Northern Ireland - how do you perceive it?

[TheBelleOfBelfastCity]

Genuinely just curious. I was born and raised in NI, opinions on MN seem to vary wildly from no go zone to friendly and welcoming. Trying to got a sense of what the most common thoughts are.

Have you visited? Maybe even thought about doing so? What was your opinion?

a bit Rhyll

I can see the Mountains of Mourne from my village whenever we have a northerly wind, but I've never actually been to NI. Definitely need to get there.

Where was this? My children all had brown/black/Chinese classmates and AFAIK it was never an issue!

My DC2 was friends with her African-origin classmate and her Pakistani-origin classmate and that was from 2003 and I don't think either of them faced any discrimination? You do have to bear in mind that immigration was much slower in NI because let's face it, who wanted to come somewhere that people were shooting and bombing the shit out of each other, but that's long gone.

I would be shocked if you experienced that kind of discrimination now. One of my two oldest friends has a mixed-race son and he has visited many times and has never had a problem.

I'm sorry that happened to the people you know. It's a shame no one advised them better on what areas and schools would treat them properly. Unfortunately, like most places, there are pockets of bigots in NI which make it into the local schools.

You would have been fine at the Titanic museum and the other touristy areas. Visitors to Belfast/NI don't generally face discrimination. And people who move there are also fine unless they move to a "bad" area. But, unfortunately, the bad areas are usually the cheaper areas which might appeal to people wanting to move there.

When my dad visited it was the first time he'd been back to Northern Ireland since 1972... when he'd been patrolling up the Falls in the back of an army land-rover!

He probably knows my ma then.🤣🤣🤣

But my point was....all Brits?

Aren't there British people in NI?

PP seems to use the term Brits to refer to those in GB only.
I'm not entirely sure if this is the common usage in NI or just pp's own use of the term? It seems to have led to some instances of people talking at cross-purposes on this thread anyway.

@Treesinmygarden
For example the part you quoted

"The "Brits" would probably have been quite happy to wash their hands of the island entirely "

was part of a comment referring to the formation of NI just over a 100 years ago.

NI was formed because British people ( mainly those in NI) wanted that to happen.

Hence my confusion about the above comment from pp. Brits didn't want to wash their hands of the place - certainly not all of them did anyway - and that's the reason NI came into being.

Or have I got something wrong?

Do it. I am counting the days until I can return! The Antrim coast road from Cushendall to Belfast is some of the best scenery you’ll see. If you’re a GoT fan you’ll be in heaven.

NI people are obviously British if they want to be but some like Edwina Currie resent that.

I'm not quite sure how to explain it to you but while a majority of the people in NI wanted to remain British, not all of the English were happy about it.

Yes, I understand there being mixed feelings of course.

But i was confused when pp said 'Brits didn't want NI to happen' (I'm paraphrasing here).

I mean who else wanted it to happen?
The only reason it happened at all was because (at least some) British people/Brits wanted it to happen.

Most of the British who wanted it to happen were themselves in the NI region, granted.

It's just the terminology used that is causing me problems. I previously understood the term Brits to include the British of NI, but pp was using it to mean those in GB only I think, and excluding NI.
Is this how the term is commonly used in NI?

@RaymondaHolt She means mainland Britain. I'm not sure I've ever heard someone in NI call themselves "a Brit". British, yes, but I think "a Brit" is more of an English/England thing.

I have never been but I'm afraid in my head Northern Ireland is pretty grim. It looks grey and rainy with lots of pebble dash houses and people in tracksuits. Before anyone shoots me, I'm sure it's got lovely parts like the mourne mountains etc. But that's what comes to mind.

Okay thanks @HollyKnight.

I thought British and Brit were the same thing, (though the latter a slang sort of term that you'd just see in papers etc.)
Okay, pp's comments make sense to me now if the term refers more to English people than British ones.
Thank you - you learn something new every day!

