To thiink more needs to be done to stop people accessing council housing who already have overseas homes?

[livinginatravellodge]

I know a person who is a dual national but not has British Nationality. They still have really strong links to their country of origin.
In their home country they have a fully furnished 3 bed apartment that they visit with their children when going home. They also one an apartment which they rent out and the income is kept in a bank account overseas. They also own a prime piece of building land. However, in the UK they live in a council property.

I believe that in most councils you are not allowed council housing if you all ready own property; some councils are more explicit and say in detail that this includes overseas property.

If a person attempted to gain a council property while already owning UK property they could very quickly be found out and be taken to court for housing fraud.

I know of another couple, both from different countries who live in council property in the UK. I am friends with them both on Facebook and every year they go on holiday to their alternate country of origin. Again, they have a property to stay in when they visit their home country. I would think that this situation is more common than we all realise.

I own my own property and have been fortunate enough to never need to live in council property but I find this really unfair.The first person mentioned is not a very nice person in many ways (but that is another matter). I reported him to the council and have provided my name for further information.

I am intrigued to see what the council do but I am anticipating nothing as they may find it too hard to prove.

AIBU to think that more needs to be done to ensure that council housing is not allocated to those that already have an overseas home?

I know a family member, divorced 53 years old, got a two bed flat in zone 1 London for 700 per month…far less than a private rental. He has a 17 year old son who occasionally visits. He is on a good income. This is housing association and far below current private rent.

Not that rare if the experiences on this thread are true, and we are only on page 3 of it. Edit - (page 4 now!)

It may just be that YOU don't know about it.

OP - YANBU. I can't see how you could be tbh. People that have homes elsewhere and still leach from the needy in their chosen countries are appalling.

no.
Me too.
So much blatant fraud going on all over the place.

It's obviously not on, and I know of it happening too, living in a multicultural community, but the issue is that the UK local councils just don't have the resources to go investigating abroad. It's frustrating but there it is.

I know someone like this. Her parent has bought a small flat for her in her home country that they now visit for most holidays. She lives in a council home that I could not dream of affording even on my very good salary. (Central London with garden!). But she came to the UK as a pre-teen with just her barely teen sister because her parents had been taken arrested during the horrible war in her country but managed to get them out at least just in time. She arrived and was subjected to racist abuse and had to grow up for several years without knowing whether she’d ever see her parents again. She’s worked so hard to get from minimum job to decent career , pays her taxes and hasn’t actually done anything wrong in now having been given this flat abroad. Am I a bit jealous of her council flat? Yes. Would I trade her life story? Absolutely not.

Of course it should not be allowed but seems there are no checks for this or anything else. I believe council housing should be only for those with no other option, and not for those who can pay private rent or mortgage. Ridiculous that some should have them for life or be able to pass them on to family. Buying them should also never have been allowed, wtf was Thatcher thinking? They are taxpayer subsidised and there needs to be more accountability.

It is rife, so many people in council housing do this. No way for our government to curb it though. If I was in charge I would do a deep investigation and reallocation of council housing. We have the wrong people occupying social housing as far as I am concerned.

I don't understand why people keep saying you can't get council houses anymore. Mine is council and so are many others. Yes alot are also housing association. Still much cheaper than private rents . And comes under the umbrella of social housing. There are families living in hostels waiting for social housing.

@livinginatravellodge I know a couple like this to. They have a home abroad but have a council home here . They have said once their kids are no longer in education they will go back to their home country something to do with the property they have out there and her husbands pension. I don't really fully understand it. Her children are over 16 so in college or 6th form . I know they were born here. I would feel bad for the children since they have lived all their life here.

Lots of fraud everywhere I suppose and hard pressed councils don't have the staff or resources to check every person's back story
There are always people who buck the system and then seem to get away with it too
Makes it hard for the ones who are genuine, usual story

Yanbu op. I don't know why you are getting such a hard time here probably because most of the people on this site have never been homeless and had to experience living in a b and b. And they love calling everything racism to feel good about themselves.

