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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Can someone explain the XL Bully situation please?

34 replies

yuuulp · 05/11/2024 21:25

Are they aggressive? Have they been bread to be ‘XL’ and if so why…?! Why are they often attacking people?

Im not saying I wouldn’t avoid one (I would!) but I don’t really understand why they’re suddenly so prevalent in the uk and where they have come from? Can you just buy one like any other dog?

OP posts:
Gingernaut · 05/11/2024 21:38

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-66775985

The XL Bulldog is not a specific breed, but an amalgamation of a variety of different dog breeds, selected for their size and muscle mass

Unfortunately, they are very inbred and a lot of them carry the traits of a particularly vicious individual

It is a criminal offence to own an XL without a Certificate of Exemption, it is an offence to breed them and it is an offence to let them stray.

XL bully dog close up

How dangerous are XL bullies and how does the ban work?

Rules restricting ownership of American XL bully dogs are in force across the UK.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-66775985

yuuulp · 05/11/2024 21:40

@Gingernaut why have people created them then? For fun? Doesn’t seem very fun.

if you have a license, on what basis would you want one? I don’t get why you would want a certificate for one, surely just choose another dog? What makes the situation exempt?

OP posts:
yuuulp · 05/11/2024 21:42

Why would someone want one though

OP posts:
BobbyBiscuits · 05/11/2024 21:42

They aren't a specific breed, but often have mastiffs, pit bull, staffy, dog de Bordeaux, rotty etc all sorts mixed up to give them power and strength. They have been known to often be bred to protect criminals. Also many people who keep them don't have enough space or time to exercise them sufficiently. So they get even more aggressive. It's a real shame what human beings can do to animals.

Purplehelmut · 05/11/2024 21:44

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines.

ToBeOrNotToBee · 05/11/2024 22:12

They were created in America using the American Pitbull Terrier as the foundation and various other breeds to bulk out the dogs.
The APBT is actually a medium sized, athletic looking dog. To get to the bully they added in American Bulldog, Great Dane, Dogo Argentino, Mastiffs.
They became very popular very quickly, with a certain kind of person and like all things, demand initially outstrips supply so they become even more sought after. They became the it-dog with celebrities, footballers, wannabe hard boys and other idiots, with dogs going for thousands and thousands. Because there weren't that any in the country, a good few were imported from America.
People of ill-repute saw an opportunity, linked to money laundering, drugs, and tax avoidance. Greeders saw an opportunity to make £50,000 per litter.
Now, when breeding dogs, especially of that size temperament should come first. If a dog shows any kind of nervous, anxiety, aggression etc, it should be removed from the breeding pool. Only healthy, physically and mentally, adult dogs should be bred from. Large dogs mature very slowly and some personality traits don't show until well in adulthood.
But with the bully, they were in such demand that people just focused on breeding for size and colour over anything else. It was not unheard of for 9 month olds to sire pups, being pups themselves.
So you've got dogs that when 5 or 6 would become human aggressive, nervous with children or unpredictable and they've already sired 60-70 pups, and their own pups have gone on to be bred from. Way too late to do anything.
And of course in this country, we don't do breeding licenses, so anyone can get a dog and breed it, sell the pups on to anyone, and who knows what happens to the dogs from then on.
The American Bully XL's sheer size means it is not suitable for an average UK home. They need a sizeable home, with space to run and and burn off energy. They need an owner dedicated to training, socialising and able to physically control them. They need an owner well versed in Canine behaviour and is able to recognise when the dog is acting up and do something about it. Not baby it, keep it in a small terrace and never walk it because the dog is too bloody strong for them. But that's exactly what they got. So the dogs weren't in the right homes where there needs were being met, meaning frustrated, anxious, neurotic dogs being kept in homes with humans way out their depth, or falling into the hands of people using them for intimidation, who also had no clue what they were doing. Even worse, kids dangling from their necks. Ticking time bomb.
As these mass produced pups started to mature we started to hear more and more about people being killed by them. I do believe they are more likely to bite than other dogs because of the genetic dumpster fire they were given but also, given their sheer size, a bite by an XL is going to be fatal very quickly. They weigh the same as an adult. Their heads and jaws are massive. They will do damage with a warning bite, if they mean business you will die.
But as ever, it's not the fault of the dogs. It's the fault of the humans breeding them, the owners who buy them and put them in their homes and our stupid government that could have tightened the laws on breeding, ownership etc on all dogs years ago but don't want to.

Killingoffmyflowersonebyone · 05/11/2024 22:13

yuuulp · 05/11/2024 21:42

Why would someone want one though

Because they’re sad little losers. They get an XL Bully to feel ‘big’ and intimidate others. I’m yet to meet an owner of one who didn’t wasn’t either as high as a kite or rough.

No one responsible gets these dogs. They’re owned by idiots and losers - and if you try and explain to them that the entire point of this breed is how unpredictable (ie. randomly attack) and strong they are, they just say ‘well [insert typically chav name] wouldn’t hurt me.’

Strangely I’ve never met an XL Bully with a normal name, like Neville or Buddy or Luna. Wonder why…

yuuulp · 05/11/2024 22:16

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines.

@Purplehelmut really? I can assure you I’m not secretly keeping an XL Bully on my sofa while I type!

OP posts:
Bestchocolate · 05/11/2024 22:17

@ToBeOrNotToBee excellent post but also the breed comes from attack dogs and dogs to kill cattle etc so they have a innate attack gene in them.

