To think increasing pension age isn’t going to add up?

[Tiredandconfused23]

I was reading a few recent studies about the employment situation for over 50s, basically confirming how this age group struggles to return to work, is more likely to be laid off and/or forced into early retirement and how a far higher proportion are in poverty and/or insecure employment than other age groups. And how, despite years of pushback against age bias, it’s only increased in recent years.

If we accept this, I can’t help feeling the idea that increasing the pension age so we work longer, thus save money on benefits, isn’t going to add up. Many people in their fifties would happily carry on working - the issue is many employers may not want us. You can’t keep working if there’s no job to work at.

AIBU to think we may soon be facing a load of older people on benefits, often through no fault of trying, rather than claiming a pension? Would this be seen as still more favourable by the Government?

Or you can go into marketing or sales.

Younger ex-English teachers I know have gone into those areas and been very successful.

Ex-Maths and Science I know have gone into IT (or into transport jobs).

Those jobs cover a wide range of industries.

@Teateaandmoretea

When I was at primary and secondary school very few people had a mother that didn't work even part-time. In fact I could count on less than one hand every year the number of mothers who didn't work at all. Most of the none working mothers had a child with a disability and/or they had large families and a baby/toddler.

My older siblings are boomers and so are most of their wives. (I'm Gen X and my youngest 2 siblings are millennials.) They have either retired early due to ill health or are still working and retiring in the next year or so. (You can work out their rough ages.) Friends parents who are boomers, as they had them young, and are now retired had both sexes working.

With the silent generation who were my parents and some other people's parents, again many women worked. Some had lost their jobs in the 60s/70s due to getting married so the working class ones did menial jobs e.g. cleaning while the middle class ones waited until their children were upper primary/junior school age then went back to work as teachers and nurses. My own mum had a period where she didn't work at all as she had 3 children under 5.

The WASPI women were only shafted because the government did not repeatedly state in the national media retirement ages were going to rise. IMHO government did this on purpose as they didn't want strikes and riots like they have had in other countries when rising retirement ages.

@CoughedBulldozerNumber you can defer your state pension - https://www.gov.uk/deferring-state-pension

You actually have to claim it as you don't get it automatically. I only found this out because a OAP I know didn't claim it immediately and their other benefits had stopped.

As you pay tax on your pension(s) including state pension then you have to work out if you are better off deferring it or not.

@Reugny I don't think you understand what I said. I know you can defer state pension. The reform I am proposing would make it possible to do a 50:50 split of drawing half a pension and continuing to work half-time with mandatory deferral until such time as one is no longer capable of working.
It's not something I particularly want but it seems better than the vast numbers of fit, healthy and capable people aged 65-85 living without doing any work at all when they are perfectly capable of contributing. Maybe there could be an exemption for people who are doing at least 25hrs a week of voluntary work. But an option to do this is no solution at all.

with mandatory deferral until such time as one is no longer capable of working

So, essentially you work until you lose your marbles?

@CoughedBulldozerNumber With the current income tax threshold and the NMW level it doesn't make sense.

I have relatives who draw their private pension(s) but also work, plus I have friends who draw all their pensions and volunteer. I have been in the room when a few of them have worked out how much pension they were going to get and whether they should work or not based on the tax they will pay.

Joking aside, I was thinking about this today. I'm older and do need to do some exercise. Problem, I'm bone idle as well though. I could really do with some sort of job that involves a lot of walking. So I thought maybe I could be a postman
This could be an ideal occupation for retired or older people who want a bit of exercise, but need to be forced to do it. People could sign up for just two hour shifts in their local area. Post could be dropped off in the morning at their house, then they go out on foot, with a little trolley thing and deliver it. Earns the old person a little bit of money, keeps them active and delivers the post. I'd sign up!

Dog walking could be a good part time job if you want to get out and about. Might be easier on the back than carrying around all that post too.

As someone who’s worked in marketing, I’m not sure I’d recommend it - consciously or not, it has a bit of a bad rep for age bias, unless you’re at the very senior exec level.

It’s also one of the most insecure sectors - in house, CEOs often have their own ideas and unrealistic expectations and if these aren’t met you can find yourself restructured out fairly quickly for someone they feel, will know more than you do (but who often ends up in a rinse and repeat cycle). It’s also one of the first teams to be cut when times are tight. There’s an obsession with innovation and new ideas over tried and tested experience which usually manifests in younger staff being favoured over older ones. Conversely, the freelance market is currently saturated and highly competitive too.