Honestly if this thread was about a British person people would be condemning it. 🙄

And they can live in them forever, I know people whose adult children have moved out and they are living in a 3 bed council property, while other people with genuine reasons they need the houses with family are on waiting lists with 1000's in front of them

unpopular opinion - It should be reviewed and they should be rehomed on a need basis, and moved to more suitable accommodation

They do! Can’t speak for all LAs but my LA is currently building a new estate with 536 homes (houses and flats). They look fantastic. Bancon are the contractor - don’t know what they’d have to gain by building (very dodgy) homes. About 5 years ago council also built new blocks of flats and rehomed everyone from an old 60s complex which was subsiding.

There's a lot wrong with social housing and a lot needs to change.

It should be for people who really need it, but this isnt often the case.

Where are you seeing all this blatant fraud? If it’s “blatant” you must be able to call up many many examples with ease, that we’ll all be able to recognise.

Interesting, and thanks for clarifying the current legal position. I think, and I presume many others do too, that given the current state of the housing situation in the UK, the law should change so that if a person owns a property abroad they should not be entitled to a council/social property in the UK. What was "reasonable" in the past may not be deemed reasonable in today's circumstances and the law needs to change to keep up with the changing immigration and housing situation.

Absolutely not unusual at all. Many many people do this. How could the uk government have access to land registries/ bank accounts abroad?
I know of people who could afford to buy but went down the council route or housing associations if you like. Just to take advantage of the right to buy.
The number of people who buy their council houses whilst previously receiving housing benefit would shock you. How have they managed to buy whilst previously claiming help with rent that they apparently couldn't afford?
They then get a big discount using right to buy.
Well worth it, you rent off coucils/hoising association i believe when they were sold off the right to buy was retained.
You buy after 5 years, get 35% off, on a 200k property that's a 70k discount.
You won't have paid that much in rent in that 5 years!
And if you had your rent covered you won't have paid anything at all

How do you prove that this person owns the overseas property though? Do you have access to the land register (serious question)?

What if their family owns the property and they simply have access to it?

100%! My neighbour has a flat in his native Romania but has a 3 bed HA in my street. To be fair though he pays full rent and is saving to build a large enough home to accommodate his family back home.

What exactly are you suggesting OP- could you outline how this might be tightened up in practical terms?

• ask for a declaration that no other properties are owned, people will lie;
• look at every single equivalent of the land registry across the world- most places don’t have an equivalent and this would require a huge amount of work, translators, possibly lawyers etc (in England and Wales pre land registry, it was actually quite difficult to work out title);
• look at their Facebook and ask them about properties used on every trip abroad for the last year, no doubt people would say that they stayed with family or gave since sold the place.

Remember every penny spent investigating this (and carrying our enforcement, like evictions) comes from the public purse.

And what would you do if people do have property abroad but it’s unsellable/ unusable because of war, lack of infrastructure etc? At the end of the day they still need somewhere to live.

Given that, as others have said, the benefits of a housing association property are not huge, do you really think this is workable/ proportionate?

I disagree. My mum is in a 3 bed since my brother and I moved out. Personally, I think she should downsize as it'll be more manageable as she gets older, but that's her home. She WFH, it gives her space to store stock, and it's somewhere she has put her heart and soul into making it her own home. That shouldn't be taken away from somebody if they're not ready.

And what about people here who have housing association properties but could actually afford to buy, or who get an inheritance, get a new job, kids move out and/ or start earning, or they start a new relationship and partner moves in (but has his own property). What happens to these people?

What a refreshingly sophisticated anti immigrant post......

YANBU

Well that's absolute nonsense.

YANBU, hopefully a small percentage of cases but I do agree in principle that if they own a home abroad they shouldn't be entitled to a council house(if they exist!) or Housing association house.
If they have assets abroad they should be sold to fund their new life in the UK if they need support /subsidising to live here.
Trouble is how do you enforce it? How would the council or housing association even know???
And what if they inherit or buy property abroad after they've been allocated a council house here ?