a KC registered, pure breed blah blah” do you ever think about the parents of the dog you buy? I know people are always advised to see the dog with its mother but I have to wonder how you actually know that the adult female dog you see is the mother of your puppy?
My ex breeders have all been from KC registered, “reputable” breeders, some of whom show and even judge at Crufts, their puppies sell for thousands. There is simply NO WAY that anyone ever met these dogs with their puppies because they were utterly traumatised, totally unhandled and you couldn’t touch them without them screaming and wetting themselves. It’s a fucking disgrace.

They have all recovered with a lot of time and patience but the reality is they spent literally years locked in crates, being used for money. THAT is the reality for a lot of breeding dogs.
And if you doubt me, have a look at Many Tears Dog Rescue. Literally hundreds of ex breeders on there, all of whom need rehab all of whom have made massive amounts of money for their “owners” but have never ever been walked or even been outside. It is shameful.