That ship has sailed

[Grooveisintheheartbaby]

My company want us back to the office 5 days a week. As far as I and colleagues are concerned that ship has sailed and we will not be coming back we will leave. AIBU to think that businesses need to accept that things changed in covid forever and they can't reverse it without massive disrest and unhappiness?

the ship may have sailed for a job you are in - if you currently hold a job that people are wFH a lot in, it's near impossible to row it back.

but the ship hasn't sailed for new roles has it? employers advertise for an in the office role. if you apply you know those are the terms.

quit your job if you want but you may find it harder to get a new role on your own terms.
employers have been royally fucked in this budget so are going to want more bang to the buck for each employee and will be cutting roles.

I think sometimes people feel like their employer is desperate to keep them. Most of the time, that's not true. People leaving as a result of a policy change like this is planned for and, indeed, welcomed.

This. ^ Too many people take the piss.

Most people in charge are men (as in the upper percentile earners). Most men (according to the posts on this site) are free to plough on at work, do little housework and childcare (and clock off early down the pub for some networking).

Working from home has enabled those who have been historically unable to commute to an office for traditional office hours (women, those with disabilities), to get shit done, work hard, often over the designated hours, and ‘shock horror’ get promoted!

We can’t be having that now, those who have demonstrated wfh and being productive are now too successful and need to be kept in check by those who like to spend their time monitoring ‘idleness’ in Teams, having pointless in person meetings and having their pub budget reduced.

I don’t understand this. Why do you need to schedule a call to talk to someone? I wfh and we just call each other when we need to talk, same as walking to their desk. It doesn’t need to be scheduled. Or just send them an instant message on teams. As long as people are sat in front of their laptop and not skiving then it’s no different than being in the office.

Exactly, it’s a lazy and inaccurate measuring stick. If I am up to my eyes in excel, or on a mobile call, or standing counting things (gasp, in the office) my teams goes orange after 5 minutes.

I get more done at home because I don’t get a constant stream of people coming to me to whinge about their kids/wife/neighbour’s cat (I’m female therefore I automatically care?!). My meetings are mostly with people from a mix of different sites so no benefit to being onsite in a meeting room. I do work when I’m wfh and because it’s project management it would very quickly be obvious if I was slacking to do the washing/walk the dog etc. I do wonder if the people who do those things actually have enough work for the hours they’re paid- what do they fill their day with when they’re onsite? 😅

I think firms who insist on 5 days in office will find that bites them when it comes to recruiting, yeah. I wouldn't take another role that didn't have at least 3 days a week WFH unless I was desperate and had absolutely no other option, which thankfully isn't likely in my line of work: it's made a huge difference to my life over the last 6 years and I won't be changing now.

Exactly, much easier now than trying to find someone in an office. Even easier when needing a chat with a group of people who may be out and about in different locations.

I'm just learning about this Teams thing now - I despise Teams, and am on there as little as possible. Must look like I'm never at work 😂

While there are undoubtedly a minority who have taken the piss royally while 'working' from home, this is easily observable and trackable by their managers, if they are even half up to the job. A half-decent manager will ensure the slackers are performing or manage them out.

A lot of the return to the office shtick is a simply a cover for poor management, lacking the necessary competence - easier to just say everyone has to be in the office 5 days a week than get your management to manage effectively.

its not ludicrous at all and not just temporary. I know several people who worked from home 5 days per week before covid. I used to do around 50% at home before covid.

an obsolete word that hasn't been in common usage since the 1700s, it was replaced with disquiet/unrest. You'd be hard pressed to find it in the dictionary any more.

This is word for word how my ex used to spend his days working from home minus the school runs. He would swan off to the butchers/greengrocer/wine shop when he felt like it, go for a run/bike ride whenever, spend hours in the kitchen with a recipe book and mooch around with his slippers and log burner on like he was a retired old man.

Even when he did go in for a meeting he would make sure to book a first class train and plan around which restaurant he wanted to try on expenses. Funny that whenever he was called out for it he would start feeling like he wanted to move on. Some people are just piss takers regardless of the circumstances.

My job is absolutely suited to majority WFH, and it also allows me to manage my disability alongside work. I worker harder and much longer hours than I ever did when I was office based. Being visible and present in the office does not mean you are productive and performing at a high level. If people are going to take the piss, they will do it whether they are in the office or at home.

I would leave too if I was asked to be in the office full time after 4 years at home - I would assume that those running the company are very out of touch and not very competent at managing performance issues.

My company recruits just fine with full time in the office despite it not being the industry norm.

Not everyone wants to WFH.

Absolutely this

the only way i'd be able to work now would be wfh, i'm disabled and doing 9-5 in an office 5 days a week would cripple me before the first week was out.. not without having to demand a lot of money spent on very expensive desk/chair set up to support my needs, wheelchair access, a disabled parking space, working lifts...etc

wfh requires none of that, and i can get on with my work and take breaks as/when needed.

Good for you. No-one I know worked from home before covid. Unless they were self employed!

Point is, lots of people DIDN'T work from home before covid, and DID work during it and after it, and now they want to stay working from home. There is no need for them to do so, and the employers know it.

Most people who want to carry on working from home (when their employer wants them back in the office,) want to work from home because they can swing the lead there. They pretend it's because it's better for them/they can be more productive etc, but clearly they are underperforming, and this is why the employer wants them back in the office.

As a few posters have said, people are free to leave the workplace, but good luck getting another work from home job. They are few and far between now.

Where I work we do 2 days a week in the office. I've looked at the logs and can see that productivity on the WFH days is around 33% compared to office days. Essentially it takes 3 WFH days to get the equivalent of 1 office day.

People will argue about productivity being better at home, but where I work the difference is noticeable.

my sil's work did just that, and she's also disabled and immune deficient, she got OH involved and they did an assessment and told her employer she needed to stay wfh, and to deny her/sack her if she had time off sick would be direct discrimination. she kept her job, and her wfh status.

When recruiters ring me the first thing I ask is how many days in the office. If it's more than two I end the conversation then. It's not for me being office based. I find it too distracting and I resent travel time. I actually think it's the travelling that annoys me the most. So much wasted time.

yes and even worse -maybe some of those men have been asked to help with school runs etc while at home so would conveniently like to go back to the office!

100% this! ^

I wouldn’t say wfh jobs are few are far between, it depends on the industry. In my circle of family and friends the majority work 100% from home, a few do a day a week in the office and only one friend works 3 days in office. One friend got told she had to start going in 2 days a week so she simply found a new job that allows 100% home working. It’s not that unusual.