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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

I’ve had no cooker for 10 weeks -social housing issue

101 replies

Rokuandice · 19/11/2024 15:53

does anyone have any knowledge of cooker installation and or council housing repairs please? My South London council has left me unable to cook for more than 2 months now and refusing to assist. AIBU to think they should help?
My last cooker had one of those glass lids that you lift up for when hob was in use. Because it lifted up against the wall, I never really thought about what was behind the lid when cooking. However, the oven broke at the end of August and so it was time to order a replacement. Ordered a similar but without the glass lid (none of the ones for sale had one) with a major UK retailer/installer. I then received an email from them requesting that I check there were no sockets, plastics, combustible anything within ‘the hot zone’. If there were they would not be able to install due to fire safety I presume.
on checking I had a switched plug socket and separate plastic trunking both within the hot zone area. I postponed delivery and requested a repair from the council. Three weeks and many phone calls to them later ( as they’d messed the paperwork up) an electrician came out. He moved the socket but his manager told him that he was not allowed to move the plastic trunking/live wires as the council no longer chase cable into walls. I was told it would be safe as the plastic should be heatproof. A few days later of course the cooker was delivered and the installer took one look at the trunking on the wall and refused to install - it is located 25cm above the large back burner. He said even if I managed to find a cooker with a glass lid again, installation would be refused due to hot zone regulation. I’ve checked and this is standard across all the UK retailers.
the council repairs team have been awful. They’ve closed the repair request due to it being considered ‘decorative’ - they definitely think IBU. Electrics are way beyond my DIY. No local tradesman is getting back to me and besides, my Tenancy agreement says that moving electrical sockets etc is a no no in their property
so far I’ve reached out to the Town Hall/ lead Councillor - I was then told that the council were required to reply to him formally within 10 days - no response 22 days later and I’m just being told to wait.
I put in a formal complaint - no response
i contacted my MP - she’ll get back to me within 20 days (automated response)
my diet has gone haywire. I’m stressed, upset and dreading not being able to cook at Christmas when my child is home from uni…. Thank you to anyone who managed to read all this. I hate having to think about it - so boring I know - but really so stressful for me .. any advice mumsnetters?AIBU that I should be able to cook at home?

OP posts:
Oniya · 19/11/2024 20:38

That’s ridiculous OP, what a pain in the arse.

It seems the Council are not compliant with new fire regs? Given some Council’s shitty performance on this and the recent court case around Grenfell I would be throwing “major fire risk and breach of current safety regulations” around a lot in your complaints.

JenniferBooth · 19/11/2024 20:40

Oniya · 19/11/2024 20:38

That’s ridiculous OP, what a pain in the arse.

It seems the Council are not compliant with new fire regs? Given some Council’s shitty performance on this and the recent court case around Grenfell I would be throwing “major fire risk and breach of current safety regulations” around a lot in your complaints.

Edited

Im willing to lay money on the absolute hypocrites doing the same to the OP when they first contacted her about fitting her new front door!

Rokuandice · 19/11/2024 21:02

Oniya · 19/11/2024 20:38

That’s ridiculous OP, what a pain in the arse.

It seems the Council are not compliant with new fire regs? Given some Council’s shitty performance on this and the recent court case around Grenfell I would be throwing “major fire risk and breach of current safety regulations” around a lot in your complaints.

Edited

to be honest, I have a hunch now that this legislation (or whatever it is ), pre-dates GF. I recall a workman commenting on the socket around a decade ago - he said it would need to come out - but didn’t do so. I never thought anymore of it until now. The socket is now moved - it’s just the cable/trunking that’s a problem now

OP posts:
WiddlinDiddlin · 19/11/2024 21:03

Notmycircusnotmyotter · 19/11/2024 20:31

Why should they? Buy your own cooker like everyone else

You could try reading the thread.

Then you'd discover that she has bought her own cooker, like everyone else.

No cooker can be installed in the existing and only spot available for a cooker. Read the thread to discover why.

@Rokuandice Air fryers are not.. and don't, it is a stupid name. They are mini convection ovens. Just get one, honestly. We got rid of our oven we use the airfryer all the time, and a portable hob when needed.

Rokuandice · 19/11/2024 21:04

JenniferBooth · 19/11/2024 20:40

Im willing to lay money on the absolute hypocrites doing the same to the OP when they first contacted her about fitting her new front door!

Would you believe, the communal windows on the landings have all been screwed shut for around 10 years. Luckily they’re replacing them imminently!

