AIBU to think that the anti UPF books and diets around at the moment are just a new version of Clean Eating?

[TeaforTheWins]

Demonising all foods that have emulsifiers in and making us think that a “upf” free diet is realistic, to me, is madness. I eat well, I cook meals from scratch most of the time but of course I have “UPF” in my diet. A sandwich in my packed lunch made from supermarket bread, the odd tin of soup, biscuits with my tea, fruit yoghurts, a sandwich on the train, a supermarket croissant on a Sunday morning etc.
Am i not getting something? Or is this just another way to make women hate our bodies, hate ourselves for not having the time to be baking bread at home, and part with our hard earned money to buy artisan chocolate rather than the kit kat that we actually want.
I’ve read Ultra Processed People and I’ve listened to the podcasts, but I can’t see how this is at all realistic for working parents to live up to.

@Gwenhwyfar We mostly eat Asian veggie food but I also make a lot of tray bakes heading into autumn. Often from Rukmini Iyer's roasting Tin series. Things like root veggies, chickpeas, broccoli, peppers and halloumi chucked into a tin with olive oil and garlic. We don't eat chicken but you can add protein.

Exactly, you do seem to have a bit of a chip on your shoulder about it OP.

I'm by no means an UPF evangelist, we eat low UPF as a family by default for other dietary reasons, but it's no more effort for me to put some chicken thighs on a roasting tray and boil some new potatoes and veg on the hob while they are roasting than it is to put some chicken kievs on a tray and air fry some chips and boil some frozen peas.

Personally I think a big part of the problem is people aren't taught to cook properly now and rely on the timings and instructions on processed food packages as they lack the confidence to do otherwise.

I’m aware that this is very easy, however it’s more time consuming and as I mentioned, I’m a busy mum with a full time job looking for quicker ways to eat healthily.

I agree there's a big issue with the way society is now. I'm certainly the last person to deny that; low pay and having to take on two jobs is something me and my husband both went through. So did my own dad. We still made healthy choices.

Schools should be providing healthier meals, and that trickles down from a higher level, too. Kids should be being taught how to cook properly in school, too.

These options should be being made accessible. But it's still an option to prepare healthy food when and where possible. Don't buy the cereal; buy oats. Veg in a slow cooker. Batch cook where possible. Don't buy bags of crisps, buy fruit and veg.

It isn't impossible to do.

@Gwenhwyfar did you see the proposal for state sponsored canteens recently: https://www.theguardian.com/society/article/2024/aug/31/calls-for-return-of-churchills-national-restaurant-service-to-tackle-food-inequality

My gran used to talk very fondly about them. Harder in rural areas though where there are already some of the biggest food access problems.

100% agree! I had no idea how to cook, and hated it when I tried - the only reason I ever started was because I moved abroad and couldn’t find any convenience food. Otherwise I’d never have stopped eating so many UPF!

I started reading ultra processed people but I thought the study he described at the beginning was flawed. It compared home cooked food (with the same macro nutrients of protein, carbs and fat) with upf and found people were more likely to overeat on the upf.

But for a proper study they need to compare like with like. One group eats the home made cake with the same amount of sugar whilst the other has the shop bought one. One group has the fries from McDonald's with lots of salt whilst the other has ones made from real potatoes but still deep fried with lots of salt etc. That way they can narrow down how much of the problem are these weird ingredients and how much is it just that these foods are very palatable and easy to overeat. They might even be able to identify particular bad ingredients.

I think these observations were made a long time ago in a round about way by those critiquing low fat diets. When they pointed out that a natural full fat yogurt with chopped up strawberries was healthier than a low fat yogurt with tonnes of sugar and strange chemicals it was as much a real food versus upf observation as fat versus carbs.

My son is just starting on the ADHD/Autism pathway. His ADHD symptoms have improved since I have cut most UPF foods from his diet along with mine. I make most things from scratch anyway but the difference is huge. He also complains less of stomach aches. Sometimes we have things that are UPF due to necessity but I'd say we are around 85% UPF free and much better for it. Most UPF are things like sugary breakfast cereal, flavoured crisps, sweets, frozen pizza, ready meals, supermarket bread, sausages, packet meats, biscuits and cakes. We didn't eat much of that anyway and don't eat meat or fish.
Dd eats a lot of UPF at her dad's and hates it now. She comes home feeling greasy and queasy.
Its made me more conscious of what I eat and what I feed my family. I'm a single parent and find time fairly easily. Today is going to be spent batch cooking some things ready for the week ahead.
If your diet is very high in upfs to start with the change will be harder to make but for us it was easy.

I dare say they’re a good way of making money for the publishers.

And I agree with @Lentilweaver , but would point out that there are also quite a lot of Brits who very largely eat unprocessed food.

