HR are lying? Aibu to be worried?

[ijustwanttodu]

So HR have fabricated an entire meeting. I had a meeting with them and they said we discussed this issue with you a year ago.

They claim I was taken into a small room and talked to by someone who has since left. 3 weeks into me starting there. I was taken aback and said what date was this and she got quite flustered and tried to change the subject and then gave me the vague answer of what month it occurred. And then she said all this bad stuff about me, how I kept coming into work late during that time.

I don’t know why she would do this.

@StormingNorman A lawyer would rip this to shreds.

A lawyer won't be anywhere near this - 18 months service only.

I don’t think my manager wants me to go but HR seemingly do.
Sorry, but that simply doesn't happen. Anywhere. HR do not randomly decide to dispense with people. They do so for a reason (it might not be a good reason or a "fair reason" but there is always a reason) and they do so at the behest of management. Not on their own initiative. I am no fan of HR, but the idea that HR "wander the corridors selecting random employees to practice their dismissal techniques on" is ludicrous. You have p'd off your manager or someone higher than them, and your manager knows full well what this is about. If they seem not to be involved they are taking the cowards way out and playing at three wise monkeys - they have seen nothing, heard nothing and said nothing.

You can dispute the advice you are getting here as much as you want - it's no skin off our noses. But what they are talking to you about, and what they say happened last year IS relevant, but since you know best, I'll simply repeat, find another job soon because when they dismiss you may find it much harder to get a job with that on your record.

If you only started just over a year ago, then HR can pick any reason that isn't discrimination and remove you. Whatever this latest meeting was about will do, as you say it is fair. So you need a new job.

Nobody should be lying about anything in professional environments, but the meeting or lack of meeting is effectively irrelevant to your current employment rights.

What advice have I disputed exactly?

I never said HR roam the corridor looking to fire people. It is however not outside the realms of possibility that people can abuse their position of power simply because they don’t like you.

My managers actions have never indicated to me that she wants me to leave.

HR are there to protect the company, not the staff. Of course they aren't your friends!

You have been told repeatedly that it is almost impossible to provide accurate advice when you won't explain what is happening, and your response is that you aren't going to say because you don't want to, etc., etc.

HR are not in a position of power - they don't know who you are unless someone brings you to their attention, and they don't dislike you because they haven't a clue who you are unless someone tells them something about you. They act, and support, managers. Somewhere a manager above you has taken issue with something you have said or done. Something that you seem to know you have said or done but don't want to tell us about (so nobody can really give you any advice as we keep telling you but you say it isn't relevant when it is the SOLE reason you are having meetings with HR) is the only reason HR are talking to you.

And your manager is bullshitting you. She told you HR wanted to talk to you. She knew, and has always known, why. You can believe that or not, but I am telling you that HR do not pull people in for a serious chat and not mention the reason to a persons manager. And seriously, she not only knows and is fine about it, but she is probably the reason you are talking to them - she either initiated this action or she knows who did and is not about to defend you against them.

That’s not me disputing advice by saying I don’t feel comfortable as I don’t want to identified on an online forum. I am free to share as little or as much as I want. Just as people are free to decide whether they want to answer or not.

I don’t work with any other manager and my managers manager is far too removed and busy and also very new to have any involvement in this. They wouldn’t care.

I believe some people in HR are on power trips. Whether you believe it or not that’s up to you and I’m not convincing you any which way (you’re too defiant on being argumentative so sadly there’s no conversation to be had).

And there was no “serious chat” - I think for someone to randomly call you, have no invite, no follow up with documenting what was said is extremely problematic if that was suppose to be a serious chat.

Anyway, have fun being argumentative and saying things like “I’m disputing advice” when you can’t even give a valid reason because that accusation. Have a lovely evening as I won’t be engaging with you further.

Have it your way. HR just find it a fun sport to pick on random employees.

@ijustwanttodu I’ve only read your posts, so forgive me if another poster has suggested this.

In your shoes I would be making a subject access request to your DPO. Be very specific I.e. any notes or records relating to an HR interview by (name of HR person) in x - y time frame.

HR don't just randomly choose people to get rid of, the previous posters are right. Your manager will be aware and I would have a straightforward discussion with her to see if you can find out what's happening.