OP posts:
CoffeeCup14 · 19/11/2024 21:10

It may be that your situation falls in a gap between automatic routes for solving the problem. It's not a repair as such, so can't be reported as a repair. The cooker is your responsibility rather than your landlord's. And, in my understanding, houses have to be built according to the regs at the time but don't necessarily have to be updated when the regs are (I don't know the specifics around this and it's possible this doesn't apply to everything).. So your issue could just get lost because it's not a straightforward part of anyone's job.

And sometimes the law just doesn't provide for what you would expect it to. Does it actually require them to provide you with a connection for a cooker? You'd also need to look at your tenancy agreement to see what that says.

You need legal advice from someone like Shelter to be clear on whether the landlord is legally required to update the wiring or if it's your responsibility. It can be quite complicated to understand exactly what is covered and someone who knows what they are talking about will be able to help you. Yes, they are dealing with lots of very difficult cases but you also need help. Social housing law is quite a niche area.

As a disclaimer, I used to be a housing officer at a housing association and I used to know quite a bit about social housing law. I've forgotten a lot of specifics, but I do remember that it was very complicated and surprising, and also that the systems could make it really hard to get things done outside of standard requests.

I really hope you are able to get your cooker installed soon, without much difficulty or additional expense.

Rokuandice · 19/11/2024 21:11

WiddlinDiddlin · 19/11/2024 21:03

You could try reading the thread.

Then you'd discover that she has bought her own cooker, like everyone else.

No cooker can be installed in the existing and only spot available for a cooker. Read the thread to discover why.

@Rokuandice Air fryers are not.. and don't, it is a stupid name. They are mini convection ovens. Just get one, honestly. We got rid of our oven we use the airfryer all the time, and a portable hob when needed.

I think I may have to give this some serious thought with current council shenanigans. .. I just can’t imagine how I woulD produce some of the dishes I hear can be cooked in them. Annoyingly, if I replace the cooker gap with a cupboard, I’m going to have to replace the whole stretch of work surface as there’s cupboards either side. I just want my cooker :(

OP posts:
JenniferBooth · 19/11/2024 21:25

Rokuandice · 19/11/2024 21:04

Would you believe, the communal windows on the landings have all been screwed shut for around 10 years. Luckily they’re replacing them imminently!

oh yes i do believe it.

breaches in fire regulations only matter when its tenants breaking them!

ForgettingMeNot · 19/11/2024 21:32

OP an air fryer is really a mini oven.

Anothercoffeeafter3 · 19/11/2024 21:59

We have multiple sockets in the "hot zone" they don't meet modern regs (but neither does the rest of the house). We own but I just ordered a cooker from AO and booked an electrician (Facebook post) who commented on it and connected the cooker. I would try the same IP

Chan9eusername · 19/11/2024 23:44

Send a letter to the legal department at the council notifying them of your intention to take legal action against their housing department for failure to adhere to current safety regulations & failure to maintain the property, fixtures & fittings.

If you can possibly the attend council offices in person do. Its very difficult to ignore someone who's standing right there.

Longtimelurkerfinallyposts · 20/11/2024 00:15

if we knew which council you were dealing with we might be able to recommend local lawyers/ law centres with expertise of cases like this. Also housing action groups who are used to taking collective action to support tenants with problems like these.

Do you have a housing officer? What have they said?
Do they have an office that they work out of? I'd be tempted to go there and make a fuss - ask to speak to them, ask to speak to their manager. Tell them you have nothing to cook on, and this needs sorted out, and you'll be staying there all day long until they work out a solution. Set up an open fire/ barbecue to cook on just outside the office to make your point.
Put up posters -on your block, their office, in the building where council and committee meetings happen.
Contact every single councillor for your ward, every day. Get back to the 'top' person you were in touch with and remind them that it's been 22 days. Speak to your local fire brigade and get them to put pressure on the council (as it won't just be your flat that's now non-compliant).
It's great that you've contacted the Guardian/ Observer. Private Eye might cover this story as well - which might embarrass the council into action

Good luck!

Bazinga007 · 20/11/2024 00:58

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Reugny · 20/11/2024 01:40

OP ignore the trolls

The reason to highlight your disabilities is because the council don't think you are vulnerable. So not being able to cook on a cooker is OK as you aren't vulnerable.

Reugny · 20/11/2024 01:44

@Oniya good point.

OP mention Grenfell in your correspondence with people if you live in a flat. In addition to pointing out other flats won't be compliant as PP have said.

I know a council has got in trouble with the ombudsman this year for not installing fire alarms and smoke detectors in all their flats. They then spent the summer and autumn installing them.

nunsflipflop · 20/11/2024 02:45

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

The socket has been moved, it is now the trunking that needs to be made safe. As the OP lives in a local authority property it is their responsibility to make safe a dwelling for basic needs, such as cooking a meal. If the OP did it herself and it caused damage or a fire, they would be held responsible.

