To not want this inheritance if it lands me in debt?

[Kenclucky]

Bit confused about this -

DM bought a leasehold flat in one of those semi-managed blocks with a warden, communal gardens etc. She's getting on a lot now and told me today that the flat is left to me in her will - but that that means the communal fees and mortgage would need to be paid until the property sells.

I don't think there's any mortgage on it, or if there is its only small. But the communal / service fees are really high - about 1k per month.

Now me and DM sadly don't get on well at all which is a bit by the by, but basically I wasn't expecting to be left anything and really don't want anything from her. Those types of flats in those blocks seem to take forever to sell - her one was on the market over a year before she bought it and there are at least 3 others for sale in there. So I'm pretty worried I could end up saddled with this thing and having to pay 1k+ a month which I really can't afford for an unknown length of time.

She says she's put me as Executor on her will, which makes me liable for all payments. And also if I become the owner of the property I'm liable anyway.

I could refuse the inheritance- but looking at Google it sounds like that would make it pass to the next in line, which is my children and would be in their late teens / early twenties so obviously I would never saddle them with it either. There is nobody else, she has no other family.

Are we basically stuck with her ongoing payments eventually, one way or another? And AIBU that is a rubbish system if so to be forced to pick up the pieces for something you don't even want...

We had a 6 month period when we didn't have to pay council tax on a parental home we had to sell

er, my mums flat is gorgeous actually I’m sat in it now. DH is fitting a new bathroom as we speak. I’d happily live here. You’ve clearly not visited very many.

I think you quoted the wrong person

My Mums is actually really lovely. It's like a nice hotel when you walk in. Hers is cheaper per month, as no check ins or meals are included. The manager who is there Mon to Fri, will call through on the intercom each morning if anyone is interested in having that, very few takers though. Some people are still working, others are in the their 90's

The likes of McCarthy & Stone are complete gangsters!!!! My MIL had expressed an interest in buying one but thankfully has listened to our warnings and steered clear. I would implore anyone reading this thread with an elderly relative considering this to try and talk them out of it if you can.

Yes. Both my dad and mu aunt bought McCarthy and Stone flats. They knew they were going to be a millstone around my, and my cousin's necks. I remember my aunt saying so :(

Fortunately we were both able to sell the flats reasonably easily, albeit at a significantly lower price than our respective parents bought them for, but you hear absolute horror stories.

Get your elderly relative to buy an ordinary flat, and have one of those pendant security thingies.

Although I was looking at some new non-retirement flats in Farnham in Surrey the other day in case my mum wanted one. Lovely flats, big windows, looked quite spacious for new builds. Very central to the town centre.

BUT they are leasehold and the lease is only 150 years. Utterly ludicrous. I thought the last government was going to outlaw short leases. The one time I bought a flat the lease was 999 years.

@Kenclucky I think you're confusing things a bit here. You will be an executor and you will also inherit your Mum's house but these are two different 'issues'

I am not a lawyer, so I could be wrong but my understanding is as follows:

1 No distribution of any part of the Estate, can take place until all the incomings/outgoings have been dealt with, so you will not actually own your Mum's flat until the Estate is being wound up and finalised. Even if you are the Executor. Could be 6 - 12 months or even longer. It won't happen overnight. Any requests for Maintenance payments from McCarthy and Stone, will need to be dealt with by you as the executor and not as the intended new owner of the property. That's an important distinction. They will simply have to wait, until the flat is sold, if necessary

2 a). As an Executor you will have certain duties to get probate granted (if required) collect any income/refunds on things due to your Mum's estate and settle her debts. Any expenditures due to be paid out of her Estate are not the PERSONAL responsibility of the Executor, but rather they pay any outstanding debts from the Executors Estate. If there are insufficient free funds to pay all the debts, then the house would have to be sold, regardless of who it has been willed to to meet the other debts repayments. (Only if you wanted to keep the house, you would need to personally pay off the rest of the debts, but you clearly don't want it, so that doesn't apply) Creditors would have to wait for their money until the house was sold. They may put pressure on, but you just have to stick to your guns that they will have to wait until the house has sold.

b) The only possible exclusion to that would be if Inheritance Tax is due. But Your Mum's total estate value ( including the Flat) would need to be more than £500,000 if she has willed it to you, her daughter. Seems unlikely? That would need to be paid within 6 months though, so if there is an Inheritance Tax liability, you might need to pay that yourself and recoup it from your Mum's Estate once it's all settled.

3 a) It could cost you several/ many thousands of pounds, to ask a solicitor to take on the role of Executor, but they can and will take this on if asked. It is something for you to be aware of.

b) You could also just ask for advice from a solicitor as to what to do about the house. I am not sure, but I think it might make a difference financially whether you sell it under your 'Executor' hat or whether you sell it as the new owner. Think it makes a difference to the amount of Capital Gains tax payable, if it's due at all, so when the time comes, I would definitely ask for some legal advice, even if you don't appoint a solicitor to carry out all the Executor's tasks

Hope that helps to reassure you

The management compay will be allowed to charge 8 percent on any outstanding amount if they choose to.

I would put the flat up for sale once she has passed and sell it as executor prior to distributing the estate to yourself as beneficiary. I know the money comes out to the same pot but if there isn’t enough to pay the monthly fees, as executor you can arrange for the fees to be settled upon the sale. It prevents it becoming your immediate problem even though eventually eitherway you are paying out of what will eventually become yours.

