Am I or is school BU?

[SchoolProblemHelp]

Name changed for this as this situation is probably very recognisable to those who know me.

Having some issues with DD’s school at the moment and before I make a formal complaint want to know if I’m being an overprotective mum or if school is handling this wrong.

DD has Autism and Tourette’s Syndrome. Had lots of support in mainstream primary school, teacher’s aide, maths intervention as she is very behind in this, access to quiet area when overwhelmed, able to take time away when suffering tic attacks etc. All of this was provided at school monitoring level and so she has no EHCP in place and we are told she would not meet criteria for one as she was coping just fine with this support.

Went to high school this year and all of this support was withdrawn. New school say it was never a formal plan so no duty to provide it. Still claim she won’t meet EHCP level yet also don’t agree she needs school monitoring support she previously had.

Couple of recent incidents involve:

• Being given detention for not finishing Maths work despite asking and not receiving help (we are aware she is 12 months behind in Maths and in a mixed ability class so she found this above her level).
• Being given detention for walking out of lesson when suffering a tic attack as another child was laughing and imitating her tics back to her.
• Being made to stand up in class and read aloud and told off for ‘being silly’ when she starting ticking due to nerves by a teacher who apparently had not been informed she has Tourette’s.
• Being given behaviour points for ‘chewing gum’ despite it being known by the SEN team that one of her common tics is rolling her jaw as though she is chewing.
• Being given behaviour points for ‘throwing’ a pencil that flew out of her hand when her arm ticked. And when I raised this with the school being told it is her responsibility to inform the teacher at the time that this was in fact a tic, despite this meaning having to disclose her medical history in front of the whole class including children who bully her for this.

The cumulation of the above now means she’s been put on report and has to approach each teacher in very lesson to ask them to write on her report and take it to the head of year at the end of the day. Something she is very anxious about doing as her Autism means she struggles to approach people.

Am I expecting too much of a mainstream school or should school be resolving these issues and stop punishing a child for their disability. If I could get her an EHCP and move her I would in a heartbeat but to get an EHCP you have to show that the school intervention isn’t enough and it was, in primary, but now school won’t put the support in place.

I can't read the plan so cannot comment on it, sorry.

However I see they're going to let your DD use a Chromebook which sounds good.

I'm an ex maths teacher and the Sparx automatic homework is a nightmare for many students.

So in theory it adjusts to your level and as the teacher says there are videos and explanations to help you get the questions right.

We also as a department ran lunchtime "detentions" which were actually a teacher sitting there helping the students do their homework. It does mean that the homework gets done and it's not a meaningless punishment.

What specifically is the issue with the homework? Most parents solve this problem by either doing it with their child or letting their child cheat.

If you are going to stick to the letter of the rules then your child will end up in "detention" which is actually extra support each week and the teacher there can help her do her homework,

Can you ask if she can take her packed lunch into the "detention"? That's what most of our students did.

Oh, and print out her plan with the virtual exit pass so she has a physical one.

Several copies.

The plan in the email sounds really good OP, and nothing like what you outlined in your OP, is your issue that you don't feel it reflects reality? Because it looks like they're taking lots of reasonable steps. I am concerned that if you complain when all this stuff is actually being done for her, you're going to come across as "that parent" so you need to be really clear about what isn't happening in practice and what actionable steps (not special treatment) the school's teachers can realistically enact to enable her to meet the same outcomes as everyone else.

She does have an IEP in place but this is quite basic and also I have been advised by the SEN team “we can’t make the teachers read it”.

This underlines why what @FluffMagnet said in the very first reply, last night, about sending them an e-mail after any meeting or phone call, confirming what they said to you, is so helpful. It is absolutely shocking that the SENCo is suggesting this. Of course it should be highlighted to the teachers. That is something that should be raised as a complaint, if you can evidence it.

Yes, I know secondary teachers see a LOT of pupils, which is why it does seem like a good idea for her to carry a copy of the pass with her (even if it is you that has to print it out and laminate it) and also carry a copy of her 'One page Profile' and her IEP with her, to give to staff as she enters the room. Maybe with you writing in red at the top "DD has autism, so that makes it difficult for her to communicate her needs to you, verbally / in person, hence her handing this to each teacher until they get to know her better."

I'm sorry you are going through this. It shouldn't have to be a battle.

The way the snack shack works is each year group gets one day they can use it. Hers is Wednesday. The other days they must use the canteen. She won’t enter the canteen due to the noise levels so she currently only eats in school on Wednesday. I asked if she can use the snack shack on other days and they agreed but she is too scared to go there alone and they won’t allow her to take a friend so she continues to not eat in school except Wednesday.

Sparx is hell on earth!

They say it tailors it to your level but I can’t see how that is possible as it does not let you get a question wrong. It plays videos on how to solve the question on an endless loop until the child gets it right or gives up altogether. You can swap the question for another one but it gives you a question for the same area, e.g multiplication and if you don’t know that one either you are stuck.

