To ask why you support the farmers, regarding inheritance tax?

[WheresFluffy]

Just that, really.
I'm interested to know why people support, or not, the farmers regarding the inheritance tax changes.

YABU - it's been done to death
YANBU - learning why people believe things is important.

I support the farmers. I don’t support how this has been implemented but then I don’t agree with inheritance tax on principle and certainly not at the rate it’s levied in the UK.

If they’re not a millionaire then there isn’t any inheritance tax to pay. It’s only on £2m or £3m.
So those non millionaire farmers will be fine.

I support them because I'm fond of eating.

I think the value is tied up in farm machinery and land.

Don’t most of them lease machinery these days?

They didn’t ‘overwhelmingly vote for Brexit’

Many did and they campaigned for it for years.

Only as a result of the budget, like farmers.

Until the budget business property relief was available for unquoted trading companies,

The media, have focused on the changes to apr, but many family businesses are now needing serious iht planning just like farmers.

And the big question is, if almost all can avoid it by tax planning, what's the point of the change? Why introduce very seriously unpopular policies then say it hardly affects anyone.

Do you not support them to the point that you would prefer to play higher prices and have food be more scarce than they have enough money to continue? That would seem to be cutting off your nose to spite your face just to ensure someone else doesn’t have more than you think they ought?

Ah yes, the dedicated farmers. Round here they are all excitedly selling off acres for major housing development, not so dedicated when mega bucks are on offer. Even the poorer ones live in the sort of period houses most people could never afford, room for a horse or two, lots of outdoor space for the children etc. etc.
Most of them have diversified with holiday cottages in the old stables, flogged off a few building plots or the old farm cottages. Camp sites, farm shops, cookery courses B&B there are not that many of them actually earning a living from the land. Those that farm animals are frequently beneath contempt with cruel animal husbandry. Every other type of business has to live with and plan for inheritance tax. I'm afraid I have zero sympathy for any of them. I come from a farming family too.

‘They’ employ contractors to harvest grain and make hay/silage but farmers need tractors, trailers etc for everyday jobs.

There is a lot of well sourced information saying they did. I have just finished reading an entire research paper into it on the back of this thread

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S074301671930436X

many, many trusted sources clearly state that farmers voted overwhelmingly for brexit. I see no reason to dismiss them based on your comment to the contrary

I think it's bad for the industry

I think it's a stupid ill thought out policy

I generally oppose death duties

So a single 80 year old farmer should just get married? To whom?

What on earth are you talking about? Farmers get billions of government support, most won’t be affected and those that are and wealthy have 10 years interest free to pay. They’re all also not going to be suddenly dying off. So much drama.

Round here (and it’s the same in the only other county I lived in long enough to gain such random information) the farmland is overwhelmingly owned by landed gentry (a lord who is a massive, public brexit supporter to boot) he rents his land to tenant farmers which he is extremely passionate about.

i can’t wait until the public take some inheritance tax off him. His estate which includes half of central London was gifted to his ancestors by the monarch 400 years ago. They did fuck all work for it. SHOW US THE MONEY

@Astrabees every farmer you claim to know has either stopped farming altogether or is doing so cruelly? That seems a little unlikely to me. There is a lot of diversification but that's because the farming economy had absolutely hit the buffers and farmers quite like to be able to eat, clothe their family and run a car.
Nice job on evidencing how jealous you are of farmers though. You'd get on well with Rachel Reeves I expect.

Close the loophole for those buying farms to save IHT, keep the relief for genuine farmers. Very few will have the cash to pay and selling off land and/or livestock will undermine the viability of the business.

The world is increasingly unstable and we need to improve our food security, not undermine it by having it taken over by foreign owned corporates.

Sadly I suspect a lot of elderly farmers will shoot themselves before the tax change comes in to save the family farm. Farmers are a very pragmatic bunch. One has already done so sadly, shooting himself the day before the budget off the back of rumours this was going to be brought in immediately.

To be fair, we all know farming families try and deal with this at a young age by effectively matchmaking with another farming family ie the whole Point of the young farmers association.

I think this has all the information on it.

The wealthiest should be the ones who bear the greatest burden. What a load of socialist tripe. Disgraceful. Why are they wealthy in the first place pray tell?

But those living on the edge won’t be affected. Only those over £3million.

Because they are asset rich and cash poor

I support them.
I live in a rural area that incorporates hill farms, moorland and a bit further out arable.
I know many farmers and despite what we’re being told on SM not one has a Range Rover, all
have a scrappy pick up truck that’s able to tow a cattle trailer + cows.
I know two farmers whose dc go to public school, but that’s because both of the wives have set up businesses that are doing well and have nothing to do with farming.
On paper a typical dairy farm round here might be worth 4-5 million, including machinery, land and livestock. In reality this makes a very low living for a three generation family, all pulling their weight. The middle generation (40 something) works very long hours to the point where he is on far less than minimum wage.
They provide milk to a UK based company. They provide local butchers with beef.

When the old farmer dies they could owe £1m in IHT, even if spread over 10 years this is far, far more money than they could ever access.

Farming is a unique business in that people are almost literally born into the job, having years of training that start when they can walk, that goes on until the main working farmer needs to slow down and the younger generation are then trained up and experienced enough to take over. That’s how it works. You can’t do three years at college and be a fully fledged farmer, it takes decades of working long hours in quite crappy conditions. It’s nothing like other businesses.

If I travel half an hour east I end up in arable country where a large chunk of land is being converted to solar panels (the managers of those companies often drive range rovers). More and more farming land is being eroded in this way.

There are a few threads running at the moment about the possibility of war. We’re certainly living in interesting times, and I for one think food safety should be a very high priority. We are an island. If there is a war that involves us we’d be sitting ducks without even being able to feed ourselves without relying on imports. Imports that have far lower health and safety standards than our own home grown food.

I do see why people don’t understand. If you live in a town and you’re hard up it must rankle to be told all about those millionaire farmers rocking up in their brand new range rovers, swanning back to their estates, but the truth for the majority of farmers is far from the landed gentry image that SM has created. We’d be fucked without them, and once it’s gone it’s too late.

Did you actually read it? It’s not tripe it’s a list of fair reasons why this policy is right and needs to happen.