Trainees no longer ready for workplace

[Kukcoo]

I used to love having trainees allocated to us. They were so enthusiastic, hardworking and a breath of fresh air. It was great to see them develop.

The last few have acted like they're doing us a favour if they turn up by lunchtime because they could have called in sick for nothing. Seriously can't be bothered doing the basics and expect everything to be done for them. Little respect for anyone else and the huge support they're being given. Won't meet a deadline, because this would affect their mental health and basically impinges on their human rights.

They all still expect to qualify and will be passed by the provider unless they do something truly dangerous, but they won't have the real experience or skills to join the workplace and get on with a job.

I'm barely even a different generation, but wouldn't have dreamed of acting the way they do when I was learning and felt I had to prove myself. AIBU to expect standards to be the same?

Mid-20s trainee today asked to work from home so they could help their boyfriend move house. Well you won’t be working if you’re shifting furniture and boxes will you?! So then asked to leave early instead. This is six weeks into job, still on probation.

eta - also sat twiddling thumbs after completing a task I’d set, rather than letting me know it was completed and asking what they could do next. I’m very friendly and approachable at work, ask me if you have any questions etc so being scared would not be the issue.

Yep
I wish I was joking.

This really saddens me. My DS and his gf (both 23) are both really hard-working and have struggled so much to get decent jobs, even with good degrees from good unis. I think they're discarded because of their age without anyone even looking at all the experience they've racked up while studying. I can honestly say they're not like this at all (and I'm not being starry eyed). Please don't tar all young people of this age with the same brush.

Schools seem to pander a lot more, zero resilience managing and their expectations aren’t managed properly by anyone. Everything is mental health related and they would rather doom scroll on their phones. Sister is a manager in hospitality and has 6th form work experience kids in. She has to send them packing after a few days. She actually said one kid snorted at her like Kevin the teenager when asked to get out her work schedule and said loudly “don’t tell me what to do coz I ain’t doing it, can’t be bothered fam”. My sister went old school and told the kid a few home truths and made her cry. This is what a lot of companies are now dealing with. Attitude isn’t there in the majority of them and they appear to be missing a backbone.

100% this. Schools are held accountable for progress. However, how can children make progress if they turn up late or not at all. Parents, OFSTED, Government still expect the same results. Children/parents take little responsibility for their own learning because that is what the system tells them. I am a year 6 TA and the number of children who do not know times tables is shocking. This is despite this cohort sitting the year 4 tables test. We tell them that they need to take responsibility /ownership of this and go home and learn them but few actually do. We see staggering progress in the ones that do because they can spend more time actually learning and understanding the more complex mathematical concepts. It has got to a point where I have become so demoralised by it that I have started putting my foot down and spending less time with the children that can’t be bothered. I would rather help children who want to learn and are willing to put in the effort to help themselves. Imo we need to stop spoon feeding children and start letting them fail but unless the system changes this isn’t going to happen. The spoon feeding carries on to university and then we have the situation that so many of you are describing where grown adults can’t cope with the real world of work.

Its a "big". Salaries are high - fully commensurate with our expectations of them in the workplace. We know the job is tough.

All my peers at comparable organisations describe the same experience. In reality many of them will be exited via the performance process which is a huge waste of our time and money.

As I said its not all by any means but ten years ago this was so rare that it would be noted and investigated as an aberration, now its a percentage of every cohort. Our clients describe far worse experiences - probably because they are slightly less demanding at the recruitment stage.

Please don't tar all young people of this age with the same brush

It's very unfair to generalise about any age group.

The children in my street are mostly late teens and early twenties now and are delightful, pleasant and mannerly, and I'm sure hard-working and reliable.

However the experiences mentioned about some in this thread are concerning.

I’m finding the opposite is true - in my 40s and following a career change (to an area closely linked to my old profession, so lots of relevant experience/skills) I’m being turned down for roles in favour of people in their 20s, despite having 3 degrees, good references and a strong employment record. It’s not just me as I’ve spoken to many people in a similar predicament. IME employers seem to prefer younger, more malleable staff who don’t have kids.

God I assumed you were being facetious 😬

I work in HE in a competitive subject at a top ranked university so nothing to do with expanding the sector too far. I am shocked at what I’m seeing - I struggle to see how these people will be able to hold down jobs. About 65-70% of them apply for an extension (they can self-certify up to five days so most of them apply for that routinely). I’m not allowed to ask about 25% of them any questions in seminars because of their learning plans that say they get anxious from being asked direct questions. So because I can’t memorise who has a plan and who doesn’t, I don’t ask anyone anything in seminars- I ask for volunteers to speak and often get none. If a student books an appointment with me about 50% of the time they don’t show and then send me an email asking to rebook. A large proportion of submitted work has clear evidence of AI use and I’ve heard that many students buy their essays. It’s quite depressing really and something is going wrong big time.

My friend who is a police officer told me her and her team was called to the scene of a suicide in a house had a 6-month police trainee with them and the trainee called his Dad to the crime scene for support as he found the situation anxiety inducing. A random civilian off the street just invited to walk into a crime scene! Everyone was apoplectic.

We recently had an apprentice for our events business. A 19 year old who would be with us for 4 days a week and then college for a day to qualify as a technician. He’d gone through various interviews alongside others interested in the events business he was told he may get the chance to be at some major music events, even some abroad. started late the first two days, and then didn’t come back at all, a complete waste of everyone’s time. Told us he found it difficult getting in for 8:30 am (lives locally with a car) but decided he was going back to his old job at Marcie D’s……he’d rather be a supervisor there telling others what to do, than be told what to do here, seemed to think he’d be running his own McDonalds within 5 years…..

