To ask if anyone is clued up on the challenge this week to VAT on school fees?

[feesss]

we went to look round a school this morning and we obviously asked about VAT and the lady showing us round said there has been a challenge this week so it may not happen? Is anyone aware of this? I can’t see much online about it?

It is not about necessity, luxury or any of the other political gaff they have been spouting. It is about the law, what the courts will likely find and the likely political fall out from that. Especially if it is in black and white already that that outcome is more likely than not.

It’s happening - however much you start threads about it.

Private schools are not signatories to the ECHR so couldn’t be accused of breaching any of the articles. The U.K. government is a signatory and is breaching by limiting education choice through a targeted taxation, the Government estimate 40,000 children priced out in the 1st year.
The Government doesn’t tax university education….yet.

It’s the 4 legal actions, rather than the threads, that people hope will stop it happening.

@SpringSt3p - if the Government currently has privileged legal advice stating clearly they may likely lose on human rights grounds, what is your position then? Should they just ignore that advice, lose, waste taxpayers money etc and deal with the loss of credibility etc Please explain why that would be worth it? For whom?

The vast majority of the population don’t give a shit about vulnerable children and how the government treats them if it doesn’t affect them. There are loads of Sen children who haven’t received an education for years becuase the Sen system is broken, that’s why some individuals have had to resort to sending their sen children to independent schools in the first place.

@Morph22010 - my news feed is full of articles on the SEND system being broken and individual tragic stories, but it could be that the algorithms are feeding that to me specifically.

Not sure why punishing some parents who have been forced to pay up and now an additional 20 per cent on top of that is anyone sparky idea? The Labour Party included a divisive policy in their manifesto to gain hate and envy votes and if it transpires that it is unlawful, heads should rightly roll.

One would assume they have watertight legal advice that they will not lose in court. If that is not the case, they should be held accountable. Why anyone would disagree with that, is beyond me. You cannot just throw some children to the wolves to further your own career and try and claim you are taking the moral high ground. It is despicable.

My news feeds are also full of stories about the Sen system but as you say it’s prob becuase I’ve show an interest in looking at that sort of thing before. I agree with you about it not being right to throw some children to the wolves but where you are mistaken is if you think there is going to be a big public backlash about it if there is a loss in court, as I said before sadly the vast majority of people in this county aren’t bothered what happens to Sen children as long as it doesn’t effect them or their own children. The fact is parents of non Sen children in independent schools are only now bothered because they have an issue that affects them and Sen children are useful to their arguement about not charging vat on fees.

@Morph22010 - I thought there was a backlash with all the Lord Ali stuff and Starmer’s son revising in his multi million pound flat?
What I meant is more that the press will dine out on anything suggesting this Government knew all along there was a material legal risk all along and went ahead regardless, to garner votes. That would be all over the press surely? And Philipson etc did not engage with small private school full of SEND to try and cover her backside somehow. I am pretty sure the press will slaughter them for that, if it transpires they knew all along and were sitting on legal advice to that effect (and well we all know the legal advice should also be in Starmer’s actual brain given his experience)/

There isn’t. Many areas have no places for those needing to switch to the state sector. There are more than half a million children in private schools. There are not half million spare state school places.

So you are saying that VAT should be applied because not everyone can afford it. On that basis, because many can’t afford uni, we should be adding VAT on to those fees as well. If VAT is “nothing”, add it onto uni fees. If students can’t afford it, they can’t afford it.

With regard to the luxury argument, it’s entirely irrelevant. VAT is not a tax on luxury. Cake and caviar have no VAT added. Toilet roll and energy bills are subject to VAT.

What I meant is more that the press will dine out on anything suggesting this Government knew all along there was a material legal risk all along and went ahead regardless, to garner votes.

Hmmm. Much the same as the last governments plan - despite legal advice - to breach the ECHR in pursuit of the Rwanda scheme ? To garner votes.

@SerendipityJane - Labour got in by default in some areas, because people were so fed up of the Tory sleaze and incompetence and corruption etc and Labour promised that the grown ups would be back in charge etc. Yet all we have had is incompetence and sleaze from them too. I say, enough is enough! We the British tax payer deserve more. And children with SEND definitely deserve more (whether in state or private schools or homeschooled, why would it matter where they are schooled).

The age old “but the Tories” did that is just not going to wash. They have to be better. Surely?
Hoping that Starmer will at least do better internationally than the last lot. If there is any hope of that, at least. At least improve our ties with the EU and strengthen our security situation.

Education tax is illegal under EU law so another step further away from alignment, doesn’t bode well for the relationship with the EU. Assuming Trump shares Musks views on Labour and their ‘policies’, the relationship with the US is going nowhere but down.
Domestically, the targeted attacks on peoples children and family farms in particular have well overstepped the line and broken the social contract with the state for a lot of us. It will cause division long after Labour have gone and has well and truely opened the door for Governments to openly target groups who don’t vote for them.

It's hardly opening the door. Governments have been openly targeting groups who don't vote for them forever. What about Thatcher introducing Poll Tax in Scotland before daring to in the rest of the UK. She knew as a group Scots hated her and would never vote for her.

Trump is going for big state and civil servants in DC in a massive shakeup. A future Reform/far right Tory Government is likely to do exactly the same - probably in 5 years time. The more division Starmer & Co cause, the more likely that will be the possible outcome, in just 5 years time.

Before my time so I couldn’t comment, but it was rolled about to everyone right? Labour have targeted pensioners, private school children, small business owners and farmers. The education tax and farm inheritance tax are purposefully spiteful, I don’t believe either policies will be implemented in their current form but the intent was enough for me personally to change the way I vote and the policies I support for the rest of my life.

Completely agree.

Labour did get votes from people they have likely alienated now. I'm guessing that's why polls show such a drop in support.

Yes I agree with this. I am furious about the WFA.

It's odd as I heard the PMQ line about Labour not caring for those who didn't vote for them and I don't think that's the correct line.

There are plenty of people who did vote for them who will now be turned away because Labour are implementing poor spiteful policies.

So it goes further than not caring about their non voters

Does anyone know who the political advisors are who devised and recommended these policies in the first place?

Phillipson, Reeves + Raynor have wanted to get rid of indy schools for years. So I think it comes directly from them hence the shitshow

Reeves is obsessed with private schools, you’ll struggle to find an interview where she doesn’t bring it up. Ellie is the same, it must be a family thing.

Why, you planning on suing? It’s happening, it’s long overdue.