Planning permission for children's home next door

[Turningandturning]

We have a neighbour who has constantly caused problems since he bought the house next door around 8 years ago.
I say 'neighbour' but he hasn't ever lived there, he owns another house nearby, but has had various schemes to make money from the house which have been totally disruptive and stressful to us.
The house is detached and is on a corner so we are the only neighbours really affected.
The houses are, as I said, detached and on a large 1970s, fully residential estate.
He has just told us that he is applying for planning permission to change the use from C3 to C2 so some women can look after children there.
C2 seems to be a children's home,
I am sorry this is so long and am
really not a horrible nimby person but do want to understand the implications of him doing this.
It really is not possible to speak to him.
Thank you so much.

As a next door neighbour you'll be consulted by letter once a planning application is validated by the local council. There'll be a link to read the supporting information submitted and you'll get an opportunity to put your views in.

It will be to provide supported living to children who can't live at home for some reason and who aren't suitable for foster care - usually because they are too old (teens) or have specialists needs.

Excellent. We need more facilities for vulnerable women and children. No, it wouldn’t bother me in the least if it were next door.

I don’t think you’ll have a problem. My previous house was assessed for this purpose when I sold it - I was very sad that ultimately it wasnt considered suitable. It’s not always possible to use the house for this purpose because the costs of certain improvement or conversions to make it fit for the new purpose are prohibitive.

Ime it's pot luck whichever ndn you get. We have a couple who's dc moved out. Yeah!! Now descended on by multiple dgc.. Loud and screaming ones... Women with dc grateful for safety might be more appreciative of their walls.... Be happy such places are popping up. You never know you or a friend may need one some day.

This.

Well you are a nimby person … it doesn’t make you horrible but these homes do need to exist and it’s a positive thing for them to be in nice locations in the community.

It's children, not criminals or drug addicts! In the nicest possible way, OP, how bad could it be?

If it's for mums and their children it could be a mother and baby unit where mums get assessed to see if they can meet the needs of their babies/ young children or it could be a mum and children's centre to be used as somewhere safe for them to stay. Either one of those would not bother me in the slightest. I don't think wither of those would cause much noise or disruption.

A children's home many people seem to think are full of wild teens. This isn't always the case. Unfortunately some areas don't have the number of carers needed and it is forcing more children's homes to open and younger children being in them. It's a very sad state. The children are usually quite heavily monitored and the older teens will be hopefully learning skills for when they age out of care.

Like other have said there will be meetings and you will be informed of the intentions of the building and have a right to put your opinions across.

In my experience, Bad!! You don't know what kids you're gonna get. The carers actually have no authority over them and the kids know it. Constant police visits and knocks on door asking if you've seen them. Broken windows, vandalised cars, other undesirable teens hanging around.

Remember they're not all little passive vulnerable kids. Some are well into the lifestyle of the parents they've had to be removed from.

I stand corrected then. We do have a place like this just round the corner from my house, and I've not seen any trouble apart from a bit of weed smoking and hanging round in groups drinking (the local kids who aren't in care behave the same), however this is a block of purposely built housing for young people like this and is more of a halfway house for those teens ageing out of care or who have some SEN, or are homeless for other reasons. There are wardens there living on site, so I guess this is an entirely different kettle of fish.

Agree with this. I have good friend who manages several homes, some of the kids are very very troubled. Not a chance I would want to take personally. Some are removed from home because they themselves are a threat.

An application was raised and rejected for one three houses down from me. I didn't object but several did as did the council. In the end it lost planning because of access and unsuitable storage for more bins and bikes, bizarrely. Don't underestimate disruption of multiple shift workers' cars coming and going, for example and the need for more parking spaces. The houses also need internal remodelling with fire doors etc.

Yes, homes are needed. Whether the people who are lodging applications in quiet residential areas are out to make a buck or two is open to question. I've read some interesting things about their business models.

There was an infamous teenage residential home near my workplace and, yes, it did become known for ASB and drugs. They tend to target nice residential areas for such homes as they think it will help to regulate, or even remove networks from, the residents.

It's easy to call someone a NIMBY when it's not your BY.

We have one in our local paper atm. A company from out of town has bought a 4 bed corner plot house on a nice estate and want to change it into a house that will house 2 x older kids and have space for 2 x carers / support to stay over. We had one past week also in the paper, awaiting permissions where a 3 x bed terrace house has been bought and they want to turn it somehow into a 6 x bed for refugees.

