To think parents should bring babies to restaurants?

[BePoisedPlumViper]

I get that parents want to enjoy dining out, but isn’t it inconsiderate for those of us looking for a peaceful meal?

Title meant to say SHOULDN’T

If you’re offended by certain groups of people being in public places, which don’t have any rules as to who can use them, then yes, you should stay at home. I’m not the one with the issue, you are, so I don’t need to stay at home. It doesn’t sound like you can cope with the noises of children though, so perhaps you should avoid places that don’t ban them?
You don’t set the rules, and you also don’t get to dictate what others do. If I want to take my baby to a nice restaurant, I’ll do just that. If he cries, and I think going outside will help, I will, but he’s not a grumpy baby, and as we have gone out to restaurants with him from being about a week old it’s not something that bothers him. Perhaps you should appeal to the restaurants- all of whom provide high chairs by the way. You could suggest some sort of segregation? Certain types of people in one section and everyone else in another?

You sound like an absolute treat and your segregation comment is just childish.

At no point did I claim I got to 'set the rules' or 'dictate what others do', although, ironically, you seem to have no problem in dictating what others do by ordering them to stay at home.

Your defensiveness frankly puzzles me given that you claim your baby doesn't cry much in restaurants and you take him out if he does. Unless you're being economical with the truth and this thread has touched a nerve, I'm slightly baffled as to why you're taking this so personally. 🤔

Erm, you literally told me to stay at home or only go to Hungry Horse, so yes you did. I’m defending my right to take my baby out in public, and I don’t think parents with babies should have to ‘remove’ their babies if they cry. They are babies, that is what babies do. If my baby cries and it’s raining outside, or it’s really hot or cold, or I don’t think it’ll help at all, no I’m not going to go outside purely because someone sat in the restaurant might get mildly cross.
What touches a nerve for me is people like you, who treat babies like they’re some kind of disease and don’t deserve to be in certain places because they might spoil your enjoyment. I’d rather sit next to a crying baby than someone tutting and huffing at others with just as much right to be there.

Young families need all the support they can get, most people manage their babies quite well.

It depends on the kids I think.
It seems that many don't realise it's common decency to not destroy the experience for everyone else if their child isn't quiet.

I understand how hard it is, I have two young ones. 8 months old and 2 years old. I've seen people's faces drop when they see me being sat nearby but my bag is full of stuff to keep them occupied and if they're not quiet, I will get up and take them away from the area. A quick re set is usually enough to cure boredom and restore general happiness.

You know nothing about me so you don't get to generalise about 'people like me'. I like babies and children and enjoy being around them most of the time. But when they're crying/screaming in a restaurant it benefits no one, including the baby. I did read that you said your baby isn't grumpy, which suggests that the crying issue doesn't often come up for you (hence my puzzlement that you're so on the defensive), but are you really saying that if he was screaming his head off you wouldn't take him somewhere else to comfort him?

You talk about your right to take your baby out in public (which I didn't dispute, btw). Rights come with responsibilities, in this case being a considerate member of society. A bit of crying in a restaurant, I agree, no biggie. But full-on screaming is different, and plenty of parents do sit there and let their children scream their heads off and do nothing, ruining other people's evenings out in the process. Plus if the kid is that upset it suggests to me that they're overtired and should be at home sleeping.

I'm going to give the rest of the inaccurate assumptions you made about me the response they deserve and ignore them.

Depends on the baby and the restaurant!

Yes, people like you: people who complain that babies cry in PUBLIC place where they have every right to be. People who have either never had a baby or it was so long ago that they’ve forgotten what it was like, and come onto a parenting website and make goady comments about babies.

Why are you puzzled that I’m defending other parents? I am in the thick of it and whilst I have been so lucky with my baby being ‘easy’, I see parents every day struggling with babies who aren’t. I’ve been there, recently, at the doctor’s surgery when my baby was crying because he felt so poorly, and the woman opposite me sat there glaring and tutting, with her fingers in her ears. It was pouring down with rain, I couldn’t go outside with him. If I go for a meal and there’s a couple with a baby and it cries, I feel for them, because I know that they were desperately hoping that baby would be quiet and they’re anticipating the horrible looks.

