To go to church to broaden my childs choice of school

[AwkwardAadvark]

Hello
I live in an area where the comprehensive schools aren't great. There's only 1 I'd be happy for him to go too. We also live by 2 religious schools that I'd be happy with. Issue is these schools require church attendance. It's a while off but I do worry about these things. Do I start going to church to widen his choice of school?

I’d have done this if I’d been in your position. It’s been done in my extended family and worked out well for everyone involved. Don’t hate the players, hate the game.

Vicars might be able to tell if people are only there because if the school place, but they are still getting the opportunity to spread God’s word so they should be happy with any reason that brings a family to church. If the admission criteria is about church attendance and you attend church, then I’d trust a vicar not to lie about it when asked, even if they don’t think you’re the right sort of attendee.

Yes as the eldest child has no one to go before them as per my op

We are doing it at the moment, 2-3 Sundays a month. I'm not religious at all (although I do appreciate the basic values) and it's been fantastic!

Really worth doing it if you can find a church with a nice family friendly service and Sunday school.

A lot of the families will be in the same boat and it means the kids will know each other when they get to school.

Everyone has been so lovely, they really take an interest in the kids, and we love the community aspect.

I'm a practicing Catholic and enjoy church. YWNBU to attend church to get DC into the right school. You will not be the only one. Might find you like the community.

I've always quite enjoyed church. It might actually be nice?

My friend did this, schools in their catchment areas are all oversubscribed so to increase their chances of getting 1st choice school they got their DC christened and go to monthly family church. She doesn't see it as a big deal because although she isn't religious she was christened and the DC enjoy going to church so it's not doing them any harm.

The church folks will definitely be able to spot why you are there but they won't mind.

My Mum used to keep the roll in a church and when a very elderly person signed up she used to say "ah, an insurance job" but she just tried even harder to make them welcome, because she knew they were a bit uncertain and needed an extra warm welcome.

Unfair to guilt-trip the OP.

This whole thing is just another example of the terrible failures in our education system.

Near me there are no valid options available because all the good schools are rammed to the gills/overflowing/unappealable. So some parents have to fake being religious, to avoid the many issues caused by their DC attending classes with kids who are so violent, abusive, dysfunctional or traumatised they shouldn't be in mainstream school.

There's an RC girls' selective grammar in my area that had 700+ girls competing for 150 places in Y7, because the other local "good" school has extremely problematic intake.

It's just a farce.

@Oblahdeeoblahdoe " Does the vicar actually have to know you and give a reference?"

In many cases, yes.

We did, openly. It's always been an option for those who can't buy houses.
I went and talked to the vicar about what I did and didn't believe, and what I was seeking. Which was a place in a good school and my Dc to understand what others were taught and believed, and to understand the principles of Christianity as taught by Jesus the man and prophet. What else they did or didn't chose to believe beyond that would be their choice, not his or mine. They would also be exposed to other religions and none.

Our vicar was excellent, supportive and we continued going years after the rest of the year intake group were gone, and still turn up to give a hand occasionally.

Yeah I would - because she isn’t religious so the faith in question is absolutely irrelevant. Hope you didn’t put your back out with that reach though 😂

Sometimes the admission criteria expect several years of attendance at church and baptism. Then there will be other criteria too. No reason why you shouldn’t do what you think is right to get your child into a school. Remember too, that you’re not choosing a school, you’re selecting preferences.

We moved house with school catchments as the first priority so do prioritise dcs education, but I'd have drawn the line at sitting through that much church..! And I'm not really on board with religious schools either.

That said, you won't be the first or last to do this.
Some years ago we went to a particular Sunday service with baby DC1 for a random irrelevant reason and were very nicely greeted by the vicar, who obviously didn't recognise us. He was very jolly as he asked us if we were here for the school and handed us a piece of paper to sign in with 😄

It's no more immoral doing this imo than having a state education system where certain schools have faith-based admissions.

I think it's incredibly hypocritical to do this. I would have loved my daughter to go to the local CoE infant school when she was younger but I would never have dreamt of trying to cheat the admissions system by suddenly starting to attend church to get her a place. I'm not religious at all, but I have enough respect for religions to not be a hypocrite.

I know someone who actively tried this.
Threw themselves into church life - didn't merely attend weekly - also helped with church duties.

After absolute years of duty - didn't get a school place.

Immediately cut ties with the church.

I think the church saw through their cunning plan 🤣. Point proven really.

Is it really? It's a fact that a Catholic child may lose a place in a school run for Catholics because the OP is gaming the system. I would call that unfair.
And what of her own child? He/she will have to practise deceit since she's declared they are RC. She would be better off applying truthfully - if she's in the school's cachement area, she will be considered.

smacks a bit hypocritical doesn't it.. you're going to go to church purely so that your child can get into a better school.. are you going to go to church everyweek? are you going to throw yourself into church life? are you only going to go until you have a school place and then what?

that said.. lots of people seem to do it

Yanbu though it is a fucking travesty that our children’s access to education is hindered / helped by whether or not they follow a religion 😡

I agree with this. The situation is utterly ludicrous, but it isn't of your making and it's not on you to fix it. If you feel it will be of net benefit to your children then do it.

Would people really put their child in a shit school because of their principles I think not the UK education system is unfair there are some really terrible schools untill education is fair for all parents, will do the beat they can
I note that many mumsnetters are obsessed with Grammer schools despite their only being 163 in the whole of England so for most it's nor a choice either

Another vicar here. It is important to check the admissions criteria as they vary by school. Some ask for regular attendance which might be at least once a month over two years. Others may want to know how long the parents have been on the electoral roll. Others might just want proof of baptism. A very oversubscribed RC secondary in London would at one time only accept baptisms under six months. I was friends with the admissions secretary at the time and the excuses for no baptism and no church attendance could get very creative.

I have been asked to lie on admissions forms. One family said they came once a fortnight and we only saw them once every couple of months. Others thought that regular attendance was Christmas and Easter. Unfortunately that wasn't how the school defined it.

I'm not a fan of faith based admissions criteria and none of the schools where I have been chair of governors have had it. If it is there read the criteria carefully.

There's nothing wrong with church attendance if that is needed to get into your chosen school. It's not dishonest or hypocritical at all - you are simply fulfilling the admission criteria no different to someone moving house into catchment for example.

Dishonest would be bribing the priest to say you'd attended when you hadn't. Or if the requirement was to state that you believed in it all.

Frankly most churches are empty or have a handful of over 80s attending each week. They should be glad to have a few more people going for whatever reason. Once you're in their they have the chance to influence you.

You want to take a place away from a genuinely religious child?

Just go. You and your son will only benefit from it. You might hear and learn something that actually will be beneficial to you, who knows.