To not want this inheritance if it lands me in debt?

[Kenclucky]

Bit confused about this -

DM bought a leasehold flat in one of those semi-managed blocks with a warden, communal gardens etc. She's getting on a lot now and told me today that the flat is left to me in her will - but that that means the communal fees and mortgage would need to be paid until the property sells.

I don't think there's any mortgage on it, or if there is its only small. But the communal / service fees are really high - about 1k per month.

Now me and DM sadly don't get on well at all which is a bit by the by, but basically I wasn't expecting to be left anything and really don't want anything from her. Those types of flats in those blocks seem to take forever to sell - her one was on the market over a year before she bought it and there are at least 3 others for sale in there. So I'm pretty worried I could end up saddled with this thing and having to pay 1k+ a month which I really can't afford for an unknown length of time.

She says she's put me as Executor on her will, which makes me liable for all payments. And also if I become the owner of the property I'm liable anyway.

I could refuse the inheritance- but looking at Google it sounds like that would make it pass to the next in line, which is my children and would be in their late teens / early twenties so obviously I would never saddle them with it either. There is nobody else, she has no other family.

Are we basically stuck with her ongoing payments eventually, one way or another? And AIBU that is a rubbish system if so to be forced to pick up the pieces for something you don't even want...

🤬
There needs to be some sort of exposé on these properties!

Get some advice, but.........

I think

If you inherit the flat then at the point your mother dies it passes to you.

If she says that the flat has to be sold and some money given to someone else (eg the cats home) and the rest to you then the flat remains the property of the estate so if the estate is/becomes insolvent then thats the end of it.

Sol if you can get her to go for plan B that might protect your interests ikf it goes wrong

We had to sell one in Oxford 4 years back, it went for £50,000 in one of the nicest parts of Oxford with easy short journey to the centre, where many family homes are worth 15 times that.

Sell it off cheap OP, these flats aren’t worth the hassle of waiting for more.

My mother lives in one of these flats and she says they've also become a lot less popular after the experience of Covid. There was all sorts of trouble with how the management company dealt with it.

She's terribly unhappy there now, but she can't sell, and couldn't buy anywhere else for whatever pittance she'd get for it if she did find a naive, clueless buyer.

I've no idea what we're going to do about it either.

The executor isn’t financially liable for anything. Their role is to administer the estate amongst the beneficiaries.

Until probate has been granted all assets belong to the estate and not the people inheriting. Bank accounts etc are frozen until probate has been granted (with the exception of paying for funeral and other costs which are usually permitted by the bank) so any amounts due - ie the service charges you mention and other bills - cannot be paid and are therefore not due for payment until this point.

Once probate has been granted, the executor may settle the liabilities of the estate (bills etc) and then sort out what ever is left over for inheritance. The executor must apply to the land registry to change the ownership of the property - using the will to evidence this. It’s at this point that the new owner (ie you) becomes liable for service charges. Of course, the executor may wish to sell the property on behalf of the estate rather than transferring ownership of the property and the cash then becomes the inheritance. In this instance, the proceeds of the sale cover the accrued service charges/mortgage etc and it’s handled as part of the conveyancing.

Given that this is an old folks flat, the management company will be well used to this.

And, if you’re really over thinking this, and worrying that the accrued service charge/mortgage will exceed the value of the flat, then this isn’t an issue either because of the overall value of the estate is negative (the debt exceeds the assets) then it has to be written off - the person inheriting doesn’t have to pay.

So, the short answer, don’t worry. You won’t find yourself in financial difficulties because your mother has left you the flat.

I hope this helps!

This is a bit too high for management fees per month. Is it not per year?

I had this. You personally aren’t liable. The estate is. Happy for you to pm me if you have questions. This one was managed by first port and was last year.

No, it’s a month. I think these flats will be the next financial scandal, they’re a total rip off.

It’s common for these types of flats. Often includes 2 meals a day though.

Maybe it might actually be best if your DM bequeathed the entirety of her estate to the 'proverbial' Cat's Home?

You can decline to be an executor, you can also appoint a solicitor to handle it all, obviously that costs though.

If she leaves any money in bank/savings accounts, depending on how much the balance is, some banks will transfer it before probate is granted. Not sure of the thresholds and each bank is different. It's worth being aware of though.

Take real care here OP. DM had a flat, similarly paid monthly charge and was part owned. Housing Association owned 20%, DM 80%.

She died 5 years ago and left property to me and two sisters. HA charged her estate/us the monthly fee and started pressing us to pay it after six months. We paid down 25% of the charge each month as between us was all we could afford. They let the debt build up, to be paid from proceeds of the sale.

It took 5 years.

The HA made us pay for a RICS valuation every six months, and would not allow us to drop the price to below the RICS value, even though the market wasn’t responding. Despite repeated requests.

Over those 5 years, the monthly service fee doubled. We had no say over the increases.

The HA did nothing to market or sell the flat. They charged a many thousands admin fee for the sale.

There is also the sinking fund to pay into when property is sold, typically a % of the value at purchase for every year the person lived there or until it is sold on.

After five years, when we had only our THIRD viewing and a finally and luckily a buyer, we sold.

We had to pay almost 40% of the sale price in fees and debts, mostly to the HA.

I will never, ever go into one of these properties , and I know if my DM had known what was coming, she would have moved into a 100% owned bungalow and we all wish she had.

Thing is, the person is really vulnerable at the time of moving and the HA know they have you over a barrel. It’s a corrupt failing model which needs radical overhaul. It doesn’t work, it is exploitative.

Five years, no control and 40% costs back to HA. They are leeches.

I agree.
I could always go to auction too, with a very low reserve.
Some of the ones where my Mum lives not Mcarthy and Stone have been rented out so a landlord might be willing to buy.

What would happen if you refused to pay

These type of places are a total con.
Brand new they cost £263K second hand they will only sell for about £70K.
I understand your fears but have no clue what practical things you can do.

Can you not rent it out short term while it’s on the market?

In the small town where I live, about 20 per cent of the properties on the market at the moment are these flats for older people. The asking prices are dropping ridiculously low while the service charges increase. If I was left one in a will I think I would refuse it.

My Mum has left hers to my sister, she got it very cheap (under 100k) as a probable sale, lovely 2 bed new kitchen etc. fees are about 700 or so each month, includes ins, ground rent, sinking fund, window washing monthly, gardeners, emergency bell system, etc.
I'm going to encourage sis to sell and buy a normal flat with no bells and whistles and normal annual fee as she will need somewhere once retired.

all right, so is this shared ownership or elderly retirement ?

Unfortunately this is not the case - there are so many for sale and some cannot even be given away - people just don't want them.

I don't think I'd refuse it but I'd do everything I could to make life difficult for the management company🤬

@somereallyniceadvice i don’t know. The legal file/contract/management pack was about six inches thick and in impenetrable legalese. Maybe they would have sued us to pay if there was any other assets, such as any savings, available? The probate form is accessible and gives the estate value. Me and the sisters just thought we should pay what we could to show willing and hoped we sold fast.

Five years. It was SO stressful. HA was just vile, really vile.

Effectively this. They will threaten and send nasty letters, you just leave it to your solicitor to deal with.

To anyone reading this thread - if you love your offspring, do not buy a retirement flat.

My dad did and I was lucky to sell it easily (within about six months). It could have been so much worse.

Yes they are a lot like cars. Quite good value buying second hand, not very good buying brand new!

If you can afford it, I'd go to a solicitor and get some advice on this. I don't think the 30 minutes free thing happens any more but they will often sell you an hour of advice and tell you how much it will cost in advance. If you are in a local group on social media, you could maybe get a local recommendation.