I’m seriously thinking of changing career, because when I look around, I don’t know a single marketing person over 55 who isn’t either freelance or senior management.

I can appreciate that many people want to go on working and wouldn't think it was the end of the world to go on for longer, but some (including me) find their jobs increasingly stressful and don't want to continue. Giving up work voluntarily would mean little or no benefit.
Equally there are people in more manual jobs which would be difficult to do as they get older, or jobs that involve standing all day.

I deferred my pension and got very little extra for doing it. It really isn't worth it.

I agree, I would like to see more of this too.
I'm 60 and have been seeking part time/job share for a while now, but there is very little out there. Employers really seem to hate part time workers but for some people it's a big sell.
Also, as many of us are having to work later in life, and fit this in around caring duties etc, it makes sense for an employer to offer this.

We’re not even replacing the population now, birth rate is plummeting because 20-30 somethings are finding it hard to put down roots. So who’s going to be paying the taxes to fund the state pension in 20-30 years? It’s guaranteed to go away and a lot of people will have a terrible retirement with next to no money while the population dwindles further and further.

Last year, we advertised a full time admin job at £39k on all the job boards, including Restless, as we hoped to get someone with a lot of experience and maturity but the only people who applied were those who couldnt speak English well and those with no office experience. It was bizarre. You'd expect to get lots of interest for a job like that in the Midlands but nada.

Will that just be state pension there's no money for or pension credit as well? Because as it stands if you don't qualify for a state pension you get pension credits. So despite being told to work to ensure you get your state pension qualifying years, if you don't, you'll just get topped up by pension credits anyway.

No government in the future will just let pensioners starve. The same way they don't let those now who don't qualify for state pension starve.

What choice will they have? With the current number of babies being born, in 20-30 years time we'll have far more pension age people and far fewer working age people. More retirees needing more money but fewer workers paying less money. It doesn't add up and it will break hard.

Is it just pensioners who will have money cut? What about those on disability benefits? Or any other type of benefit paid out to people?

It depends on your field and where your at your career. Senior positions are less likely to discriminate on age but people that are middle and bottom of their career suffer a lot of discrimination because many managers prefer hire younger people.
I work in tech and can still find a job because I have a nich set of skill but often I am the eldest among my colleagues.
They only hire me because they can't find someone young with my skills. The prejudice is very obvious.

I'm very surprised that those in their 50's cannot find work. I am 50 and could walk into any number of low skilled jobs tomorrow. Delivery drivers are in demand. So are warehouse operatives and they were until very recently offering mega incentives to gain an HGV license.

Could it be that those of us in this age group need to reassess our desirability in regard to those jobs requiring new and higher skils.

@ATenShun yes there are loads of low skilled jobs but many in their 50s don't want to work for a pittance and be treated badly. I don't want a job where I'm told at a moments notice they don't need me today, I don't get any rights or benefits etc. As far as I'm concerned I'm not here to give employers the benefit if my experience, maturity and hard work ethic for their shit pay and indifferent attitude. I would rather do voluntary work than that and that's what u do. I appreciate I'm lucky I can afford to do this.

I do see this as a problem. How is it going to be managed. Badly, me thinks.

Are they just going to keep increasing the age indefinitely up to 67 to 68 to 70 to 75?

You also had to pay for medical or maternal care…🤷‍♀️. Who would want to return to that?

So did you fill the post?

This bit is where your answer differs from the OP question ''I would rather do voluntary work than that and that's what u do. I appreciate I'm lucky I can afford to do this.''

That of course is entirely fine for you. But at the same time it means you would be unable to claim any benefits.
In another thread I commented that there needs to be a shift in what jobs we consider more important and pay them accordingly. Care Industry is one that comes to mind. The wages within that should be increased massively due to their skills being in demand.

I think “until very recently” is key. Someone I know actually seriously considered changing to being an HGV driver, however quick research amongst various driver forums revealed things have changed significantly in the last year or so. Apparently a lot of haulage firms are going out of business because of the cost of living crisis, meaning there’s now a surplus of experienced drivers looking for work. Newly trained drivers are struggling to find jobs now.

I also have to consider I’m a single parent. Zero-hour contracts and gig jobs, like Deliveroo and Amazon drivers might be available but, by nature, are insecure and won’t guarantee putting food in the table for me and the kids alone. Sure, I’d take them if there was nothing else, however I hope you appreciate why I may prefer something a bit more secure.