When you get the planning information check how much parking they are stating there is, the shift patterns of the carers and provisions for getting to local schools/colleges.

There was one applied for near where I used to live, they stated 4 carers on X shift pattern and that there was parking for 4 vehicles so it wouldn't be an issue at cross over time as adequate parking for the carers and visitors. In reality there ere only 2 spaces which meant it would cause parking issues.

They also stated about excellent transport links to a certain college but reality was 3 buses taking over 2 hours and leaving at 6am. So again not practical.

In the end the one near me got declined for the reasons above and various other inconsistencies between the application and reality.

As you describe it as a detached house on a 70s residential estate I assume it's not some huge mansion with many bedrooms, so surely there will be a limit as to how many people will live there - children & staff.

I know someone who lives in a street of large 5/6 bedroom detached Edwardian houses with around nine rooms in total - the next door house was once proposed to be a men's bail hostel, but this was turned down.

You never know who will move in next door!

I’ve lived near a number of supported accommodation-type properties, so have a range of experience. A DV shelter for women looking after their own children, with support, was no bother at all. A religion-backed homeless charity who provided semi-supported accommodation for those with a history of homelessness was also a ‘good’ neighbour, who considered the wider community in their planning and management.

On the flip side a ‘B&B’ used for emergency accommodation for those coming out of prison, many with addiction issues, has led to a signifant rise in anti-social behaviour - my 12 year old DD was solicited, cars vandalised, blatant dealing and drug taking on the street. The issue seems to be that the accommodation is not supported or managed, merely a private owner making money from other people’s misfortunes.

My main question would be if there is an experienced organisation overseeing this children’s home, and if they are responsible and accountable for an issues that arise during its operations. If not, then you may need to challenge via the planning process. Do you have a resident’s association is similar?

A friend had a home for abused women and children next door to her very nice family house. The noise was horrendous and there appeared to be no supervision, they couldn’t use their garden in the end despite local councillors trying to improve things.Luckily they managed to sell, I know it’s ‘nimby’ but if you’ve invested all your earnings into a lovely house and garden, being unable to enjoy it is pretty awful. Conversely a drug rehab drop in amenity was put at the end of my ‘nice’ road.Everyone was horrified but it caused absolutely no issues at all, it was well controlled.

In our area, children are moved into children's homes from the age of 9 or 10, often with NO additional needs, other than not having parents able to care for them - purely due to a shortage of foster homes.

The idea that only children with high needs are in children's homes is very outdated. Usually providers pick much larger, detached, rural homes if they're setting themselves up as specialist therapeutic homes, as they need the space for more staff and to be away from accessible public transport (to reduce likelihood of teens running away for example)

Childrens homes do need to be in residential areas though - where else do you think children should live? Business parks? Industrial estates?

Thank you so much everyone. There's lots to think about.
We haven't been informed when the neighbour next door has applied for planning permission for various things (none of which have ever happened) so it's back to checking the planning applications every few days as experience means it's really impossible to trust him.
It really did seem from what he said that there would be women employed there to look after children.
A mother and baby home as far as I can see would cause no problems at all.
We moved here after retiring and did hope for a little peace and relaxation after doing aid work for many years.

It almost certainly wont end up being up to him who lives and works there anyway. A care agency/the council will rent if off him once permission is granted. Highly unlikely to be running it himself, even less likely to have much say over who lives in it.

It’s quite a nice extension of your aid work to support something like this!

we also have one, share a border with them but they’re not next door. The residents are very troubled older teenage boys, the police are there a lot. They caused problems with our property which I found quite easy to sort out because the home will be operated by a regulated company- you’re dealing with a professional organisation not some goon mad neighbours.

your neighbour will rent the property to care home business so it won’t be anything to do with him.

you are very unlikely to make an impact by protesting against the planning application. The one near us had 300 letters of objection and it made no difference- in fact,
the council went against their own planning policy and it made no difference- they are desperate for this type of accommodation.

@Turningandturning if you aren't being informed of planning applications then the Council should be putting up a site notice outside the house. The regulations require one or the other so it might be worth contacting the Council to check what their procedures are.

I work with children and young people. Unfortunately some people see setting up a home as a way to make money. They have no experience of supporting children, some of whom have a lot of challenges. From your description I’d be worried the home owner does not have the skills to own and run a home. Managers don’t stay so you can’t rely on employing people to do it all. The home would have to apply to Ofsted. Maybe talk to them?

AquaPeer I don't need an extension of my aid work and if I was well enough to do it