To ask if anyone is clued up on the challenge this week to VAT on school fees?

[feesss]

we went to look round a school this morning and we obviously asked about VAT and the lady showing us round said there has been a challenge this week so it may not happen? Is anyone aware of this? I can’t see much online about it?

It’s been in most of the papers this week but is mostly around the SEND aspect I think

https://bmmagazine.co.uk/news/labours-vat-on-private-school-fees-faces-high-court-challenge-over-human-rights-concerns/PM

If you are thinking about private school, I think you have to assume that VAT is going ahead so you need to ask the school what they intend to do to
help parents pay the VAT. Some schools have already reduced their fees to help but a lot are waiting for the budget in October. Might be worth speaking to the school after this to understand their plan

It's going to happen, the school are obviously trying to string you along.

It won't happen. In summary, it is generally held that countries have the right to make their own political decisions around tax. There has never ever been a tax overturned on the basis of discrimination.

x.com/DanNeidle/status/1832702400253112374?t=rsTPCCcLHjINt7njny3T0Q&s=19

Thanks all.

This school basically said they wouldn’t be doing anything to soften it if it does come in 😂 but they mentioned there was a challenge to it and so there was still hope!

you have to assume it is happening and work out if you can afford it on that basis. Even if the school is doing something initially to offset the entire 20%, they won’t be doing that forever so budget for the full amount plus the usual 5+% increase per year. It sounds like an irresponsible school to be saying that to you tbh.

No hope for the challenge.

At present the legislation that would add VAT to schools hasn't even been written into law yet. How do you challenge a law that doesn't exist?

Wouldn't get your hopes up on this one.

I honestly think new rules are needed to protect people from chucking their money away in these pointless crowdfunded challenges.

We have priced it in to any cost as many schools have also done this.

Why the 😂, softening it means reduncies, cutbacks & cancelling extras which attract people to the school in first place. That's if can afford to even stay open

A lot of variety in those schools that have made statements. I read that Eton is adding the full amount. A colleague’s school has done full analysis of costs, removed salaries and other non vatable aspects and worked it out to 9% VAT. DD’s school haven’t released any further information but will be looking to do similar, so expectation is around 10% to 15%.

DD’s school held fees for the last couple of years, small increase this year, so just about doable.

Highly irresponsible of whomever was showing you around to mention the court case as a realistic prospect of changing the inevitability of VAT being applied. That’s not to say I don’t support the court case - and I have written to my MP about my SEN Ed- but i am realistic.

My 2 dc at London schools and both are passing on the majority of VAT. Even schools that are absorbing VAT for January won’t be able to keep it up for long.

you absolutely must factor in vat to your calculations PLUS annual fee increases of at least a few percent every year.

It is against EU law to tax education so it’s not going to be a straightforward process.

Also it’s not going to have any kind of positive impact on state education, quite the opposite.

It was a cheap vote winner which is likely to go horribly wrong. But the people who are seeing no more than people who have more than them being taken down a peg or two don’t want to hear that.

PS, I have no skin in the game, mine were state educated and have left now anyway.

We’re not in the EU. It will be extremely simple indeed to implement. I work in this area. It is 98% certain to go ahead. 20% chance if it being moved to next summer maybe but it is going to happen.

Errr Brexit? And it's not that complicated. They are no longer classed as charities. Presumably their best option is to go back to the charity commission and challenge the fact that they are charities. If they are charities they should be able to regain their charitable status if not they have to pay like all other not for profits.

It’s nothing to do with charitable status. Many schools are and will remain charities.

Just another example of private schools being full of shit! They’re businesses, they’re trying to sell you something, something that you do t even really need… just treat it like your looking at luxury cars on a car lot, the salesperson is going to play up the positives and downplay the negatives.

If I were yiu I’d be more worried about how much THEY plan to put up fees each year outside of VAT.

‘
you absolutely must factor in vat to your calculations PLUS annual fee increases of at least a few percent every yeaR’

Friends school has increased her fees by 8/9% a year… and there is sod all you can do about that -

There are two current legal challenges and the ISC is launching a third after the budget. In my opinion, the policy will never be implemented as it contravenes ECHR and I’d imagine it will never even reach that stage. Worst case, if by some miracle it does go ahead then it’s a few years of VAT before the next government takes over or the U.K. adopts closer alignment with the EU. The policy is a dud on every level with it’s only aim being to get the spite/envy vote and throw some red meat to the far left in the election.

Saying all that, I do agree with other posters that you need to be able to afford the 20% if push came to shove. You don’t want to be in the situation where you are forced to move them from a school
where they are happy a year down the line, a friend of mine is going through that at the moment and it’s heart breaking for them. You also have to make sure the school is able to financially survive the shock of fees going up 20%.

Contravenes ECHR?? Give over.. 😂

Yes, article 2 protocol 1. This forms the basis for the EU law governing legality of education taxes and it is the basis for the Christian faith independent school legal action against the Government. The ISC will be along the same lines, but they are waiting for the full details of the policy.

Thank you, I’ve just read article 2 protocol 1. In your opinion which clause is contravened by the VAT proposals, because I’ll be damned if I can find it?

Half are charities and they haven’t/aren’t losing charitable status. Labour realised months ago that that was too difficult

There is a Private School board you can use for this question.

Are tutors full of shit? Particularly the ones that help get you into grammar school? You don't need them either. What about dancing lessons, swimming lessons and sports clubs? You certainly don't need them. Full of shit? Nurseries? Universities? Full of shit! You don't need them!

Honestly, when this is approved in Parliament the can of worms will be well and truly open. Careful what you wish for.

The challenge will fail. The legal opinion that it’s based on was written by human rights specialists, not tax experts. A tax expert would have pointed out that no European court has ever struck down a tax based on the ECHR. They give governments huge latitude in their political decisions on how to raise domestic tax revenue. Also, a tax expert would tell you that it is extremely unusual for a government to take something out of the scope of VAT once it’s in. And that when it does happen (ebooks, sanitary products), prices don’t actually come down for consumers, the “VAT saving” is retained by the producer as they generally charge what the market will bear. taxpolicy.org.uk/2023/02/09/ebooks/

TLDR: don’t hold your breath on any of that.