Who wipes your arse? They need to wipe your mouth too!

WiddlinDiddlin · 20/11/2024 04:09

Rokuandice · 19/11/2024 21:11

I think I may have to give this some serious thought with current council shenanigans. .. I just can’t imagine how I woulD produce some of the dishes I hear can be cooked in them. Annoyingly, if I replace the cooker gap with a cupboard, I’m going to have to replace the whole stretch of work surface as there’s cupboards either side. I just want my cooker :(

We have had to do that, yes. It does take a bit of research and getting your head around doing things in a new order/new processes.

We have two airfryers a combi microwave/convection oven and a portable two ring hob.

One air fryer is a dual draw jobby, the other is a two lids to choose from, one does air fry, one does pressure cook/slow cook.

So between those (the dual drawer job lives out on the counter all the time, the microwave has its own slot, everything else goes away in one cupboard between uses) we batch cook loads of stuff.

I invested in a big set of glass dishes with cliplock plastic lids so they can go from freezer to micro or airfryer. (If you're better at remembering to defrost things you can just get metal trays or throwaway foil trays which go straight in teh airfryer)

We do the saute then casserole type things in the instapot slow cooker/airfryer, so bolognese, shepherds pie, chilli etc..

Spud can be done either on the hob or in the instapot once the meat is done, for the cottage pies/shepherds pies.

You can saute and casserole in most airfryers as long as you can take the little plate out of the bottom that raises things off the bottom of the pan/drawer, so we do that sometimes and do big batches of fried onions or roasted veg.

I also do anything id fry that really wants an extractor fan if you were to do it in a pan as we now don't have one... so burgers and steaks come out really good and no stinky kitchen!

If we didn't batch cook AND need an airfryer I can use by myself (I can't use the pot style ones only the drawer style as using a wheelchair, I am too low down to reach in over the top of it), we'd just have the drawer style I think, but DP does like to slow cook big vats of chilli and curry.

My favourite thing at the minute is egg fried rice, reheated - so when we get a chinese takeaway we buy extra egg fried rice. Fridge it, freeze it til we need it once its cool. Then when defrosted it goes in the preheated airfryer drawer (straight in, no dish, crisper plate taken out)... get it properly hot, super hot so its safe.. then wang in whatever veg, cooked meat or meat substitute we want. Lovely! It means its worth it to buy a chinese takeaway (I only eat the egg fried rice, nothing else) and we can use up left over and sad veg, veggie sausages etc lingering in the fridge.

Makingchocolatecake · 21/11/2024 17:42

Buy an air fryer

Oblomov24 · 21/11/2024 18:02

Sorry to hear this, hope you can get some resolution. This is disgraceful from council, lack of response to complaint, mp 20 days. All of them!

Rokuandice · 21/11/2024 20:52

CoffeeCup14 · 19/11/2024 21:10

It may be that your situation falls in a gap between automatic routes for solving the problem. It's not a repair as such, so can't be reported as a repair. The cooker is your responsibility rather than your landlord's. And, in my understanding, houses have to be built according to the regs at the time but don't necessarily have to be updated when the regs are (I don't know the specifics around this and it's possible this doesn't apply to everything).. So your issue could just get lost because it's not a straightforward part of anyone's job.

And sometimes the law just doesn't provide for what you would expect it to. Does it actually require them to provide you with a connection for a cooker? You'd also need to look at your tenancy agreement to see what that says.

You need legal advice from someone like Shelter to be clear on whether the landlord is legally required to update the wiring or if it's your responsibility. It can be quite complicated to understand exactly what is covered and someone who knows what they are talking about will be able to help you. Yes, they are dealing with lots of very difficult cases but you also need help. Social housing law is quite a niche area.

As a disclaimer, I used to be a housing officer at a housing association and I used to know quite a bit about social housing law. I've forgotten a lot of specifics, but I do remember that it was very complicated and surprising, and also that the systems could make it really hard to get things done outside of standard requests.

I really hope you are able to get your cooker installed soon, without much difficulty or additional expense.

Thank you for taking the time to write this - I fear you may be right about this being a grey area.
My tenancy agreement does say that the landlord is responsible for electric and gas fittings etc - so I take that to mean I shouldn’t touch them. No tradesperson has responded to my requests for quotes - I’m not sure my tenancy agreement would allow this anyway - there’s no way I have the knowledge or skill for it.
The Housing Ombudsman has taken the case now - he warned me that’s they’re not quick though- I feel some relief that I can hand the communication over

OP posts:
Rokuandice · 21/11/2024 20:54

Oblomov24 · 21/11/2024 18:02

Sorry to hear this, hope you can get some resolution. This is disgraceful from council, lack of response to complaint, mp 20 days. All of them!

i voted for both of them - the MP and councillor. They won’t be getting my vote again for sure!

