'Females.'

[Toenailz]

Anyone else cringe when people refer to women as 'females' in the context of completely casual conversation? And also wonder where the fuck it started and why it's become so popular?

Usually utilised by men referring to women as 'females' and, on here, usually by scorned women referring to another woman that their DH is being in some way inappropriate with, as 'another female' or 'a female'.

Yeah yeah, the correct biological terms and all, but can't help feeling this has a rather sexist connotation to reduce women to less, as usual?

I hate it, YANBU! Female what?

Maybe the men who use it in dating terms aren't fussy about species as long as it is the opposite sex.

"Oh you mean female human, I'm sure there's a word for that, I wondered what you meant for a minute." 🙄

What did he say when you corrected him?

I’ve also never liked it but couldn’t put my finger on why. @IsANameImportant and @Jasmine82 sum it up perfectly for me.

I call other animals male or female, humans men and women

At the end of the day the whole gender ideology trend is rapidly losing steam.. Look at the backlash in the USA alone. They are trying all they can to stay relevant.
Young teens and adults no longer use pronouns as it's "cringe" & "embarrassing". My teen said only middle aged politicians use pronouns now!

Yes, but it's all about context.

Presumably, you have friends of the same species as you, but would you ever refer to them in - passing or directly - as 'humans'?! Surely you would say 'people' or 'folks' or similar? Even though describing them as 'humans' is 100% technically correct?

We've been forced to use the word female a lot more because of the crazies who insist that the word woman includes males with gender identity issues.

I'm not forced to use it, I've always used it.

It’s definitely not a new thing because my dad said it in the eighties and it made me cringe then. It was like he couldn’t bring himself to say ‘woman’ or ‘women’ as those word were a bit scary. He would often say ‘girl’ instead of woman as well.

I think it hugely depends on the context and the way in which it's framed.

A bit like the words 'love' and 'mate' when used as terms of address - they can be said kindly to convey your genuine respect and warm feelings towards somebody; or otherwise potentially in a really threatening, aggressive way.

Me too! It's a great word! There is a general election in Ireland this week & this is the only party opposing gender ideology. They use the word female a lot

Yes, this. “Woman” is a noun, and “female”, is an adjective.

When David Attenborough says “the female”, the noun “lion” (or whatever) is omitted and understood.

Hence “adult female human” would be the correct construction of the term used to differentiate actual female women from people who claim to be women, but aren’t.

Not if you have a reasonable command of the English language. Using an adjective to describe a group of people is dehumanising.

Have a little think of how language has changed around (for example) race and disability and you will see what I mean.

I remember my fellow high school boys calling girls females >50 years ago. They thought it was clever in some way.

And I suppose we were incels!

Genuine question: if “woman” now is intepreted by some people to mean “any human adult, male or female, who feels like a woman on that given day” [whatever the hell that means - but it obviously means something to them!], then is there another courteous and non-misogynistic word besides “female” that I can use if I want to make it very clear that I am referring to “human females, excluding males, regardless of how such males may identify” ?

(Loving your username!)

I popped back to make this very point ‐'woman' is definitely used as a derogatory definer or even a slur.

In the mouths of some, 'woman' debases the subject, and conjures sexed physicality: it implies unattractiveness and someone who is not deserving of being referred to with the implied 'respect' of terms such as ladies.

And absolutely yes to 'women' as a singular!?
I've been on the verge of posting about this so many times but predicted I'd be told to fuck off to Pedants' Corner. Thank you for raising it.

My sister pulled him up on it and he didn’t say anything in response 🤷🏻‍♀️

Yes, this is the point I'm making. I think many men do it because they somehow feel like woman or women conferrs something they feel is derogatory. It's nuts.

I sometimes use it in the discussion of feminist issues when I need clarity about who I mean - so that's mainly written and online. In real life anyone using it sounds like Quark being full-on Ferengi.

I would much prefer to be called female rather than "CIS woman" which Trans Activists insist on using

Do you refer to men as males? Eg “there was a group of males in the pub” - this thread isn’t about how many sexes there are, it’s about women being grouped together as “females” sounding a bit creepy

But that’s because of the obvious history of oppression. We also have Barack Obama as the “first black president”, for example. It all depends on the oppressor vs. the oppressed. In an ideal world there would be no distinctions, but in an ideal world one group wouldn’t be constantly oppressing the other either.

I suppose it all depends on your views. I don’t love being referred to as a cis-woman but I’d take it over female any day of the week because I see incels as more harmful than trans people. But that’s all dependent on personal views and experiences.

(I’m aware that, being MN, this post will likely have several responses about trans people, which I will politely ignore as the thread doesn’t need derailing.)

That's not the point I'm making, though. I'm just saying that "Kamala hoped to become the first female president" is how the English language normally works, and what could have been expected to be heard.

It's not really the same as with Obama, as black is an adjective and therefore used in a standard, correct way. Not a perfect equivalent, but this is a bit like if people had described him as 'the first black-man president'. It would sound very much like the speaker was patronising, racist and/or both.

I don’t think language-mangling to address language-mangling is helpful. Although I do use “female woman” where it’s necessary to be absolutely clear, in the hope that the tautology might make some people think.

@TheHangingGardensOfBasildon I see what you mean. Yes, in that context “female” would be preferable as it’s used as an adjective and not a noun. I take issue with it when used as a noun.