Engage a solicitor to handle it on your behalf.

I think that the management fees for these places should be divided into fees which are actually spent on maintaining the residence, and costs which are only incurred if someone is actually living in the property (e.g. meals). It's really scandalous that the management companies can keep charging for meals which aren't being provided because the owner is dead.

I was executor and main beneficiary for an estate and and council tax was suspended until probate was granted plus a further six months' grace period.

The sale took longer than six months so I did have to pay for a few months but not until six months after grant of probate.

you can officially decline the inheritance as can your children. you can also formally decline being an executor by filing a deed of renunciation with the probate registry. No one can be forced to accept an inheritance nor can they be forced to be an executor.

Think we need to take a deep breath here. No one is forcing older people to buy these flats often brand new and then staying for 1-2 years before passing. The flats have to be sold to either 60 or 70 years old. A very small group. The maintenance charge is clear. Don’t close your eyes to this. Mum rented and the service charge was included. It wasn’t cheap but she loved it there.

The alternative is to stay in the family home which is fine if they are able to cope with it and not struggle with maintaining it. It’s fine if they don’t bombard their daughter with calls very anxious about all sorts. Things that you and I would just deal with

The maintenance charge covers certainly for the 70 plus 24/7 care and the flats are built with old people in mind. Food is discounted for the residents.

Never buy brand new. I honestly cannot believe there is a retirement flat in Oxford for £50k!

Consider renting. Or if you have to buy buy second hand. They aren’t bashed about because people don’t live in them that long.

@Kenclucky Being an executor does not make you liable for the bills of the deceased, or funeral costs, or anything. All an executor does is to ensure that the terms set out in the will are adhered to. There will be bills to pay, but they come out of the proceeds of the estate, they are not paid by the executor.

Once she passes away, then the flat will be part of 'The Estate Of X' and not owned by you, not to start with. Only once the flat is sold and all bills paid will the executor be able to distribute the remaining proceeds of the estate.

Anyway, she may have named you as executor, but if you don't want to do it, then go to a solicitor and ask them to do the entire thing. They will then negotiate with the management company about fees, and will sort the mortgage out, close bank accounts, everything. If, at the end of it all, there isn't enough money from the sale of the flat to pay off the mortgage and all the bills, then that's that. You won't have to pay, the entities to whom the money is owed have to write the debts off.

My brother and I were executors and beneficiaries of our late mother's estate (a small bungalow and some savings). We were not liable for paying council tax unless the property had not sold within 6 months, which we were able to do as the bungalow sold quickly to a cash buyer and our solicitor took only four weeks to complete the conveyancing. Other councils may vary from 6 months to a year's grace on an estate property.

I agree that her owings will probably be frozen until the sale. When my mum died, I just had to pay randoms like the irate window cleaner, but no actual house bills or loans. I also had to pay for the funeral etc. Everything related to her house bills and mortgage was frozen and then taken out of the house sale when it completed. If she can afford the monthly fees, there may also be some cash available. You could speak to CAB or a solicitor if you’re worried, but it seems crazy to give up the opportunity she’s giving you. Surely it will sell eventually for something, even if it is a dud of a property.

My mum died last year and lived in a flat with maintenance fees due every month. Flat finally sold 8 months later and the outstanding fees were paid from the proceeds. Council tax was frozen straightaway then for another 6 months from date of probate being granted.
I was executor but didn’t have to pay anything from my own pocket - the bills belong to the deceased’s estate as I understand it.

Not sure if it's been mentioned here but retirement flats are usually leasehold, and terrible (short) leases. That's why they're so hard to sell.
There's a National Leasehold Campaign group on Facebook, they can give you guidance on your situation. They are winning the battle on unfair leases and unregulated service charges but progress is slow.

I'm in this situation. It is killing us after 2 years on the market including 200% council tax. Honestly I would give it away if I could. We've dropped the price by 50%. I'm at a loss what to do.

Border. Mums flat was 999 years lease and it was Mccarthy and Stone. It didn’t make a difference because she was renting but not all these flats have short leases.

You could find out why the management fees are so high. It could be the owners in this market together could dispute these fees.

Don't turn down a valuable asset. Even if you can't delay payments, you could always borrow against it.

Like many people I thought that downsizing to a manageable flat with support sounded like a great idea. I went to see a Macarthy &Stone one for my late mother in law and I couldn’t believe the service charge and how little the residents got for that. No care at all. Half an hour a week of cleaning iirc.

I couldn’t figure out why anyone would buy one rather than a normal flat or bungalow. Call button tech is available in any home - that’s a whole other story. People think
some magic happens with these systems when in reality it’s the family who are called and an ambulance. Another false reassurance. Alexa can do the same. Care and cleaning can be bought in for any home.

People who think that every property will sell at the right price aren’t taking into account that this isn’t a normal house. Only restricted age groups can live in it. You can’t rent it out long term, short term or holiday let or AirBnB. Any takers have to be able to afford 12k per year in fees (more than an entire pension) with a budget sufficient to get them to end of life. Close to town locations may benefit a few people, but unfortunately for many elderly it ends up not mattering whether town is 5 miles or 50 metres if mobility deteriorates. The ones I looked at had no parking so a car would need to be given up. these places suit people for a very short and specific period of their life. There’s no way I would buy one or encourage a relative to do so.