Who is being unreasonable here...

[hampsteadfeat]

Long story short..

My childhood and one of my closest friends, of forty years and I , recently went away to a yoga retreat. We haven't spent a weekend fully together since we were young and single.

I am a lone parent. She isn't. We each have three kids all between 12-16.
When I state' lone ' I mean lone as in I have little or no support. One of my kids has autism.
My friend is married and her husband is mostly hands on.
I was very anxious for the first day or so. I couldnt relax as my kids were with different families and needed contact for various reasons.
Her kids were at home with her husband.

She seemed very irritated with me. She felt I was agitated and unsettled and suggested more counselling and a lot of woo to support myself. I am time poor and low in funds.

I had really thought that I was doing well. I have lots of counselling and am putting strategies into place to support myself as best I can eg sleep, water, nutrition, exercise and meditation.

I could see that I was unsettled, I couldn't switch off and was anxious as one of my kids was very upset at home.

My friend is very anal about times, activities, plans. I am not as I do not have that luxury.and frankly I don't live by a clock .
I just went along with her plans as it suited me also but she was definitely annoyed that I couldn't just enjoy this retreat by switching straight into relax mode.
Who is unreasonable here ?

Naturally you're going to be anxious in that situation. If you could just switch off and enter relaxed mode, we'd all do it.

Nobody is being unreasonable. Or more so than the other.

having a husband, even a hands on one, doesn’t mean a stress free life. Being solo and having a kid with autism dies t mean you monopolise stress and worry.

you both lack understanding, which is reasonable given you don’t walk in each others shoes.

i would be annoyed if my restful yoga retreat was made stressful, but I wouldn’t blame you for worrying about your children

Your friend could have been a lot more understanding and helped you with being less anxious about your kids, assuming they were safe, being a bit upset for being away from you isn't going to harm them, they'll survive a weekend without you even if they're upset and stressed, you obviously need a break. But I also imagine it's irritating being on a retreat with someone who is not present and fretting about things that probably didn't need too much fretting.

You sound like polar opposites of each other so it's probably hard to see things from each other perspective but perhaps if she tried to put herself in your shoes and if you tried to adopt some of her time management skills your life would be easier and she would have been kinder.

She was possibly hoping this weekend would be good for you and felt you weren't fully embracing it and was irritated on your behalf.

She's the more unreasonable one I'd say but, it possibly would have done you the world of good to be more like her for the weekend.

Sorry you're having a stressful time.

Thanks. I guess she can and always could. She can compartmentalise really easily and I guess her husband being at home with sole responsibility of their kids was a huge load off for her too.
I'm disappointed tbh.
While I know her concerns were from a place of kindness, I can't help but feel misunderstood and actually disrespected. Her tone was irritated and at times condescending. The thing is.... she is very aware of my circumstances so I'm surprised that she was so put off by my obvious jumpiness.
It didn't affect her personally so why be so irritated? To add, she has a need to always be right/ correct in her opinions and assumptions.

Well, you feel how you feel, but I’d certainly be monumentally irritated if, barring unforeseen emergencies, the friend I’d gone on a yoga retreat with was wrecking my head being ‘agitated’. Maybe try a lower stakes, less expensive meeting next time — if you are regularly stressed and anxious, this was a poor choice of activity to meet a friend at, and it clearly didn’t work for either of you.

It is actually extremely stressful being with someone who is very anxious and stressy themselves, whether you had reasonable justification to be or not, Anxious stressful people make those around them anxious and stressed!

She needed to be more understanding but I'm ot sure you realise your impact on her or as someone else said, you might not know what stresses she may have in her life and she may have needed a relaxing weekend too.

My agitation had no bearing on her experience of the retreat itself. I believe that she wanted me to behave in a certain way ie shut off my life once we'd walked into the retreat , as she had. I was not talking about my feelings to her but rather quiet and introspective.
I cannot shut off my mind like that as that's not who I am.

My friend is very anal about times, activities, plans. I am not as I do not have that luxury.and frankly I don't live by a clock .

You are VU here. If i have booked a retreat with activities, for sure i want to be doing those, not as acting as unpaid support human for a friend who is stressed.

If you are time poor, btw, "being anal" about a schedule would do you the world of good, OP.

You say it didn’t affect her personally - but it did. You were on a Yoga retreat which is about peacefulness and calm and you were stressed* *and agitated about your kids which would impact on the mood. And you felt upset because she wasn’t sympathetic to your stress as your kids were missing you - but in reality there nothing life threatening with the kids.

In future might be better if you choose something less intense as an experience as you both respond differently to being away from your families - both for valid reasons.

Neither of you.
Your behaviour was completely understandable but so was hers.
She wanted a chilled out time and your anxiety impacted that, nobody is at fault

Neither unreasonable, both in very different head spaces. It's a world of difference coming to an event as a married supported person with three kids at home with their father and as a lone unsupported parent with three kids in different places and you being the only point of contact should anything go wrong.

I think if anyone is being unreasonable it's you being too hard on yourself and expecting not to feel like your mind was elswehere, and not being able to switch off entirely immediately.

I've had to come away from friends as life has rolled on because we were no longer aligned, and that's okay. That's life, we all change.

Go for a cocktail next time.

YABU.

Well that's because the expectation of a yoga retreat is quite literally to switch your mind off and mentally relax. Like someone else said, clearly the totally wrong activity to have chosen. Definitely do something with much less specific expectations next time.