Sorry, @HazelPlayer, I had misunderstood what you were saying and we were talking at cross purposes.

Yes, which is why I specified how long ago this all was and why I hadn’t been back pretty much since the GFA.

But I was just responding to a question which I thought was being disingenuous about a post from someone else about why a person from elsewhere on the island of Ireland might have specific response to Union jacks on the streets/kerbs. If I were teleported right now to such an area, I’d be remembering incidents from the past and would be on my guard until I had new experiences to supersede them.

Not that all experiences were obviously in any way negative — one of my best friends (met in England at university) is a Protestant from a very much ‘not mixed’ area in Armagh, though the first time I went home with him in the vac, his (lovely, but quite elderly and very trad) parents were clearly terrified he was going to marry me!

Which was never going to happen, as he’s now married to a (English, CofE) man.😀

I can't remember the last time I saw someone in a tracksuit - and I live on the same road as a rugby club. Can you even buy tracksuits these days?

Being from NI, I typically refrain from posting, though I find it amusing to glance through some thoroughly uninformed opinions. One of the joys MN :)

For any people that have never been there, I'd strongly recommend the north-east coast of Down and Antrim. It's a wonderful place to visit, great walking, cycling, scenery and so affordable compared to many places on these islands. I've recommended this to many friends over the years, and they've universally had a good experience.

I'll only comment the on the area I'm from in the North East (90%+ Unionist). It's much better than 20 years ago, but there is still a significant amount of toxic sectarianism, drugs (run by you-know-who), under-employment, poor science education, poor job opportunities. Racism for sure! But it is not any worse than I'm used to seeing in the rest of the UK?

Racism for sure! But it is not any worse than I'm used to seeing in the rest of the UK? ... or in Dublin, Ireland ... where we lived for 12 years

Good username, @DonnaHadDee! 😀

And I agree on racism. In fact, one of the oddities of the relationship between England and Ireland (and my experience of NI isn’t extensive enough to grasp where, if anywhere, it fits in to this) is that English culture has a weird habit of ascribing things to Irishness that are really just as much aspects of English culture it either doesn’t see or doesn’t want to see, or are largely or entirely imaginary. Reviews of Irish literary fiction are often fun hunting grounds for this.

Penelope Fitzgerald reviewed a collection of Anne Enright short stories in which she says the stories are still ‘prey to ancient Irish certainties’, among which she includes things like rain and there being ‘no friend like a sister’, and tending to babies. Which is pretty weird. I lived in various parts of England for over 25 years, and it rained a lot in almost all, people were just as likely to be close/ not close to their sisters, and, I mean, do English babies not need to be looked after?😀

I used to travel regularly from NI to Manchester for work. Whatever the time of year Manchester was always noticeably colder (especially in winter), and almost always raining.

The PP aversion to pebble-dashed houses is funny. I didn't know that was a thing in NI. Best you avoid Scotland too. Half the houses there are like that!

It surprised me by how beautiful it is (Antrim). I know it should not be a surprise, but if you grew up in the 1970s, all you heard about NI was the bombings and shootings, so I had am impression of a grey, depressing place, which it is not at all. I really liked Antrim. It is beautiful and quiet and quite sparsely populated compared to many parts of England, sort of how you imagine the rest of the UK was like in the mid part of the twentieth century.

What was shocking: the evidence of sectarianism still visible in Belfast. And, it was rather sad the way that every tour guide began their tour by asking the visitors where they were from and marvelling that people would come to their beautiful country. The Northern Irish clearly still expect us to have a 1970s/80s view of their country.

Best to avoid the entirety of the UK + Ireland if these things are grim to you! How can you possibly know what NI looks like in your head when you’ve never been?

Surely pebble dash is coming around to being posh again - I associate it with older houses.

For good reason! Love it or hate it, it’s a very good way of keeping a house weather-proof in even the most exposed conditions, and it’s virtually maintenance-free. I bet it will circle back into fashion at some point.