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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be absolutely sick of excuses being made for men's disgusting sexual behaviour? Trigfer warning. Hugh Edwards sentencing.

716 replies

UCConfuseMe · 16/09/2024 13:13

Just read that Hugh Edwards ahs been given a suspended sentence.

And if course it's not his fault. He had a mean Daddy and some mental health issues and some bad things going on in his life, poor lamb.

All that made him say 'amazing' when sent photos of children as young as 7 being molested.

Having a rough time and a strict father doesn't make you a fucking paedophile!!!

Take responsibility for your predatory and vile behaviour!!

To be absolutely sick of excuses being made for men's disgusting sexual behaviour? Trigfer warning. Hugh Edwards sentencing.
OP posts:
Thread gallery
7
FOJN · 16/09/2024 17:24

Haroldwilson · 16/09/2024 14:11

Well, I for one am glad the state can't kill or castrate people.

Prison is there for people who are dangerous enough to pose a real danger to the public so should be kept inside. And for those who need to be removed from society for rehabilitation.

In this case, he wasn't going about snatching kids off the street. He was exchanging photos. That's bad, I'm not minimising it, but there are ways of monitoring what someone is doing with communications that doesn't necessitate locking them up.

If you lock people up, you have to let them out at some point. What then? Or if you locked up every sex offender forever, we'd need a lot more prisons and higher taxes.

The point of the justice system is to deter offending and prevent reoffending, not to wreak vengeance. If we did that, we'd still be disembowelling people etc.

You are minimising his crimes, real children were sexually abused to produce the disgusting images he was aroused by. Children who are abused are rarely snatched off the street, they are groomed and coerced by people they trust. The emotional and psychological damage will be every bit as serious as the physical injuries.

Locking up sex offenders has got nothing to do with vengeance, they can't abuse children or create a market for child abuse images when they're incarcerated and the longer that protection for children lasts, the better.

I have no faith in rehabilitation and my tolerance for rehabilitation failure is zero. Child abusers cannot be cured so our aim should be the protection of children at all costs.

PassingStranger · 16/09/2024 17:29

UCConfuseMe · 16/09/2024 13:14

I've had enough.

I want to March the streets. I want to do something. I want to protect out children.
What can we do??
I want men to just STOP. JUST FUCKING STOP THIS

Edited

Do it then and asked MN to get involved, why shouldn't they, alot of the forum users are women.

MalcolmTuckersBollockingface · 16/09/2024 17:29

FOJN · 16/09/2024 17:24

You are minimising his crimes, real children were sexually abused to produce the disgusting images he was aroused by. Children who are abused are rarely snatched off the street, they are groomed and coerced by people they trust. The emotional and psychological damage will be every bit as serious as the physical injuries.

Locking up sex offenders has got nothing to do with vengeance, they can't abuse children or create a market for child abuse images when they're incarcerated and the longer that protection for children lasts, the better.

I have no faith in rehabilitation and my tolerance for rehabilitation failure is zero. Child abusers cannot be cured so our aim should be the protection of children at all costs.

Absolutely spot on!

Awwlookatmybabyspider · 16/09/2024 17:29

YANBU.
Suspended sentence!! I might have damn known.

WinterMorn · 16/09/2024 17:29

@Puzzledandpissedoff I totally agree, we should be getting it right all the time. Unfortunately, people just aren’t interested in criminal justice the same way they are with something like the NHS and as a result, the attention, funding and focus just isn’t there until something like this happens. I have long maintained this position but the truth is, a lot of people are happy with this status quo as they don’t want to spend any money on something they consider to be a lost cause.

Awwlookatmybabyspider · 16/09/2024 17:30

I’m very curious as to who the (at my last check) 5% of people who think YABU. Maybe they need looking at too

PassingStranger · 16/09/2024 17:32

AngelicKaty · 16/09/2024 16:22

"There would be no purpose in sending him to prison." What about the message that this sends to victims of abuse? Do you think they feel they've received justice when a suspended sentence is handed down?

He should have thought about his family and public image etc before he did it.
Why do they think they won't be caught or don't they care of they are?

MalcolmTuckersBollockingface · 16/09/2024 17:32

Yanbu

I am stick to the back teeth of the minimising of such crimes by the legal system and by wider society.

Rosscameasdoody · 16/09/2024 17:39

User100000000000000000001 · 16/09/2024 13:15

Agree and he should have gone to prison. Disgusting human being.

