To be surprised how posh most lawyers are?

[eggtat]

I grew up in a mining area in the north east. Not a poor background but parents never had much money. I was the clever kid in school, worked my socks off and got a law degree from cambridge. Then moved to London for work.

I thought that law firms would be full of people like me and some posh people. In my office I’d say a an overwhelming majority of people come from what I’d consider a posh background - parents who are professors, diplomats, barristers, partners at law firms, senior accountants etc.

People who grew up privileged, good private schools, academic households, then onto a top uni.

Just stop with the veiled insults. You're definitely rude!

I’m a lawyer and I don’t find the lawyers i habitually deal with ‘posh’, I think they’re very similar to any other type of white collar workers. However I do come from the background you describe in your OP so may have a different perspective.

Most people that go to top universities are middle-class, that’s just how things are in Britain. Did you not find the same at Cambridge?

In these kinds of environments a lot of it is performative ‘posh’ too. You want to come across in a certain way and law is mostly oh-it-is-very-complex smoke and mirrors, so people act accordingly, especially around clients. We use fancy words and RP and our social circles are people we know from uni/ lawyering.

I imagine in lesser law firms they’re more normal, I’ve had paralegals that certainly haven’t been pretentious, with good enough law degrees.

Oh good point. Could be a High Court judge! They can be a bit humourless.

Oops!

It depends very much on the firm.

Magic circle and city firms are very posh. Not all are the same.

Large national and regional firms are less posh but fairly middle class.

If you go to claimant PI firms, high street firms, criminal firms and immigration firms the demographic is different.

I have come across plenty of posh white public school boys but also qualified solicitors who include a former miner, trade unionists, first generation immigrants, someone who lived on the streets, people who went to failing schools in deprived areas.

DH was once in a courtroom where the QC had to explain the term ‘baby daddy’ to an extremely patrician elderly judge while the jury tried not to laugh.

It’s very true that the privately educated are over represented in the legal profession, but it’s also true that everyone you think is posh, may not be.

Both DH and I are barristers. I have been assumed to be privately educated since I was a teen - I wasn’t. Went to a reasonably decent comprehensive, but did have the privilege of university educated parents. In spite of this people always assume I’m part of “the club”. I have heard on a number of occasions people describe DH as “the posh one” - he isn’t posh either! Went to a pretty poorly performing comprehensive, in a working class town with parents who both left school at 15 with no qualifications. He ain’t posh. But he is intelligent, educated and has excellent people skills. He learned how to fit in. 🤷🏻‍♀️

i know at least 30 HCJ and can only think of one really humourless one.

That's such an utterly bizarre post.

As I posted above, salaries for high street solicitors in London and County Durham are similar. Given that and the difference in house prices, there's more opportunity in the NE than London or the more expensive parts of the SE.

Some Londoners from lower income backgrounds aren't even allowed to stay where they're from. They're socially cleansed out. If not shipped out, lots are long-term homeless in temporary accommodation. London has more homeless people including children than anywhere else in the UK. That's a massive barrier to opportunity.

(In the past, City firms did tend to have a lot of people from wealthy shire backgrounds but I'm not sure if that's still the case. Even if it is, that's not the majority of London lawyers, let alone the many lawyers across the UK).

"My experience was that the REALLY posh ones all went to the Bar."

I think it's certainly changed quite a bit over the years but, generally speaking, I wouldn't disagree with you at all.

@MotherofAllMatriarchs totally agree about the social capital.

and yet, how does knowing about wine make someone a better lawyer? It’s all such bullshit. I did a wine tasting course ( because I love wine). Once you know the basics it’s all personal preference- it takes as much sophistication as ‘knowing’ your beers or chocolate.

of course, it’s easy for me to say that with the benefit of hindsight, but it must be very daunting as a young person if you haven’t grown up among people guffing on about wine.

maybe if they taught ‘posh chat’ at uni as an elective, it would help.

also your point about your friend having a mum who was a lawyer- I think that’s actually one of the biggest indicators that someone ( my age) is posh- if their mum had a professional job. It’s a huge bonus as I think mums are the ones who spend most time coaching young people early in their careers

I’m not! I’m really not!

Anyway, before the Law Society puts out a contract on me, I’ll just say - speaking to the thread subject - that I think solicitors are a much more varied and socially-representative group than barristers are.

And may your instructions be plentiful!

I know quite a few lawyers and I wouldn't say any of them are particularly MC, let alone posh, and none of them seem very wealthy either. The last time I saw one (in work) she was wearing yoga pants and looked a complete mess. The barristers on the other hand definitely had an air about them.

Think I'll log-off now though as I'm wondering if this thread is more about indulging in lazy and false stereotypes about lawyers or London/the SE, rather than genuine discussion.

I'm not even in or from London, nor am I a lawyer (although I know people who are from London, and separately who are lawyers - not all in London). But I can't stand lazy and completely untrue stereotyping. It's boring and immature.

You'll be even more surprised that some.people would think that that comment makes you sound like a twat

I don’t know many lawyers but the one couple I know (both barristers by training although she stopped working) do a LOT of DIY and flipping flats. Maybe you’re on to something!

Oh, right. How do you know them?

Just lucky, I guess

You thought most lawyers were from North East mining towns? Everyone knows it’s a profession of ‘posh private boys.’

I see.

I went to an independent school and studied law. I got chatting to a colleague I didn't know that well a few years ago and found out that by strange coincidence, he had gone to the same school as me, despite the fact we were both miles away from home. I asked him what he studied at Uni and he told me he'd done medicine, although he'd never wanted to be a doctor really. I was about to ask why and then realised I didn't need to- it was exactly the same reason I'd studied law.

Yes, there are lots of posh lawyers, but there are also lots of posh kids who are given 2 options in life- lawyer or doctor/dentist- and not all of them are able to stick it out. My brother did the dentist route, managed to see it through, hates it and hates everyone who he feels led to him ending up somewhere he never wanted to be.

I'm not expecting sympathy for it but it's not all roses.

Obviously not every lawyer is a MC partner on 2m a year but reading the OP I think we can make a reasonable guess that she isn’t talking about working in a high street firm earning 50k a yr…

A law degree is no more expensive than any other degree. The post-degree course you need to undertake can be expensive but those that have training contracts lined up at “top firms” will largely be sponsored through it.

OP I would say that big firms in the City/London are disproportionately full of posh people with privileged backgrounds and private educations. If you’re looking for a more representative mix of colleagues then regional firms - even the big ones - would be a better choice.

This is just not true. I’m a surgeon and so is my DH. We both went to comps, I grew up in a working class town in the north west, DH in a working class town in Yorkshire. Doctors are probably one of the most diverse professions in terms of sex, ethnicity and social class.

There are some “posh” privately educated people in medicine of course but certainly not the majority.

I never felt out of place at med school or at any stage during my training and you certainly don’t need to hide your background or adopt certain behaviours to appear polished like you seem to have to in law. Regional accents are totally normal and I think doctors at all levels are used to mixing with people from different class backgrounds. Don’t forget as surgeons most of our day is spent with theatre assistants, nurses and patients, not other consultants, and those people are from all walks of life.

There is a challenge with getting more women into surgery but that’s a whole other topic!

@Veebee89 what is not true?

Try working in legal aid. There are some incredibly good lawyers working in those firms for a pittance, from all sorts of backgrounds.