That email saying they will apply for funding for a Chromebook was 4 months ago. We are still waiting.

The issue with sparx is that is doesn’t let you move on until the question is answered correctly. How can it possibly adjust to the students level if it never allows them to be wrong? It makes her watch videos over and over and eventually swaps the question for another one and the same area which when she also doesn’t know it repeats the process. I sat with her and after an hour she was still stuck on question 2 of 30. The other parents tell me they let their child use chat GBT to answer it but I worry that is simply masking her difficulties in maths and will allow the school to say she doesn’t need maths support.

And yes while she technically can take a packed lunch into detention she will not eat in front of people she isn’t very close to as her tics mean she can be a messy eater and she is bullied for this.

@MiraculousLadybug The plan is brilliant. The issue is that no teachers follow the plan and when I raise this I’m told they can’t make the teachers read it. If the plan was followed we wouldn’t be having a problem.

Ah right I'm with you. In which case yes definitely complain, that plan should be being followed. Definitely list what's not being done that is supposed to be happening in your complaint.

If the school has allowed DD to use the snack shack every day, they have probably also made the same reasonable adjustment for other DC. You could ask them to introduce DD to other pupils who they allow to attend every day.

People not reading the stuff that others have worked hard to create and upload/share is the bane of my life.

I'd be attaching it to every email to every teacher for the foreseeable future. And screenshotting any particularly relevant paragraphs in relation to particular points I needed to make and taking a printed copy for every teacher I was booked to see on Parents' Evening if that hasn't happened yet.

This was something we specifically asked for and the fact she was turned away 3 times as it wasn’t communicated to the staff at the snack shack makes me think it’s not a common thing they do. But regardless introducing her to someone else isn’t going to remove the fear of her going without a trusted person. Her plan specifically mentions another child that she needs to sit next to in lessons (who she knows from primary) as she finds it impossible to speak up when anxious but it seems this adjustment doesn’t seem important outside of the classroom according to the school so without someone well known to her she isn’t going to go. She would rather not eat. She’s a messy eater due to her tics and she’s been horrendously bullied for this. She simply isn’t going to risk eating in front of someone she doesn’t trust 1000%.

DD needs other support rather than a reliance on one other child in and out of lessons. What if that pupil is off unwell, on a trip, doing something else in school, at a club, is with another pupil DD doesn’t want to mix with, they fall out… What happens when they are set/choose options and the child is in another class? I am not diminishing DD’s needs but a reliance on one child isn’t a useful or reasonable solution long term.

I couldn’t read the plan because the photograph is blurry.

If the snack shack wouldn’t work at all, and it wouldn’t if it was only reliant on another pupil and the fact DD would still be eating in front of others she doesn’t know unless it is a series of smaller rooms within the snack shack, can you ask about somewhere else DD could eat? DD won’t be the only child who finds the canteen overwhelming, if these other pupils aren’t eating in the snack shack, find out where they are eating.

I absolutely agree. But when the school can’t / won’t put this support in place there isn’t really an option. I have said many times if I was the parent of the other child I wouldn’t be happy that she’s being relied on to care for her friend but that’s what the school put in her plan as an alternative to them providing this support.

When I bring up things such as the canteen being overwhelming and asking for solutions they act like they have never heard this before and it’s unique to DD. I find that hard to believe but they are not proposing solutions so we are coming up with suggestions to have them denied or not be adhered to.

This school has a reputation (we found out recently) for managing out pupils with SEN and maintaining their excellent exam results (the best in the area) so perhaps it is the case that they haven’t done this before as the children who need this provision have left the school. It’s a heavily oversubscribed school and people move into the area to attend this school (I blame the fact a famous person went there) but they do have a very low proportion of children on free school meals, from ethnic minorities, on the SEN register etc. so they seem to cherry pick pupils.

This is why you need to request an EHCNA yourself. As well as formally complain and remind the school they have a duty under the Children and Families Act 2014 to make their best endeavours to meet DD’s SEN and they must also make reasonable adjustments under the Equality Act 2010. To not do so is discrimination.

Is DD under CAMHS &/or paeds? Has she had SALT and OT assessments?

@BrightYellowTrain She is on a waiting list for CAHMS, she is under both community paediatrics for the ASD and seen by paediatric neurology also who diagnosed the Tourette’s.

No SALT involved but she has no speech issues, other than her reluctance and no OH review no. We asked school for an Ed Pysch review but was told this was only done as part of an EHCP process and she doesn’t meet criteria.

Her attendance this year is just below 70% as we are dealing with school refusal more and more due these ongoing issues. Plus when she’s very anxious she gets pretty severe tic attacks which result in migraines afterwards so she misses a lot of school with migraines. They don’t appear concerned about this and keep recording it as authorised absence to ensure it doesn’t flag up for fines etc.

Even the neurologist has commented on the vast difference between her tic severity and frequency during school term compared to the summer holidays and has wrote to the school to suggest strategies to help this - reducing stress / anxiety etc. The response from school was that for a child like her school is always going to be a stressful place and they can’t minimise that any further.