My own experience and those of friends is the same - Civil Service, academia, retail, hospitality. ‘Precious’ has become a swear word in my view, along with ‘banter’.

Please tell me this isn’t true!

I left teaching because I was so fed up of the way things were going in school. I believed we were failing the pupils by mollycoddling them, giving them constant ‘time out’ cards when they got anxious, bending over backwards to make their lives in school as soft as possible, allowing them to hide away from things they found hard or didn’t like, parents who wouldn’t let us discipline children without complaining that their angel didn’t deserve it… etc
It does not surprise me that we are now having these problems.

Welcome to the next generation folks. A result of gentle parenting and teachers being unable to discipline/teach kids accordingly due to parental backlash and kids ‘mental health issues/ADHD/ASD/anxiety’.

I was recently invited to train some apprentices in my industry by an external training provider. I had the post lunch time slot and was gobsmacked by how many came back late, still eating, on phones etc. More than once during the training I stopped speaking as the odd pair were just chatting amongst themselves.

Regardless, I sent all attendees an email the following day thanking them for their time and ensuring they had my contact details for future reference. One replied to thank me and say they found my industry insights valuable, another replied to complain that she hadn't been given a prize voucher from a different presenter and could I sort it - not a peep from the other 18.

My workplace is also very relaxed (I actually don't like going in as all the chat and fun stuff going on distracts me and I get behind), with great benefits, flexible working (2 office days only,) and slightly above industry average pay. The turn over of young staff is incredible - they don't feel valued, should earn more even if it's their first job, want more holiday time, don't want to be given targets etc. The older staff have been there years and wouldn't dream of leaving as it's genuinely very relaxed.

Yes and the infantilisation of young people plays out on the Oxbridge threads on mumsnet. These posters know the inns and outs of everything to do with life at Cambridge or Oxford, from admissions through to career opportunities post graduation.

Anyone posting on those threads needs to ask themselves why they are so overly invested in it? They are not studying at Oxbridge. Their DC are obviously bright enough to figure it all out on their own. They need to be independent and steer their own path in life.

Are these parents trying to live vicariously through their DC, to feel a sense of achievement ? I can’t see how it’s healthy for parents to be so involved in university life.

I have been thinking about this as it seems a phenomenon in the last couple of years. If I have an interesting meeting I would suggest that the trainee comes along, development etc. However, the company has become so fixated with the trainees' development that the trainee then seems to cherry pick tasks that are someway enriching for them ignoring or rushing through the tasks they find boring and getting simple things wrong.

@KindlyOldGoat this situation is no better in your 50s or 60s and that's assuming one's children have left home by then.
I think employers just prefer young people as they are assumed to be more adaptable (not always true though judging by some of the comments on this thread) and of course, get away with paying them less than someone more experienced.

I work in HE in a competitive subject at a top ranked university ... I’m not allowed to ask about 25% of them any questions in seminars because of their learning plans that say they get anxious from being asked direct questions

In that case I'd have to ask what the hell they're doing at a top ranked university, @Startinganew32, and perhaps more to the point what the Uni are doing allowing this to develop

I've all the time in the world for supporting the genuinely disabled, but if anyone's trying to claim that a whole 25% of supposedly high achieving students are so affected by "anxiety" that they can't answer a question ... I'm sorry but I just don't believe them

I thought young people were complaining about expensive housing and how even a house share is too much, so they'll have to live at home forever. I would have thought they'd be snapping up extra shifts.

We are finding just the same with veterinary students. It’s as though they are doing us a favour by turning up as they are not being paid and yet a lot of effort goes into preparing for their placement. They tell us they can no longer take part in their farm placements as they have more important paid work to do. They just don’t seem to see that these experiences are an important part of their training and understand of the profession they claim they want to be part of 🤷‍♀️

The uni is, like nearly all other unis, concerned about finances (another big problem for another thread is the large number of overseas students who have insufficient English language skills but whom we are told to pass because they bring in fees) and will bend over backwards to try to keep students happy. A learning support plan is drawn up by the support services and does not require any independent evidence so the anxiety is largely self-reported. We also have horrible cases like the Natasha Abrahart suicide at Bristol where a lot of blame is being placed on the university (the student’s parents want to introduce a stronger duty of care for universities) so it is better to be safe than sorry and avoid any potential repercussions.
So in answer, due to fear and financial pressures, the uni is doing very little to enable students to become highly functioning future workers.

I'm agree. I had a student placement earlier this year. A colleague invited my student to complete a piece of work ( legal report) student was given examples and had a sit down meeting on what was required.
When completed student had written some information that did not make sense. When I gave her feedback she started crying and complained I was not 'kind and understanding'
This student was very academically bright but had not clue about professionalism, team work, taking initiative etc..
I definitely think professions such as teaching, law and social work needs to have a minimum age of 25.

That all makes perfect sense, Startinganew32, except I'd have hoped a leading Uni could still attract enough with real ability to be able to avoid slackers

The intake at my local one is disastrous and having got to the point where they'll take just about anyone with a pulse they've joined that unhappy band where some leading companies regard one of their degrees as no degree at all, but as said I'd have expected better from the top 20 or so