I’m not sure how having a different opinion shows that I have a chip on my shoulder, that certainly isn’t my intention or my thoughts. I’m sorry if it’s come across that way.
As I said in my OP I, personally eat a relatively low UPF diet but I do have UPF foods included in a plant centred vegetarian diet. Halloumi, veg and salad wrap with a shop bought wrap for example. This isn’t really about my personal preference or experience though, it’s more about the fact that this movement appears to be making a judgment on women and mothers who are trying their best at all corners of life, and being judged and criticised for not providing a UPF free diet. I think it’s not about our own personal experience, but looking at the wider picture and realising that the blame doesn’t lie with the individual. I think we turn to our own experiences too easily and think “I can do it so why can’t that person” without actually taking into consideration what the barriers are for that individual. For example, temporary housing, mental health conditions, learning disabilities, lack of cooking equipment, relying on what comes in a food bank parcel, domestic violence etc etc etc. Anyway it’s been so interesting reading everyone’s comments! I didn’t know it would have such a response!

I've not read the book either. I don't want to or need to. If something has a long list of ingredients then I don't buy it but then I've been reading labels since I turned veggie aged 13. I won't buy ready made veggie or vegan things like sausages, burgers etc because they are full of things that aren't actually food, are expensive and leave us feeling uncomfortable.
@TeaforTheWins Crosta and Mollica wraps are great and UPF free. Making your own is supposed to be easy but I haven't tried that yet.

I think education about what we eat is very important so that we can all make an informed choice.

I actually made some home made hummus once and gave it to a friend to taste, not telling him which was shop bought and which was home made. The shop bought one won!
Home made hummus, though, is exactly the type of thing there is no chance of me making on a regular basis.

When I mentioned salad, it was with the aim of not having to cook at all so pan fried salmon wouldn't be in there. Cold smoked salmon, maybe.

Tofu, I actually like, but I wonder whether it's safe for me as it's oestrogenic and I have fibroids.

I actually own that book, but have never made anything from it.

I hadn't seen it, no.
I was thinking more of money-making things so that capitalism could be made to work for us rather than the other way around.
The easiest way to bring healthy food to a mass of people would be healthy school meals, but it seems impossible...

I eat a decent diet, cook from scratch etc.

However, when PPs claim that it’s quick and easy to make a loaf I think we’ve lost the argument. I made my own bread in lockdown and it’s graft! All that kneading, waiting for it to prove, knocking it back, waiting for it to prove again, etc before you can even bake the bloody thing takes hours and leaves you with aching shoulders. A proper loaf should cost about 20 quid given the work that goes into it!

It’s more sensible to suggest people start making small changes like cutting out UPF snacks and replacing them with fruit/cheese/veg, and adding more vegetables to meals. Stop drinking juice and pop and drink more water. It’s cheaper and easier.

What this thread is showing with admirable clarity is how nutritional trends become a stock for women to beat other women with. The implied criticism in ‘it’s so easy to bake your own sourdough - I can’t understand why you reach for the processed crap’, or, alternatively ‘you in your fairy castle don’t understand the reality of us busy working mums’ is, may I venture, more toxic and corrosive than eating the odd Mars bar.
Do men sneer at one another like this?
For what it’s worth: I absolutely agree that foods high in cane syrup, salt, palm oil etc are designed to be cheap and addictive. They are not nutrient-dense and they are a major contributor to obesity because they don’t make you feel full. On the other hand, it seems patently absurd to beat up oneself or other people for consuming small occasional quantities of something that might not tick whatever boxes are in vogue that week.

Vegetarian is nothing to do with processed or not. In fact, as a vegetarian, I think it's harder to avoid UPFs as much of the food marketed to us or available in restaurants is vegetarian. This has actually got worse rather than better since the increased popularity of veganism for environmental reasons.

"Like who NEEDS a supermarket croissant, canned soup, or biscuits?"

Canned soup is not necessarily UPF. Depends what is added I think.

I agree that nobody needs biscuits, but I do find myself occasionally needing something like a croissant to eat on the go when I can't buy a sandwich (which would also be UPF).

"It's hardly labour to boil a few spuds and other veg, grill some fish and fry up a handful of tomatoes."

Oh it is. I think seeing my parents peeling and chopping potatoes put me off having a family of my own. The very definition of drudgery for me.
I'm not saying I'll never get over my aversion for cooking, but it needs to be easy and quick for me now living alone. If the stuff can be cooked quickly in the microwave that will help.

Isn't the pasta UPF anyway?

The Guardian had an article recently agreeing that it's not realistic for most people to bake their own bread:

The experts: dietitians on 20 ways to cut down on UPFs while still eating what you love | Ultra-processed foods | The Guardian

Bread is definitely labour or time intensive. I make mine in the kitchenaid stand mixer but it's still a pain to wait for the rises and it takes hours. Worth it for toast though. I've got a bread machine from a charity shop but haven't tried it yet. I might do today.

Isn't the pasta UPF anyway?

wtf
pasta is merely processed.

but that's the problem with upf. a lack of definition and the insistence of some that totally ordinary foodstuffs, like pasta or bread, are upf and therefore the work of the devil.

No, normal pasta is processed but not UPF. But pasta ready meals are UPF.
Rice is not UPF. But those ready meals with rice are.
That's the thing. We don't need to cut everything out.

Interesting because I know a few people (mainly Italians) who occasionally make their own pasta to be sure of what is in it.