To have reservations about a friendship with a woman who refers to Israel's actions in Gaza as a genocide?

[Oodiks]

I like this woman a lot, but we have very differing world views, specifically her belief that Israel is committing genocide in Gaza.

We work at a university and were coming back from lunch together when she commented that she was pleased the protestors hadn't come back. I agreed, noting how nerve wracking it must have been for Jewish students on campus to run the gauntlet of pro-Palestinian / anti-Zionist posters in the encampment.

We'd been talking about the American election over lunch, and I thought we'd agreed that Kamala Harris was the better candidate for her views on climate change, if nothing else, but then my 'friend' commented on Biden/Harris sending arms "to support the genocide" and I was left kind of speechless.

Am I being unreasonable to feel unsure about continuing this friendship?

Would you live in Iran, where women are under house arrest and forbidden from speaking or laughing in public?

surely a scholar would be familiar that Iranian women are free to go out meet friends work and make their own living ?
traditional jobs a side , There are world famous Iranian female Film directors , musicians , look up the Iranian Orchestra and see yourself .
female athletes who have competed in various Olympic tournaments and won, recently two medals at Paris Olympics .

OP has confused Iran with Afghanistan - how embaressing for them

Yes, and casually ignoring the millions of muslim women worldwide living full and productive lives, having careers and success. If your focus is only on ‘muslims in x country’, then your focus is ‘x country’, not muslims.

This. They say they are a democracy but complain when they’re judged by the same standards as other democracies.

Every war has its propaganda war, and it seems to be working a treat on social media. If you support Palestine (NOT Hamas) you must be anti Semitic, if you support Israel you are anti Islam. And if you dare to suggest that the situation is complicated and nuanced then you are the worst, and are entitled and privileged because you don't pick a side. We are all being played here.
NB, it should go without saying that I am not talking about people directly affected by this, including people of Israel, who are being screwed over by Netanyahu themselves.

It is really hard to find people who totally agree with your views and if you generally try to align yourself with people who share the same opinions you will live in an echo chamber where viewpoints are not discussed, challenged and defended. They then become entrenched beliefs based on groupthink rather than a defendable position based on critical examining why you have a particular viewpoint and having to critically argue why you take a particular stand . I would challenge the argument not the person and it may strengthen your friendship.

By listening, you can gain insight into her views and her beliefs and by using evidence and data to back up your discourse you can challenge her thesis. She may challenge yours and by having to defend your view with actual evidence and argument to back up your claims you may find either your opinions are stronger or they do lack credence. You may eventually find either a synthesis of ideas whereby you find common ground or you may find that one particular viewpoint is better suited to evidential scrutiny. By cutting off someone with differing views, you are not giving yourself the opportunity to defend what you think is right and to actually understand why you think in a certain way and it will remain a belief system rather than a rational and reasoned position based on a foundation of an understanding of the politics, background, facts and circumstances of both sides. The lack of discourse is what contributes to the very polarised situation that we have at the moment.

Yeah. Don't be friends with anyone who challenges your world view. 👌🏽

Again thats the not point of your AIBU. Start a new thread.

@Oodiks still ignoring my posts?

That's fine. Just one last thought.

Islamaphobia is just as bad as antisemitism.

Consider where you fall in the spectrum. You are failing at every turn to consider this conflict is, primarily a humanitarian disaster.

Muslim lives are not worth less than Jewish ones. Your posts demonstrate a lack of critical thought about a highly politicised issue that has and continues to cost the lives of innocent people. Your one dimensional assessment of a multifaceted issue probably should impede a friendship with a "lefty".

Own your political beliefs, stop sitting on the politically stateless fence. You are an Islamaphobe, who deliberately overlooks the suffering of thousands of people because it's an uncomfortable truth.

Genocide, mass murder, call it what you like. The Palestinians that are dying / stateless are not in control they are just sitting ducks.

Hear hear 👏🏼

Nobody in this fight is in the right. Everybody is in the wrong. It will never, ever be settled. Best we just face these facts and move on with our own lives to be honest. We can't help it or stop any of the belligerents.

There were attempts to settle this issue. The Oslo accords would have brought about peace but were stalled by the assassination of the Israeli PM Yitzhak Rabin by a right wing terrorist. Lapid and Gantz have also been more pragmatic at attempting solutions including the discussion of a two state solution but Netanyahu have blocked any discourse and idea of peace to serve not the interests of Israel but his own self-interest to escape from corruption charges by prolonging the time he is in power by escalating the conflict, ostensibly to also show that he is a strong leader and appeal to the right wing in Israel. There are people who have tried to stop the conflict and end the wars but vested interests, self-interest and entrenched ideology rather than pragmatism has stopped the ending of this conflict.

why should we care? Well the problem was created by the UK and then exacerbated by the US. It impacts trade routes and increases the price of oil. It kills and displaces millions of people. It can cause an escalation and spread of conflict that will transcend borders based on the spheres of influence of the sole and major/minor powers in the area and around the world. It risks destabilisation of the countries of the region causing the sort of power vacuum that allowed groups like ISIL, ISIL, IS to flourish. This risks all sorts of repercussions that will impact the UK. Which is why people need to take an interest and try and impact policy.

But did you see the bikini that Jordan was wearing on holiday in Femail and did you know that Vardy’s lawyers ate at Nobu?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protests_against_the_Russian_invasion_of_Ukraine

All true, to an extent (the British part, we're partly to blame but we only controlled Palestine for 20 years, the Ottomans, what, 500?). We still can't do anything about it. I'd build a wall around the entire area and leave them to it given the chance.

Also Netanyahu doesn't read mumsnet. Or watch protests in the UK, or look at the cute "stop the genocide" posters in windows.

100%

Agree

So opposing Israel wiping out another nation is OK because to criticise it would be anti semitic? Would you feel that what is happening in Gaza was wrong if say (hypothetically) Egypt was wiping this nation out?

I think protests in the UK are largely aimed at the British government's policy, rather than seeking to influence the government of Israel directly.

Which will have zero effect.

Little effect but personally I don't think it will have no effect. The government have already suspended some arms to Israel, the public pressure is forcing them to act even if it may just be symbolic.
Now France has called on a total arms embargo too and all these things add up.

@Zahariel Also Netanyahu doesn't read mumsnet. Or watch protests in the UK, or look at the cute "stop the genocide" posters in windows.

It is naive if you think the Israeli government don't have think tanks and social media monitoring, like other governments also do. They spend a large amount of money to influence public thinking and most certainly pay close attention to it.

I am very aware that Israel has the second largest PR machine, second only to China. But their actions are not influenced in the slightest by what we say or do here or indeed, anywhere.

That's completely irrelevant to the points made.

The UK is the third largest arms manufacturer on the planet. To think that we will ever stop sending Israel, one of the biggest users, arms, is hilarious.

We made a token gesture, of suspending one small specific type of arms, which was just a sop, and will be quietly reinstated very soon.

Protests - no affect, arms embargo, no affect. The US president, no affect

just stop bothering, it's a waste of everyones time.

Wow I knew they spent alot on PR but didn't know it was that large. And yet they are so terrible at it despite spending so much!