You can’t assume that a crying child means they’re tired. You sound absolutely clueless about babies.

First of all, Mumsnet is not solely a parenting website. Glad we got that out of the way.

Secondly, you're making plenty of assumptions yourself. I don't glare, tut or make comments when babies cry because I recognise it's what they do. It's rude and unhelpful when people do that. But I am entitled to think what I like of parents who could do something to minimise stress on a crying baby and be considerate of other people in the vicinity, and they simply can't be arsed to do it because they don't want their spag bol to go cold. It is naive and unreasonable to expect a wholly sympathetic response to a crying baby in a predominantly adult environment. Your waiting room example isn't the same thing at all.

No, I can't 'assume' that a crying child means they're tired. But sometimes - often - it does. And if you're lugging your baby round restaurants in the evening it's fairly likely that crying might sometimes indicate tiredness. I'd be sceptical if you claimed that had never happened.

Your right to take your baby to a restaurant does not trump the rights of other people to have a peaceful evening out. It's a 'PUBLIC' space for them too, and their comfort also matters. How do you know they haven't come out, potentially having paid for childcare, for the express purpose of having a break from their own kids, which then gets shattered because other parents can't be arsed to arrange childcare?

But anyway, as you're so completely closed to anyone's opinion except your own, and uninterested in reasoned debate, I'm out. Enjoy your day.

Hate it. I know you could argue that both parties pay the same, but I'm less likely to go back if something is ruined by a screaming child.

I mean, if you were out for a romantic meal and I just stood in the corner screaming, you'd be pretty pissed too. It's basically saying your happiness/convenience trumps 50 other people in the restaurant.

(I know this will be an unpopular opinion)

Romantic, fine dining restaurants then I’m with you, they are such inappropriate environments for babies and young children.

Pubs with restaurants and your average eatery, totally disagree with you, as long as they aren’t screaming and running around feral, babies are part of society. This country is full of paedophobics, it’s sad.

I was in a restaurant on Sunday with DD5 and there was a new born crying maybe ten feet away

It didn't bother me in the slightest because I've been through that. It's just a baby being a baby

It would bother me if it was a newborn (a fourth trimester baby wants skin to skin in a quiet environment where the mother can concentrate on positioning and latch to establish feeding). I don't like seeing newborns being paraded around in the evenings when they just want to be snug on their parent and feel safe.

Babies are fine. Young kids, not always. We just adjust times we eat out. When the kids were little we always ate out early but now they're older and are fine eating later or old enough to stay alone, I'd rather not have kids running about if we fancy a quiet meal. Sometimes it doesn't bother me, but if we've had a head hammering week, we book somewhere for after 9pm or a place that isn't often frequented with young kids.

“And if you're lugging your baby round restaurants in the evening it's fairly likely that crying might sometimes indicate tiredness”

Ah, and it becomes clear. Absolutely no clue about the sleep habits of babies! You’ve made your mind up about the behaviours of babies based on… who knows?

Your right to go out for a meal does not trump mine. I have every bit as much of a right as you. You don’t have a right to silence in a restaurant. “Cant be arsed to arrange childcare”… I don’t want childcare. I want to take my baby with me. If parents want a child free night, and it’s so desperately important that they see and hear no children, then go to an over 18 location.

And no, Mumsnet is not solely a parenting website. But the clue is kind of in the name, and the advertising, and the majority of the topics. So to comment on a post and speak with apparent authority about the behaviour of babies, when you seemingly have no experience, and appear to be actually very anti children, is really rather goady.

Do babies even enjoy going out to restaurants?

Screw the parents and the fact they'd like to not cook for an evening/celebrate a family birthday then😄 we only focus on the child's happiness these days.

I wouldn’t bring a baby to a very high end restaurant, but generally I think it’s fine. Most parents are extremely considerate about stepping outside if the baby is fussy, and the mere presence of a baby doesn’t bother me at all.

The fourth trimester is three months long. Are the mothers of three month old babies still expected to be sitting topless at home in silence, trying to figure out latch? What if their latch and supply are fine by then? What if she’s bottle feeding? What if she’s recognising that her mental health matters too and that it’s ok if that means going to a restaurant with her baby so she can experience some element of normality while maintaining close contact with her baby?