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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think this budget will finish us off

1000 replies

BurnoutGP · 30/10/2024 22:12

I am a GP Partner of over 20 years. I am now senior partner for the last few years. We have seen year on year below inflation funding increase. With an explosion in demand and massive shift of work from secondary care. We have issues wirh recruitment.
Our partner income is shrinking year on year. We are now always overdrawn and this gets worse every month.
We just cannot soak up the MLW and NI without adequate resource uplift.
I think we will be done. I'm so very tired of the constant battle and the demand and anger while working "part time" 60hr weeks.
We will have to hand back our contract. And we wont be the only one. That will leave one surviving practice in my area.
I'm done.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
10
Zonder · 03/11/2024 12:26

Julen7 · 03/11/2024 11:53

Their spending from now on

Oh absolutely. Although we still have to bear in mind that they don't have as much money and have more things to salvage because of the last 14 years. I'm not including the possibility that labour may have won with a different leader. The fact is they didn't and the Tories had a free reign.

EasternStandard · 03/11/2024 12:26

rainingsnoring · 03/11/2024 12:09

You seem to be deflecting my criticism of the Tories' poorly thought out Rwanda policy by trying to deflect criticism onto Labour. They have been in power for just under 4 months. It was costing a great deal of money to house immigrants while they waited for a v long time for their cases to be heard under the Tories and it still is under Labour.
My other point was that I suspect neither of them actually want to significantly reduce the numbers anyway.

Most people seem to expect someone else to pay for them. As the current system stands, a small group of people are taxed very heavily to pay for most other people.

I agree with you on this point from your pp but on the asylum process the claim was made the costs wouldn't be as high. I doubt that will be the case as numbers are rising and smash the gangs will be expensive but pretty much ineffective. Actually worse than ineffective creating higher demand, risk and deaths

Julen7 · 03/11/2024 12:30

Zonder · 03/11/2024 12:26

Oh absolutely. Although we still have to bear in mind that they don't have as much money and have more things to salvage because of the last 14 years. I'm not including the possibility that labour may have won with a different leader. The fact is they didn't and the Tories had a free reign.

Well that wouldn’t be owning it, would it?

rainingsnoring · 03/11/2024 12:30

@EverythingAllatOnceAllTheTime I haven't made it binary, I clearly stated that Labour had made huge mistakes!
You seem to be trying to pin the blame on Corbyn for David Cameron's monumental stuff up in calling the referendum. I did say that Tories were brilliant at deflecting blame.😄
Re the pandemic- the Tory party was in power, not Labour. Another attempt to deflect blame.

I am not a Labour supporter and have already criticised their budget decision to raise employers NI/ NMW because of the knock on effects, such as the OP here. Perhaps we should actually blame it on the Tories for being so useless for 14 years that Labour got voted in. What do you think?

Maddy70 · 03/11/2024 12:30

Await news on how the huge amount pledged to the nhs will impact you.
My brother has a GP practice hes doing well so maybe look at your business model. Is it efficient? Look at it all objectively.
What can be done automatically, using booking systems and reminders. Etc

Consider training and offering botox etc

Zonder · 03/11/2024 12:32

Julen7 · 03/11/2024 12:30

Well that wouldn’t be owning it, would it?

They can only own things that are theirs!

Maddy70 · 03/11/2024 12:32

There is an uplift in the threashold though so if 4 of your employees are on MW you wont be paying anything at all!

rainingsnoring · 03/11/2024 12:35

EasternStandard · 03/11/2024 12:26

Most people seem to expect someone else to pay for them. As the current system stands, a small group of people are taxed very heavily to pay for most other people.

I agree with you on this point from your pp but on the asylum process the claim was made the costs wouldn't be as high. I doubt that will be the case as numbers are rising and smash the gangs will be expensive but pretty much ineffective. Actually worse than ineffective creating higher demand, risk and deaths

I didn't make that point and I wouldn't pretend to know what the figures will be in the future. Undoubtedly, there is a huge amount of money being spent.
Realistically, it an issue that is extremely difficult to tackle, made worse by the UK/ US, etc deliberately encouraging (even starting) wars which then massively increase the numbers of refugees. Assuming that any government actually wants to sig reduce inflation (I'm not convinced as I said already), they would need to start from the bottom and come up with a long term, planned immigration policy imo. Ditto the NHS. Ditto social care. Yet no government wants to do this. They just want to come up with sound bites and kick the can. I have no respect for any of them.

rainingsnoring · 03/11/2024 12:37

Maddy70 · 03/11/2024 12:32

There is an uplift in the threashold though so if 4 of your employees are on MW you wont be paying anything at all!

