Flu vaccination - why bother to get consent? (edited by MNHQ at request of the OP)

[Emeraldiisland]

My DS received the flu vaccine at school today without consent. My phone is rubbish and can't scan QR codes which is how the school ask you to give consent.
My fault partly as I did mean to mention it but kept forgetting.
Anyway picked him up just now and was told he'd had the vaccine, I said don't you need consent and they said I didn't not give consent. I just wonder why they ask for consent if they're going to do it anyway.
For all they know he might have had a vaccine at the doctors.
I don't want to be that parent but shouldn't they get consent? Or is it okay because I didn't not get consent?
On this occasion it doesn't matter but what if it was something I didn't want him to have?

How old is ds. I know with teenagers (might have to be 16) it's ultimately their decision, I also know they can refuse if they want

How old is your DS? If he's secondary school age they might have treated him as able to consent for himself, given that you had not expressly refused consent.

Given the OP picked the kid up from school and had a conversation with the teacher about it, I assume primary age, this would be unusual in secondary!

OP this is serious, they have messed up big time. As you say it’s actually worked in your favour as you wanted it to be done just didn’t get round to consenting, but for some children there might be valid reasons eg allergies for not wanting it. I’m surprised this happened; I’m a teacher and the process for kids having it in school means both school staff and medical staff check carefully to make sure they get the right children in front of them, and that any who haven’t consented are identified and not given the vaccine. Clearly at this school something needs changing to make sure this doesn’t happen again so I would raise it with them.

He's only 4 and he's non verbal so no way he could have consented or understood.
I think I will ask what the process is as I think something has gone wrong here. It's as if they just wanted to get all the kids vaccinated and as has been said what if something went wrong.

They can't do an opt out process for vaccines,. Thankfully he hadn't a serious allergy.

This is a very very serious issue and really can't be let stand.

Ok, well then that is a clear failure of process by the school.

There should be a clear process for providing consent if you cannot access the QR code and use the internet to respond to the consent request. That's also a failing in this process.

This is it ^

They fucked up and I’d want them to investigate why this happened and how

This shouldn’t have happened and could actually be life threatening for children with allergies or other medical reasons for not getting vaccinations. Thankfully all ok on this occasion but I would definitely address it so that they can change their processes for the future.

Yes they need consent. They should have made contact with you if you hadn't responded. They definitely shouldnt have proceeded because you hadnt not consented!! Their procedures or training is very poor. I definitely would raise it as they don't feel there is an issue and this could have serious consequences on another day.

I am 100% pro vaccine, but this would be a big problem for me. They should dhave actively sought consent from you.

With many things in our area now the NHS are asking that parents 'opt out' if they do not give consent so consent is presumed unless you indicate otherwise. Previously we had a lot of parents not responding to requests for signatures etc but then complaining that their child did not receive vaccine/eye test/fluoride varnishing...delete as appropriate.
Maybe double check the info shared is not similar, you only co race to opt out.

That’s terrible. They can’t do that and for all they know he is allergic to it.

i forgot to do the consent one year and my children weren’t vaccinated because I hadn’t completed the form. They weren’t just vaccinated anyway. I would seriously raise hell over it because it could be really dangerous.

You can’t change to passive consent for vaccinations. They have ingredients that some are allergic to.

As you say yourself...

My fault partly as I did mean to mention it but kept forgetting.

So both at fault.

School for using a system to contact parents when not everyone has access to it.
Is that their only way of contacting you with regardsthis type of thing?

You...To keep forgetting to mention it, especially when you know your phone can't scan codes and that's their chosen method of contact, you should have made it a priority to discuss it with their teacher.

The vaccine would almost certainly been administered by staff from the community healthcare trust. I believe that they are the ones at fault here. You could try contacting PALS for the community trust where the school is?

It should still be the case that if they haven't received consent, they don't give the vaccine though. It really shouldn't be "oh this parent didn't respond, well we'll just do it anyway."

My DC have had all their vaccines, and always have their flu jabs, but I wouldn't be happy with this at all.

Was it not use QR code to opt out or did you have to specifically have to opt in?

If the latter then it needs to be spoken about. You also need to be more on the ball next time with it as you can't trust the process anymore

I don’t understand how the nurse would have let this happen. Our schools nurse has the consent forms in front of her (either paper or online) and checks there’s one for the child she’s about to vaccinate. No child should be given a vaccine without consent, as others have said they could be allergic. I would be asking the school how this happened and, if you can, the details of the schools nurse team to query with them.

DS is due his today. I've given consent for it. However I've verbally withdrawn consent this morning due to being advised by a HCP not to have it as he's due a minor op next week. DS is old enough and assertive enough to verbalise this (though only 10). I said any problems contact the office or tell them to ring me.

I expect this to be respected.

Without positive consent they shouldn't allow it. And consent cancelled be removed at any point.

My brother didn't have a number of vaccines due to allergies.

I'm probably vaccine but there are circumstances where you shouldn't have one.

A failure to do so is a safeguarding failure. Raise hell with the school. It's not ok.

100% this. It is an absolutely fuck up on their part. I'm not anti vax by any means, however there are all kinds of shit in them, and how dare they put that into a little boy's body (particularly as he's non verbal so more vulnerable than others) without your consent. How dare they. I'm angry on your behalf. Don't let it lie.

No, that's not right - you need to opt-in not opt-out!

My DSes are older, but when I didn't give permission, they did ask him if they should call me (we'd already had a chat and decided to skip the flu vaccine this year for various reasons)

You definitely need to raise this with the school. They shouldn't be vaccinating without express consent from parents/guardians.

My niece nearly died after having an adverse reaction to a meningitis vaccine. It's not at all OK for them to have gone ahead without your say so.

It's not your fault at all OP - it would be your fault if you wanted the vaccine and then your son didn't get it because you hadn't consented - but in this case it never should have been given as they didn't have consent. It's really bad OP and i can't believe they are making it somehow your fault. Really bad. They cannot give the vaccine without consent.

From the gov website:

Yes, the (flu) vaccination is not mandatory. Parents will need to give their informed consent for the vaccination.
The nasal flu vaccine contains a highly processed form of gelatine (derived from pigs). For those who may not accept the use of porcine gelatine in medical products, an alternative injectable vaccine is available. Parents should discuss their options with their nurse or doctor.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/flu-immunisation-for-early-years-settings-including-child-minders/immunising-pre-school-children-against-flu

I can't agree with this. The school simply cannot do vaccinations or routine medications without explicit parental consent. The "system" they used of not not consenting is simply lazy and inadequate. Not all parents can be contacted via text, for example. The onus is very much on the school to operate a reliable way of doing this. I would raise merry hell about this - not just with the school but higher up.

Non consent is NOT consent.