The supplier of the photos only got a suspended sentence. So Edwards was never going to get a custodial. He’ll be on the sex offenders register and any transgression during the suspension period will likely result in prison. I don’t agree with either sentence - it’s not sending a strong enough message about all the ramifications of this kind of behaviour, least of all the suffering of the children involved. But I don’t think anyone can claim he’s been given any preferential treatment because this is the way the law works.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 16/09/2024 17:40

Unfortunately, people just aren’t interested in criminal justice the same way they are with something like the NHS and as a result, the attention, funding and focus just isn’t there until something like this happens

As you rightly say it's unfortunate but very true, @WinterMorn, especially as some have very short memories and while they may need the NHS (or whatever) tomorrow, reports of crimes such as this are more sporadic

Which probably also explains why the pitiful "lessons will be learned" is trotted out so often and even works for some ... until the next time

Rosscameasdoody · 16/09/2024 17:40

Awwlookatmybabyspider · 16/09/2024 17:29

YANBU.
Suspended sentence!! I might have damn known.

But you should have known when the cretin who supplied him with the photos only got a suspended sentence. No way was Edwards going to be handed a custodial sentence in that context.

WinterMorn · 16/09/2024 17:41

@Puzzledandpissedoff you have nailed it, and I cannot see any point in the future where this changes.

SpidersAreShitheads · 16/09/2024 17:43

I think this thread shows the difficulties around subjects like this and why it's so hard to have a discussion without descending into name-calling.

It's so emotive, logic often goes out of the window with wild statements being made.

The problem is that being understandably angry at the perpetrators of CSA means it's difficult to have a rationed and reasonable discussion. Some of the comments just get a bit wild.

For example, as some knowledgeable PP pointed out - this is actually a fairly tough sentence compared to what others get. It's also been pointed out that the judge has their hands tied to some extent due to sentencing guidelines. And yet, there are PP who are accusing the judge of being a latent paedophile, and that's why Edwards got off so lightly. It's just ridiculous and unhelpful.

I think the vast majority of us here agree that there's a problem with sentencing guidelines, and an overhaul of the law would be helpful. That's an entirely separate issue but it's not what some PP are saying. There's no acknowledgement that actually, there wasn't much the judge could do because there are sentencing guidelines in place. Slating those who are implementing the current laws is unfair.

The law clearly needs radical change especially with such prevalence of CSA, which is truly shocking. Some of the figures posted here in terms of how many cases there are every year is sickening. It IS mainly men, just like other sexual crimes, and that's where the focus needs to be. However, comments about letting out all the women or making men pay more tax are just infuriating as they're ideological and also unfair.

The real question is, how DO we reform this? I don't know enough about the efficacy of deterrent custodial sentences but the fact is there's not enough prison spaces. So what crimes do we go lighter on to make spaces for CSA cases?

People on this thread are talking about not bothering to imprison for non-violent crimes. And yet, on countless other threads, MN posters are furious about benefit fraud and think people need to be locked up for it. We can't have it all.

The system needs radical reform but I don't know what that looks like, or how it could be funded. But there needs to be real appetite for huge change - and the difficulty with that is that the public won't agree on what's OK and what's not. Look at the furore about Labour releasing some prisoners early - and that's now bitten them on the arse. People are outraged about early releases while simultaneously wanting extra magical spaces for CSA.

I don't think pointing out the practicalities or underlining the difficulties means you don't care. It's possible to have been personally affected by CSA and still want a rational and fact-driven resolution that protects our children in the most effective way.

And also, that means enabling paedophiles to come forward without shame for treatment/help. I'm not referring to people who are doing harm - I'm talking about (probably young) men who realise they have unhealthy attraction to children. BEFORE they access images of children, BEFORE they touch a child......let's get these people help. There will be some that don't want help and glory in their sick tastes - but there will be some that are disgusted with themselves. Right now, there's no easy way to seek help - there needs to be a pathway that can be offered to men to prevent them continuing, to prevent them doing harm to children. People don't like to talk about this because it's dismissed as being a "paedo sympathiser" but nothing can be further from the truth. Prevention is so, so important because only by throwing resources at early prevention together with deterrents and restrictions for offenders, will we actually achieve anything. It's how we protect our children.

I'm 48 and I'm absolutely sick to the back teeth of men and their sexual crimes, our patriarchal society, and misogynism. But at the same time I recognise that we need practical, achievable goals that are actually effective and don't just service an emotional demand.

(Ps - @WinterMorn, thank you, I've found your responses to be balanced and informative, even though it's perhaps not great reading in terms of what's expected and normal in these cases).