I’ve submitted a formal complaint today and will look into applying for an EHCP. I do feel that she probably doesn’t need this however as she coped just fine in primary school without it and if only the school actually followed their own plan she wouldn’t be having the issues she is having.

If there’s any chance you have in writing the ‘we can’t make them read it’ comment send that to governors.

in any case there should be a governor who is responsible for send and this is definitely an issue; that attitude (as a teacher) is shocking. They can make them read it and teachers should read them as part of their everyday responsibilities

Ignore the school. DD does meet the legal threshold for an EHCNA. Sadly, it isn’t uncommon for schools and LAs to incorrect tell parents their DC don’t need or won’t get an EHCP.

Just because DD coped fine in primary, with a lot of support that wouldn’t be typical in a state MS school, doesn’t mean she now doesn’t need an EHCP. It isn’t uncommon for DC, especially autistic girls, to appear to cope in primary and have the wheels fall off in secondary when the support in primary can’t be continued in secondary. Primary schools fail these pupils by not legally formalising the support. Secondary is a completely different environment. There are far more demands - social and academic. DD would still benefit from an EHCP even if all the support she received in secondary could be provided without an EHCP.

Schools have limited EP time. EP assessments outwith the EHCNA process aren’t very common these days, especially when the pupil is not displaying VCB.

No SALT involved but she has no speech issues, other than her reluctance

The scope of what SALT can support is more than the physical ability to speak. The difficulties you describe are within SALT’s remit. They can help with ASD related difficulties, social communication and interaction, selective mutism, emotional regulation…

Look at OT too. Not all ICBs commission sensory OT, but if your area does, it is worth a referral. In some areas, you can self refer.

If you request an EHCNA and the LA agrees to assess/are forced to assess by SENDIST, SALT and OT assessments can be included in the EHCNA even if DD doesn’t mean the criteria for a referral to the normal NHS services. An EHCNA can also include an assessment by a psychiatrist &/or clinical psychologist without the need to sit on the normal waiting lists. And an EHCP can include ongoing therapies.

Apply for an EHCNA needs assessment. Be prepared for them to say no and then for you to appeal and win. That is standard LA practice.... Once you get the needs assessment agreed, ed psych have to do an assessment which will help.

Start emailing every time her plan is not followed. Email the subject teacher and cc in the Sendco. I often hear parents say " but I don't want to be that parent" - but if you don't advocate for your child, no-one else will. If things don't improve, put in a formal complaint that they are not following her learning plan. The emails are part of building the evidence that the current plan is not being followed or not working.

Be clear in your emails that getting detention for being disabled is not acceptable and in breach of their legal responsibilities.

Is the communication difficulty to the point where it may be considered to be selective mutism? If so, bring this up with the consultant and ask for more support.

The school are not doing what they should - this may be individual teachers, or the Sen department, or it may be a top down attitude from senior leaders. Understanding where this comes from can help but ultimately if the relationship breaks down to the point that school is doing more harm than good, look around for a better option....

@LottieMary I do yes. The way it was explained in the email was that the teachers were given time as part of the inset day to read the plans but that the system went down and there were not able to access them. As such they are now expected to read them in their own time and as it’s their own time they can’t make them do so.

Sparks maths is the devil. My daughter has a visual processing disorder and short term memory issues. I help with her maths, not doing it for her and kept feeding back about 100% requirements. Our school have recently changed it to 1 hour instead of 100%, but DD has been given 30 minutes. I am in regular contact with her maths teacher, DD doesn’t know I have told the teacher more than once that she cries over her maths. After the last email, we were told their mental health is more important, DD said this is all because of me?

Arm yourself with this https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/5a7dcb85ed915d2ac884d995/SEND_Code_of_Practice_January_2015.pdf

She does have an IEP in place but this is quite basic and also I have been advised by the SEN team “we can’t make the teachers read it”.

There is an obligation on teachers -see 6.17 in the document.

And also in the Teaching Standards (5)

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/61b73d6c8fa8f50384489c9a/Teachers__Standards_Dec_2021.pdf

@handmademitlove I would call it selective mutism yes, others may disagree. But she sat in lesson while another child ripped her pencil case, cut a chunk of her hair and stabbed her in the back of the hand with a compass and didn’t alert the teacher to what was happening as she was more scared of speaking up then what was happening to her. I feel like when I’m telling school these things they diminish it as her not helping herself but to me it’s more than that, she physically can’t in those situations.

Xmasday2024
" .Also I think your child is milking the situation a bit, I mean 'I threw a pencil because my hand slipped.' "

Such ignorance displayed here.

@AuditAngel Glad someone else has experience of the hell that is Sparx! When the teacher emails saying it adjusts to the student it makes me feel like they’ve never even used it themselves! On what planet is demanding 100% correct answers and giving detention for failing to do so acceptable!