You said in your original post she seemed irritated at your agitation, so clearly she was aware of your mental state even if you were trying to internalise it, it was clearly obvious to her. If you are trying to meditate, or be meditative over a few days, if you are sat next to someone you know is agitated it's quite stressful and will definitely impact on your own experience, relaxation and mental state. which would have been irritating.

It was just the wrong choice of activity. Hopefully you'll find a mutually better one next time.

We did every single activity on time and as planned. What I meant was outside of that time...
Particular about bed times, meal times, free times etc when there was no need for exact times.
For example... we will go to bed at nine as we will be up early. We will eat dinner at seven so we don't get indigestion etc.
Majority on her terms and she became quite unsettled if there was any alternatives suggested but that is the way she has always been. She is adorable but a very strong personality who likes her own way and feels her plans are best.

I think she was BU and she sounds very much lacking in empathy. You feeling agitated sounds entirely reasonable given the circumstances. I'm sorry you're having such a tough time and hope you had a chance to relax a bit despite the worries and the regimented timing (enforced bed time at 9 is excessive!).

Hi I’m sorry your friend couldn’t be abit more understanding. Someone who has full support and can switch off when away from their children can not understand why you feel the way you do. I have lost a lot of friends along the way for reasons like this. One of my sister who has one child (who now is 16) could always make last minute plans to go out either leaving her son at my mums or other family members or his dad ect I couldn’t do that with 4 kids with one also being on the spectrum, and she always got irritated by that. It really upset me. We all want to switch off but not all can, fortunate are those who can and good on you. But shouldn’t be annoyed at those who can’t. If she knows you’re situation and she’s been a friend from a long time she should not have planned a trip like this rather something more suitable. I know you probably wanted to just try it out and see how it goes but now you no for next time. My younger sister once had a masseuse come over to the house as a treat for me just to unwind while she kept all the kids busy in another room. I felt so much more relaxed that kids are just in the next room.

Right ok, well this is slight y different 'who is being unreasonable' to what your initial post implied.

You're clearly polar opposites, she likes a regimented strict planned schedule, and probably gets stressed and anxious without one, you are a more roll with the punches, she's proactive and pre-empting you are reactive and possibly fire fighting.

You both need to consider meeting in the middle. It's definitely unreasonable of her to expect you to do strictly as you are told but you could consider that a more structured day and better time management might help you with your own life as you say you are time poor. With 3 kids, good time management could really really help you.

You both need to be better friends and see things from each others perspective and compromise when together.

You have a child with ASD and you're critical of your friend who is very strict in her schedule with logical reasoning who is irritated by your poor time management.

Sorry @hampsteadfeat I'm going with YABU, your friend could be autistic and routine and planning is how she copes with life, even to relax.

Your autistic child may also become very much like this and need to know exactly what is happening next and why. You may need to adopt this lifestyle yourself to survive and help your child cope.

OP I'm also a lone parent and I think friends can be tone deaf to our situation.

I had a rare child free weekend with another friend who has also had kids with SEN. We have challenged lives as well as working full time.

We went to visit a friend for the weekend with no kids who decided the best use of our Saturday morning was to make us volunteer on a stand at a veg garden charity then walk 3 miles for lunch (I refused the walk and made comment about the volunteering) I love my friend dearly but she had absolutely no clue.

My point is, communication about life styles and your boundaries is important. Nothing you did pushed her boundaries but she was pushing yours and clearly making judgments.

I'd have a catch up with her at some point and just have a calm conversation about it.

Yes, I was going to say this too, your friend seems to have some possible autistic traits if any deviation from a strict schedule, which plans for potential future problems (indigestion while doing yoga for example), makes her stressed and anxious. It may do you well to understand your friend some more if you may have a child who is similar in the future.

My friend isn't autistic but she can be mildly controlling and likes her own way.
She eats, sleeps, relaxes at exactly the same times each day and while she can deviate , if she gets an opportunity to keep her routine, she does this. She has been described as selfish more than anal but I find her to be anal on certain areas.

you think there was no need to adhere to timings, but your companion clearly did. Perhaps she wanted to only follow the times so she could literally let her mind go blank. And there you were blethering on about your issues.

She was trying to tell you something, but you (rightly in your eyes) had other issues.

Learn from this. Both of you.

I did not blether about a single thing.
I went along with her daily rituals.

OP, you asked who was being unreasonable here, but you seem absolutely convinced it was your friend, whom, in your subsequent posts you describe as routine-bound, ‘controlling’, ‘anal’, and ‘always needing to be right’.

If you’ve known her for so long, surely it was clear to you that a weekend with someone who wanted to adhere to a strict routine, while shutting off the world outside was not going to work with someone ‘jumpy’, ‘agitated’ and unable for whatever reason to leave her outside life at the door?

Neither of you could meet the other’s needs. No one is ‘unreasonable’. It was just a mismatch of expectations and capacities for a weekend.

Well it did affect her so that is probably why she was annoyed. She planned a relaxing retreat and your stress was impacting that. Surely that's why everyone chooses to go on a retreat, to unwind and destress. I can understand why you were stressed but it seems you can't see other perspectives judging by your responses which are quite bitchy. Maybe she likes routine and schedules because that manages her stress? Instead you just call her anal and cast blame. You seem self involved.