SerenityNowInsanityLater · 16/09/2024 17:45

How the apologists totally ignore the reality of escalation. Huw Edwards got caught the same way all predatory men who get caught do: Escalating behaviour and taking greater risks. How far was he willing to go? All the way for as long as he could get away with it.
”He’s not snatching kids off the street!” Well, A) Fuckin’ yay for that! Give the man a cigar and a table dance and just keep minimising his dangerous behaviour and crimes by reminding us that B) he’s a predatory abuser BUT he hasn’t snatched a kid off the streets. 👍
Understand that the next step was going to be having sex with a victim. Look at his timeline. Observe his patterns. He was heading towards sex with a victim. That’s how it escalates.

BlackShuck3 · 16/09/2024 17:45

If you have an issue with how magistrates are sentencing, then please apply to become one. [....]But don’t cast aspersions on those who are giving back to a community by volunteering to be the backbone of our justice system. volunteering to be the backbone of our justice system
Our justice system is held up by volunteers?! No wonder it's all such a clusterfuck🙁

SerenityNowInsanityLater · 16/09/2024 17:46

BlackShuck3 · 16/09/2024 17:45

If you have an issue with how magistrates are sentencing, then please apply to become one. [....]But don’t cast aspersions on those who are giving back to a community by volunteering to be the backbone of our justice system. volunteering to be the backbone of our justice system
Our justice system is held up by volunteers?! No wonder it's all such a clusterfuck🙁

Edited

That ought to work out well.😳

OonaStubbs · 16/09/2024 17:47

Anyone convicted of child sex offences should get life in prison, no ifs, no buts. Throw them in a cell until they are dead.

AngelicKaty · 16/09/2024 17:53

Naunet · 16/09/2024 13:37

I’m asking this kindly as someone who was abused as a child, please, please don’t call it porn. It’s child abuse, just because men wank over it, it doesn’t make it porn.

Absolutely this. Porn largely involves consent (admittedly, not always), but this is NEVER the case with child abuse (filmed or otherwise).

Puzzledandpissedoff · 16/09/2024 17:54

Children who are abused are rarely snatched off the street, they are groomed and coerced by people they trust. The emotional and psychological damage will be every bit as serious as the physical injuries

Once again i agree completely, @FOJN, but WinterMorn did raise a very vaid point around just how much people care in the longer term as opposed to when something like this breaks

Clearly abuse can happen anywhere, but given how much of it involves the internet one way ahead would be to heavily restrict children's access to unsuitable content. Suggest this though, and many who allow their children to access sites supposedly restricted to those much older will insist they've got to have it because "all their friends do", "they'll be isolated without it" and all the rest

Or in other words they care sufficiently to join the outcry when cases like this crop up, but not enough to make the more difficult choices in their own lives

WinterMorn · 16/09/2024 17:55

@SpidersAreShitheads thank you 🌷 I have faced some very open hostility on here today and your post encapsulates exactly where we are with the current situation.

AngelicKaty · 16/09/2024 17:58

WinterMorn · 16/09/2024 13:40

There are a huge amount of convicted sex offenders being effectively managed by the police and probation services every day. If someone wants to re-offend, they will, whether or not they are in custody. If they don’t want to, they won’t.

Wow. Are you genuinely telling us that, even in custody, these people can continue their offending? What does that say about the prison system? If true, that's utterly depressing.

YellowphantGrey · 16/09/2024 17:59

WinterMorn · 16/09/2024 17:55

@SpidersAreShitheads thank you 🌷 I have faced some very open hostility on here today and your post encapsulates exactly where we are with the current situation.

Are you surprised you've faced hostility when you've come on and tried to control the narrative by insisting it's women too, providing stats to justify this and then tried to stop people feeling angry over a paedophile walking free

People are allowed to be angry, it's not your job to stop this or minimise his crime

Naunet · 16/09/2024 18:00

MyrtlethePurpleTurtle · 16/09/2024 17:05

Well, not unless he spends the rest of his life in prison!

But no one has suggested that once they come out, that’s where monitoring should end, whereas some are suggesting we don’t need prison at all.

Startingagainandagain · 16/09/2024 18:00

I find it disgusting that such behaviour is trivialised and not correctly punished.

The worse thing is that it means that the people producing these images and those accessing them know they can get away with it, so children will continue to be abused.

In fact it seems that men are constantly getting away with abusing, raping and hurting children and women in this world.

Vile.

AGirlInACountrySong · 16/09/2024 18:00

@AngelicKaty no. There will be strict monitoring in place

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