Don't be so tied up in whether HR are lying/abusing power that you lose sight of the main aim - finding out what's going on and staying employed.

HR do not work for you, they work for management.
This is why Trade Unions are important

OP if you're as combative in real life as you are on here I'm not surprised you've come to the attention of HR

OP there is absolutely no way HR are talking to you and arranging meetings without your manager’s knowledge.

I know you don’t want to believe this but I cannot think of any conceivable circumstance in which this would happen.

And as you won’t share any details, nobody can be any clearer than that.

ACAS?

I haven’t said HR are arranging meetings without my managers knowledge?

I didn’t say they do this. But I do believe some people can be on power trips and can take a dislike to you and use opportunities to their advantage.

I am concerned with them lying and making things up because they could be saying I’ve had numerous warnings, when I actually haven’t.

Sorry. I thought you said your manager wasn’t aware of what was going on.

I work in HR. I can assure you we don’t “get rid” of people and we don’t have power trips. Most of us spend most of our time trying to persuade managers from treating people unfairly and/or illegally.

Some of you on this thread sound like flat earthers.

I asked her outright if she had a memory of the meeting that HR are talking about (the one a year ago) and she said no.

But all evidence and my memory points to this meeting not existing, so she wouldn’t know about this one.

All the other times she’s been perfectly aware and told me.

I’ve addressed this multiple times now and it’s getting boring. I do not think it’s a sport in HR to randomly get rid of people.

I think this particular person I’ve dealt with does not like me and for some reason she’s made up a meeting and is now presently ignoring my very simple request for more information.

And I can only assume she made the entire thing up as a way to say how bad my conduct is and I was made aware of it. The person she said did the meeting lied and said it happened. Or she is thinking of someone entirely different. But it needs to be addressed:

I’m sure as you work in HR and told someone they’d already had a meeting with HR then you’d at least provide them with a date?

All the other times she’s been perfectly aware and told me.
All the other times? How often have you been called in to HR?

Yes, this. Whatever is going on OP, it looks like there are some serious issues.

This is right. Your manager may be making you somehow think it's HR that want you to go but I can 100% guarantee your Manager is driving the bus.

I don't understand how HR have raised anything without there being notes/mails etc that are shared with you, and normally include corrective action. Eg if constantly late some regular monitoring being built in and clear expectations of target such as only late with genuine and phoned in reason.
However, HR actually have no clue, or interest, in your work/behaviour (for example I'll keep using lateness) unless your manager raised it with them.
I think your manager will have contacted HR for advice/assistance with your, for example, lateness, discussed with this employee who left, listened to their advice and agreed you will be spoken to about the issues by HR, perhaps as a first stage/informal warning. It does seem possible to me that the ex HR employee perhaps didn't do as agreed with manager but noted what they had planned to do as if it were done - this is completely wrong but I would say this is incompetence (eagerness to pack up and go!) rather than malice to be honest, but it has led to all this miscommunication and misunderstanding.
With no evidence of previous discussion then you have cause to treat this as a new event and you can continue to raise it and make sure your version of events are recorded. I would take advice from ACAS though not pay for any as your under 2year service makes it not worthwhile imo.
However please stop thinking HR are acting off their own bat - your manager has obviously been in touch again about this issue and received advice that was based on the previous case notes from nearly a year ago and agreed HR will deal with the next stage - of course she looks worried if she thinks HR has screwed up and everyone may have to start from the beginning again.
Where I work managers have to deal with HR issues but with advice from HR. I often wish HR would deal with them instead for many reasons but it seems not a perfect system this way either.
Unfortunately, whilst you can debate whether it's first or second stage now, as you've been there less than 2 years you will have little recourse to save your job. A Union would give better advice, or maybe ACAS, but ultimately you will have to realise that there is something you are doing that your manager doesn't like albeit she has to be neutral in front of you as HR deal with it officially.

How long have you worked there OP as unless you fall under a protected characteristic, if you have less than two years service sadly they can do as they like?

To be fair however they should have at least the conversation they claim to have had with you in writing if it is deemed to be so serious, and email trail to evidence it was sent to you

Yes I've experienced this too . They would pick on someone and make their lives hell until they left . After they left a few days later someone else would be selected . Everyone would hold their breath waiting to see who would be scapegoated . Some people even went off sick while this happened. It's called serial bullying .