Bestchocolate · 05/11/2024 22:18

Personally I think it should be manslaughter or even murder to have these animal guns around children.
If adults are stupid enough to have one in their home to prove how wonderful these nanny dogs are :fine. But make it criminal offence to have one around an innocent child.

yuuulp · 05/11/2024 22:19

The strangest thing to me is why you’d choose to have one. I can see if you want them to defend yourself but surely people don’t have them as a family pet!

OP posts:
No33 · 05/11/2024 22:20

They are a status symbol for some.

It's a bunch of characteristics that are largely bred from a nasty individual of a dog in the states called 'killer kimbo'

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/09/14/britains-xl-bullys-descend-one-inbred-pet-us-killer-kimbo/

SensibleSigma · 05/11/2024 22:21

It’s quite a small gene pool. In the uk more than 50% have a specific dog in their history- a champion fighting dog that eventually killed a 7yr old.

The earning potential meant it had been bred from and its offspring continued to be bred from. So the line of an aggressive dog persists and indeed interbred.

yuuulp · 05/11/2024 22:24

I have just googled the recent case where a ten year old was very sadly attacked. I presume they must attack quite out of the blue then? If they’ve been in the family for years and been fine.

OP posts:
Rightiojames · 05/11/2024 22:24

They're said to all be descended from 1 specific dog which makes them extremely inbred and along with their sheer size means their temperament is broken. People who own them fall into 2 camps. "Not my dog he/she is lovely wouldn't hurt a fly" and "I'm wellard me". Neither group sees the need to train or walk their dogs let alone neuter, muzzle, use a lead or keep the dogs away from children.

ToBeOrNotToBee · 05/11/2024 22:31

yuuulp · 05/11/2024 22:24

I have just googled the recent case where a ten year old was very sadly attacked. I presume they must attack quite out of the blue then? If they’ve been in the family for years and been fine.

We don't know.
This dog was kept in a caravan for gods sake.
The dog could have been in pain, had an ear infection (very common in dogs, very painful for them and makes dogs quite grumpy) and just snapped when she went to stroke him on the head.
I've seen that play out a few times with dogs of all shapes and sizes.

SilverDoe · 05/11/2024 22:31

We had one roaming the streets, it tried to enter everyone's house.

Bless him he was lovely and very friendly, but fucking hell with all that's in the news the literal last thing you want to come across when going about your daily life, especially with kids, is an unknown, roaming and unaccompanied XL bully. I had to hold onto him for a couple of hours despite how friendly he was, it obviously crosses your mind what they can do.

I have seen quite a few pit bull and mastiff type dogs around, and lots of pictures of XL bullies, but it's hard to convey unless you are up close with one how they look. They are so powerful, and their heads and shoulders are extremely, unnaturally large. They are just so capable of harm.

This dog was a beauty and very friendly. It's a very sad situation as he was siezed but there are reasons for that.

People want them specifically for what they look like sometimes. I don't believe that's always the case at all, but some people I am sure either have then for the status of having a fighting style dog, or they feel like having one is some kind of advanced level of dog ownership. Who knows.

I have very mixed feelings on this. I've seen first hand how sweet and friendly they can be and I'm sure many are bomb proof and loving companions. But I don't think it's ethical to dogs or humans to breed something that could so easily kill when frightened.

Another issue is that people just move on to other breeds. Around here it's cane corsos now.

Rightiojames · 05/11/2024 22:33

Yes it's Cane Corsos here too. I thought they were banned but it seems id mixed them up with Dogo Argentinos.

pinkstripeycat · 05/11/2024 22:38

Killingoffmyflowersonebyone · 05/11/2024 22:13

Because they’re sad little losers. They get an XL Bully to feel ‘big’ and intimidate others. I’m yet to meet an owner of one who didn’t wasn’t either as high as a kite or rough.

No one responsible gets these dogs. They’re owned by idiots and losers - and if you try and explain to them that the entire point of this breed is how unpredictable (ie. randomly attack) and strong they are, they just say ‘well [insert typically chav name] wouldn’t hurt me.’

Strangely I’ve never met an XL Bully with a normal name, like Neville or Buddy or Luna. Wonder why…

I know one called Freya. My ex SIL owns her. When she bought it for her 11yr old son I’d never heard of XL bully. I remember thinking at the time how huge the puppy was and wondered why SIL had bought such a big, muscular dog for a child.

The dog grew to be 8 stone and SIL didn’t train her to walk nicely on the lead so she dragged SIL along. Nephew, at aged 14, can’t walk the dog. She was a friendly dog when I last saw up close before the ban but I wouldn’t go near her due to XL bully reputation and would never trust her. She ex SIL anyway so I don’t have to. Did see them from a distance last week with lead and muzzle on dog dragging SIL along.

whatsthatwordagainfeet · 05/11/2024 22:39

How exactly do they define XL bully?

So eg the muzzle rule, does it basically mean all American bully’s have to be muzzled?

I don’t understand why more dog breeds aren’t banned tbh. We already have a few banned breeds with no issue 🤷‍♀️

Rightiojames · 05/11/2024 22:41

I'd like to see chihuahuas banned.

SilverDoe · 05/11/2024 22:44

whatsthatwordagainfeet · 05/11/2024 22:39

How exactly do they define XL bully?

So eg the muzzle rule, does it basically mean all American bully’s have to be muzzled?

I don’t understand why more dog breeds aren’t banned tbh. We already have a few banned breeds with no issue 🤷‍♀️

I didn't know this until recently but apparently there are specific features and measurements a dog will meet to be considered an XL Bully

Fizbosshoes · 05/11/2024 23:00

How have you not known anything about XL bullies until now? It was all over the news when the restrictions came into effect at the beginning of the year?

Yepyepyepducky · 05/11/2024 23:05

This post seems pretty poor taste imo, surely this is something that could be googled.