What do you mean by this? The threshold has been reduced.
With respect to running a general practice, with respect, it doesn't sound as if you know what you are talking about.

Julen7 · 03/11/2024 12:38

Zonder · 03/11/2024 12:32

They can only own things that are theirs!

Owning it would mean every tine RR made an unpopular decision on spending she would bite her tongue before she yet again put the blame on the black hole left by the Tories as a get out clause.

twomanyfrogsinabox · 03/11/2024 12:48

Rummly · 30/10/2024 22:38

I’ve followed the budget reasonably closely but I confess I’d missed the wider implications of the employers’ NI increase. Does it apply to all businesses in all areas, without amelioration for public v private sector - so schools, universities, the NHS, GPs’ practices, TfL, etc will all be hit, along with Starbucks, Barclays and Tescos?

I think the NHS is exempt but GP practises, care homes, child care providers and other ancillary businesses are not.

EverythingAllatOnceAllTheTime · 03/11/2024 12:49

Julen7 · 03/11/2024 12:30

Well that wouldn’t be owning it, would it?

Terrific reposte.

GillBeck · 03/11/2024 12:52

EverythingAllatOnceAllTheTime · 03/11/2024 12:25

Sorry, but its not quite so binary as you would have it.

Let’s address two major elements raised earlier.

Brexit came in two parts - the referendum, and execution of the withdrawal agreeement and process. Both parts necessitated Labour involvement, naturally. Corbyn attempted a policy of neutrality - of deliberate vagueness - of flip flops.
Look at the 2019 GE.

The pandemic was of course global in scale - we have no way of knowing how Labour would have handled it - but we can of course benchmark the Tories versus other western governments - shall we do that together?

I notice a PP keeps bringing up Brexit as a cause of economic woe, but completely ignores Covid which has had a much bigger impact. We don’t know how Labour would have responded to that but it we look to the unions; the teaching unions certainly called for more lockdowns, slower returns to school, less involvement of teachers in lockdown…

GillBeck · 03/11/2024 13:00

Coming back to the election results. It is also interesting that conservatives lost not because people shifted to Labour but because so many of their voters went in the other direction and shifted to the right - Reform.

EverythingAllatOnceAllTheTime · 03/11/2024 13:01

GillBeck · 03/11/2024 12:52

I notice a PP keeps bringing up Brexit as a cause of economic woe, but completely ignores Covid which has had a much bigger impact. We don’t know how Labour would have responded to that but it we look to the unions; the teaching unions certainly called for more lockdowns, slower returns to school, less involvement of teachers in lockdown…

Valid points - I had not considered those, thanks.

OneLemonGuide · 03/11/2024 13:10

MrsJoanDanvers · 03/11/2024 11:48

What kind of country do we live in if those jobs are only worth minimum wage? I’m not saying I doubt what you’re saying-but women-and it’s normally women-are being very underpaid imo for an important, skilled, life enhancing job. Something is wrong if by giving them a modest increase, places will close.

I never said they weren’t worth a decent wage… but the money for that has to come from somewhere. Either the Government directs tax money to it, or Councils increase Council Tax (which would be around 8% rise to cover the NLW and NI by modelling I’ve seen) or care homes close,
care workers are out of work, and we have a bed blocking crisis in hospitals costing billions!

RosesAndHellebores · 03/11/2024 13:16

GillBeck · 03/11/2024 12:52

I notice a PP keeps bringing up Brexit as a cause of economic woe, but completely ignores Covid which has had a much bigger impact. We don’t know how Labour would have responded to that but it we look to the unions; the teaching unions certainly called for more lockdowns, slower returns to school, less involvement of teachers in lockdown…

Absolutely.

There now seems to be a narrative thatthe budget was a mechanism to direct more money to the NHS. That's jolly good if waiting lists do decline, if we stop having maternity scandals, if we can start getting GP appointments and A&E departments revert to a first world service. Notwithstanding the fact that those who work for the NHS need to stop whingeing and start behaving towards patients with the same level of respect they would like to receive.

Just parked in Tescos and will see if I can find some unicorn food.----

OneLemonGuide · 03/11/2024 13:16

twomanyfrogsinabox · 03/11/2024 12:48

I think the NHS is exempt but GP practises, care homes, child care providers and other ancillary businesses are not.

Yes, anyone who is actually paid directly by public sector bodies will be funded (supposedly - we haven’t seen details yet).

Effectively the Government are saying that they couldn’t possibly make the efficiencies required to deal with the triple whammy of NLW increase, NI threshold rising, and NI rate rising, but we do expect everyone else to - it’s complete hypocrisy!

