To think that with over 1million pensioners in poverty, removing the WFA makes Labour the nasty party, who tell blatant lies?

[TealTraybake]

And hypocritical lies at that. Just a few months ago Labour ‘vowed to be the party for pensioners’

‘Nearly 1 million people aged over 66 in the UK are living in deprivation, according to government statistics, the highest number since comparable records began.
Labour, which analysed figures from Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) records, has vowed to be the party for pensioners, with plans to insulate millions of homes and reduce energy bills. It has also “committed to retaining” the triple lock which guarantees annual rises to the state pension’

I understand the WFA should be means tested - but the current threshold is far too low. Food prices have gone up. Energy prices have gone up. Some pensioners need that WFA 🥺.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2024/apr/16/nearly-1m-uk-pensioners-deprivation-official-figures

With a 30+% income tax rate on minimum wage?

For a £250,000 mortgage you’ll need an income now of £50-60,000, or roughly 1.67 times the average annual salary of £35,830 (official government figure September 2024).

Average annual salary in 1974 was £1,809, so 1.67 times this is £3,021, which would be in the basic rate tax band and liable to income tax at 33%.

So you’d like to have 1974’s 10.3% interest rate on your mortgage, 16% inflation and 33% income tax?

Really? 🤣🤣🤣🤣

Oh, and don’t forget the 3-day week because the lights went out!

As they say, be very, very careful what you wish for…

That doesn't actually help those on the cut off who will have less support than pension credit.

That's the problem. MPs on all sides could get the pressure this was creating, even some Labour ones although haven't looked up if they voted

@StarrySkiesAtMidnight okay I really cannot help your lack of basic maths skills. Look at any report that details the changes in buying power between the 1980s and now, particularly in the context of home ownership and you will gain a better understanding of the situation.

And by the way, adding these 🤣🤣🤣 faces to your replies is incredibly childish.

And by the way, adding these 🤣🤣🤣 faces to your replies is incredibly childish.

@StewartGriffin Aww, diddums. 🤣

@EasternStandard it is actually relevant as the press have been keen to highlight that disabled pensioners and their carers not in receipt of pension credit will lose WFA.

This would not be the case if the Tory government had not already removed eligibility to those not in receipt of means tested benefit for the disabled and their carers.

The issue was means testing disability eligibility not means testing pensioner eligibility.

I'm pleased you got that off your chest! 🙄

Changes in buying power? Such as the average amount of salary spent on groceries, you mean?

In the 1950s we spent a third of our income on food shopping, but in 1974 this had gone down to 24%. By 2016 food shopping accounted for just 10.5% of our income.

As for my ‘lack of basic maths’, can you please explain how 24% of income spent on essential food is somehow less than 10.5%?

Rental costs have increased because we have proportionately more people trying to rent each property than in the past. However, even with Rayner’s call for more houses our population increase will still outstrip supply.

So unless you’re advocating a cull of some of the population there isn’t much that can be done about that.

Are you counting in the tax allowance during that same period? In 1980 it was £1375 for a single person and £2145 for a couple. The average full wage was around £5500 a year for a man and £3700 for a woman based on manual low skill work.

Blossontoes firstly, the older generation didn't live through 2 recessions, err, hello, what about the 80's when GDP was at its worst in 1980/81 and in 2008, the UK entered what was to be its worst recession since World War 2, in terms of output lost. The unemployment rate approximately doubled, from 5.4% to 10.7%, reaching double figures for the first time since the interwar depression.
They didn't need student loans because going to university was an elitist thing only for the people from well off families. Most people I went to school with started work as soon as they left school.
The older generation need a functioning NHS more than when they were younger.
Every generation has its problems and I don't disagree that younger people have it very hard right now but please don't bash the oldies, you are directing your anger towards the wrong place, try getting annoyed by the rubbish people governing our declining country!

Well (if this is true) he ought to be fazed. Labour have to be careful not to p* off too many people too quickly.

Well if, as I read today, 30% of children are growing up in poverty in this country, I do think that is a more immediate concern actually.

Yep, those were the days lol 🙄

My memory says anyone over 60 has lived through multiple recessions. The oil crisis and the six day war in the early 70s, and then the winter of discontent (78/79). The early 80s were fairly horrendous, then came the Lawson boom, and another bust in the early 1990s, when the UK fell out of the EMS and interest rates briefly hit 17%.

Blair inherited an economy in a strong place, and initially spent sensibly to improve early years, education and health, but Brown's removal of the pension dividend tax credit made most DB pension schemes unworkable, plus selling the gold reserves. However, it didn't look too bad until the financial crisis in 2008. Then austerity... then Covid, then Putin's invasion of Ukraine, and the return of inflation. I reckon I've seen my share.

Of course it’s true. It’s on iplayer if you want to check. It doesn’t matter how much pissing off they do at the beginning of the term, it’ll be forgotten in five years’ time. Almost the first thing Blair did in 1997 was cut single parents’ benefits, I was furious although I was no longer the single parent of small children. It didn’t stop him being reelected - twice.

I think you’re quoting the wrong poster here. 🤷‍♀️

I didn’t mean you were making it up - I’m querying whether he really isn’t bothered
about popularity. First impressions and all that.

It doesn’t work that way in politics. You get all the controversial shit out of the way early then bring in lots of nice feel good stuff as the next election hoves into view.

Oh good I look forward to that 😅

Using your figures, in 1980 the single person tax free allowance represented 25% of the average salary for a man and 37% of the average salary for a woman in low skill manual work.

In 2024 the tax free allowance of £12,570 is 35% of the governments figure of £35,830 for the annual salary, and 52% of a £23,795 salary at minimum wage rates. Income tax due above this amount is charged at 20% for both average and minimum wage salaries.

My figures in another post were from 1974 - a year before women were allowed to open bank accounts in their own names and apply for their own mortgages, and a time which @StewartGriffin thinks would be financially preferable to now.

"My figures in another post were from 1974 - a year before women were allowed to open bank accounts in their own names and apply for their own mortgages, and a time which @StewartGriffin thinks would be financially preferable to now."

@StarrySkiesAtMidnight nice bait and switch there-what's wrong, are more people questioning your maths?

@ATenShun quoted figures for 1980, my original post had used figures from 1974.

@StewartGriffin You do realise 1974 and 1980 are different years, yes?

@StarrySkiesAtMidnight I really can't keep up with your ramblings-I'll bow out here.

Using those figures the taxable income for a single woman was £2325. Which at 30% tax gives a payable amount of £697.50 or just under 19% of total salary.

Women could always open bank and building society accounts. Very few banks stopped them. It was only a law change that happened in the 1970's to stop the remaining few financial institutions of barring women.

Apologies! 😘

I think we have all gone off piste on this post.
Its meant to be an adult exchange of views but sadly, has erupted into the young bashing the old and vice versa.
The old nor the young is the problem, it's the mean, money grabbing, self serving people twats in power that are ruining the country - the flaming MP's who want this country to be unrecognisable, with no future for the next generation.
The question I ask myself though, if why?