OP posts:
Rokuandice · 21/11/2024 21:04

WiddlinDiddlin · 20/11/2024 04:09

We have had to do that, yes. It does take a bit of research and getting your head around doing things in a new order/new processes.

We have two airfryers a combi microwave/convection oven and a portable two ring hob.

One air fryer is a dual draw jobby, the other is a two lids to choose from, one does air fry, one does pressure cook/slow cook.

So between those (the dual drawer job lives out on the counter all the time, the microwave has its own slot, everything else goes away in one cupboard between uses) we batch cook loads of stuff.

I invested in a big set of glass dishes with cliplock plastic lids so they can go from freezer to micro or airfryer. (If you're better at remembering to defrost things you can just get metal trays or throwaway foil trays which go straight in teh airfryer)

We do the saute then casserole type things in the instapot slow cooker/airfryer, so bolognese, shepherds pie, chilli etc..

Spud can be done either on the hob or in the instapot once the meat is done, for the cottage pies/shepherds pies.

You can saute and casserole in most airfryers as long as you can take the little plate out of the bottom that raises things off the bottom of the pan/drawer, so we do that sometimes and do big batches of fried onions or roasted veg.

I also do anything id fry that really wants an extractor fan if you were to do it in a pan as we now don't have one... so burgers and steaks come out really good and no stinky kitchen!

If we didn't batch cook AND need an airfryer I can use by myself (I can't use the pot style ones only the drawer style as using a wheelchair, I am too low down to reach in over the top of it), we'd just have the drawer style I think, but DP does like to slow cook big vats of chilli and curry.

My favourite thing at the minute is egg fried rice, reheated - so when we get a chinese takeaway we buy extra egg fried rice. Fridge it, freeze it til we need it once its cool. Then when defrosted it goes in the preheated airfryer drawer (straight in, no dish, crisper plate taken out)... get it properly hot, super hot so its safe.. then wang in whatever veg, cooked meat or meat substitute we want. Lovely! It means its worth it to buy a chinese takeaway (I only eat the egg fried rice, nothing else) and we can use up left over and sad veg, veggie sausages etc lingering in the fridge.

Thank you so much for this. I’m beginning to wrap my head around not having a proper oven. I’m looking at the ninja 12 in one - or maybe the 10 in one .. so a mini oven and a tefal plug in single hob… it still feels to me like temporary equipment so I hope I can get used to it
the gap for the cooker, I’m thinking of putting a larder unit in there, rather than just having a gap. Not sure if that’s allowed though, as it will be covering the gas pipe/fitting for the cooker, so will be inaccessible for annual gas safety check. Honestly my eyes rolled as I wrote that. I can’t win can I 🙈🙄😆 .. I’m so cheesed off that I’m going to have to pay a gas safety engineer to disconnect my cooker and not connect a new one though!
I spoke to the Housing Ombudsman today and had to forward all emails to them. At least they’ll do the chasing now.

OP posts:
JenniferBooth · 29/01/2025 15:01

@Rokuandice Are you any further forward over two months on since posting this?

Rokuandice · 09/02/2025 15:52

JenniferBooth · 29/01/2025 15:01

@Rokuandice Are you any further forward over two months on since posting this?

Hi Jennifer, unfortunately no. They're refusing to budge saying it's an aesthetic concern only. They just won't listen and for some strange reason, offered me £50 compensation but no solution. They have only just formally replied to the complaint submitted in November.
Was also flooded by my upstairs neighbour 1pm on Christmas Day - ruined walls, flooring and lighting. Emergency electrician out on Christmas afternoon. Imagine 😢Same neighbour has had us up since 6.45 am by letting her children run riot whilst she had a lay in. I'm considering giving up the tenancy - scary as a single fifty something but this is no way to live

OP posts:
Dwxxw · 12/02/2025 05:55

I moved into my Council House 11 years ago. The Council did not provide a cooker. I thought about buying one my never got round to it. Mainly because I initially wanted a gas cooker but the thought of having to get the gas man out to install it was a hassle as I had to work and dread having to make phone calls and book appointments. In the end I just make do with a portable electric pan ( a big one) two Airfryers and an electric pressure cooker ( yes I love kitchen gadgets)
I also have a dishwasher which fills up the space where the cooker might have occupied.

So yes I can and have cooked ( every thing including roast a goose at Christmas) using an Airfryer and survived without a cooker.

It is humanly possible to live without a cooker

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