I’m no Tory, and I voted Labour in July, but I’m extremely disappointed, and it’s no exaggeration to say I wish the Tories were back, because what they are doing is a complete shambles that will have disastrous consequences…

OneLemonGuide · 03/11/2024 13:21

Maddy70 · 03/11/2024 12:32

There is an uplift in the threashold though so if 4 of your employees are on MW you wont be paying anything at all!

What? Where did you get that from?!
No, an employee on NLW working, say, 30 hours per week, will cost an employer about 11% more… Imagine your household bills increasing by 11% like they did when inflation rocketed the other year!

Rummly · 03/11/2024 13:23

GillBeck · 03/11/2024 12:52

I notice a PP keeps bringing up Brexit as a cause of economic woe, but completely ignores Covid which has had a much bigger impact. We don’t know how Labour would have responded to that but it we look to the unions; the teaching unions certainly called for more lockdowns, slower returns to school, less involvement of teachers in lockdown…

I will be fascinated to see what the covid ‘corruption’ commissioner manages to do (the office isn’t even called that, it’s ‘counter-fraud’: https://apply-for-public-appointment.service.gov.uk/roles/8362). The ‘corruption’ label is thrown around by Labour as a political slur with, at least so far, not a shred of evidence. It’s very cynical, especially since the allegation is made in the context of pandemic deaths and misery.

Quite why the existing anti-fraud bodies couldn’t have done this work is a mystery.

It seems to me likely that money recovered will be less than the officer and her/his staff will cost. Not least because fraud is completely different from allegation of bad bargain.

This is a substantial embarrassment for Labour in the making.

Appointment details – Covid Counter-Fraud Commissioner – Apply for a public appointment – GOV.UK

https://apply-for-public-appointment.service.gov.uk/roles/8362

rainingsnoring · 03/11/2024 13:29

rainingsnoring · 03/11/2024 12:35

I didn't make that point and I wouldn't pretend to know what the figures will be in the future. Undoubtedly, there is a huge amount of money being spent.
Realistically, it an issue that is extremely difficult to tackle, made worse by the UK/ US, etc deliberately encouraging (even starting) wars which then massively increase the numbers of refugees. Assuming that any government actually wants to sig reduce inflation (I'm not convinced as I said already), they would need to start from the bottom and come up with a long term, planned immigration policy imo. Ditto the NHS. Ditto social care. Yet no government wants to do this. They just want to come up with sound bites and kick the can. I have no respect for any of them.

To correct my mistake: sig reduce immigration NOT inflation. Hopefully it was still obvious what I meant.

OneLemonGuide · 03/11/2024 13:31

EasternStandard · 03/11/2024 10:44

Will councils be paying this higher rate?

I agree it hasn't really been talked about much but social care is a huge rising cost and councils are struggling already

Not just councils of course but people paying, when we have people staying in beds issues already

Edited

Assuming Councils apply the full
amount of extra social care grant received to cover the increased cost of NLW and NI (ie nothing for children’s social care and nothing for demographic change), that still
leaves a gap which would require - circa 6% Council Tax rise to cover this pressure alone.

At least the Tories provided extra funding for social care (though not nearly enough!), but Labour’s budget actually REDUCES funding for social care when you take into account NLW and NI. For social care, this budget is AUSTERITY ON STEROIDS!

After 15 years of the Tories, I’m beyond disappointed by RR and Labour. I genuinely don’t think they have a clue!

Zonder · 03/11/2024 13:48

Julen7 · 03/11/2024 12:38

Owning it would mean every tine RR made an unpopular decision on spending she would bite her tongue before she yet again put the blame on the black hole left by the Tories as a get out clause.

This doesn't make sense. So many of her decisions for the foreseeable future will be affected by the mess she inherited. It's not tabula rasa just because we have a new government, unfortunately.

EverythingAllatOnceAllTheTime · 03/11/2024 13:58

Zonder · 03/11/2024 13:48

This doesn't make sense. So many of her decisions for the foreseeable future will be affected by the mess she inherited. It's not tabula rasa just because we have a new government, unfortunately.

Hang on.

Reeves has addressed the alleged 22 bn black hole via the budget, and the Government have made various public sector wage settlements, as well as promised additional funding for the NHS etc.

At what stage do you consider they should be accountable for their own actions?

Be serious, please.

justasking111 · 03/11/2024 14:03

Look the next few budgets are really going to hurt. I don't agree that careful savers should shoulder the burden, nor car owners but we're easy targets

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