To think warehouse workers and shop assistants have very different jobs?

[LovelyBitOfHam]

Inspired by this article regarding Next workers, similar to previous cases with supermarkets.

AIBU to think these are very different roles, and it’s fair to pay warehouse workers a higher wage?

I have worked retail before and didn’t love it, but I don’t think I would ever accept a job in a warehouse.

I’m also very aware that working in a store in a shopping mall or city centre is far easier to get to than an out of town warehouse on an industrial estate, and pay should reflect this.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cj0817jd9dqo

Supermarket worker

I have worked in the warehouse picking items from a list

I have worked on the shop floor; stacking shelves, on the till, also changing prices on the shelves

I have worked in the office doing data entry for the goods that need ordering

All the same rate of pay

Hmm not sure your argument holds water. For instance parking in town centres is expensive and congestion is a factor. Parking at an industrial isnt. All there's often subsidised transport to large warehouse operations

Retail. Lots of front facing work. I'd have thought a broader skill set. Certainly seems equal pay is the right judgement

In every company I’ve ever worked for client facing roles pay a premium. On that basis I’d say retail workers deserve more.

How you get to and from work should not impact the wage you are paid for the work you do but the skill set. Other than eg a fork lift driver (and I would imagine they are paid more than those without the licence) I can't see that warehouse work is more skilled than retail. Both require stocking/lifting and an eye for detail etc but retail also requires customer service skills, potentially dealing with money etc etc so on balance I'd say retail is probably slightly more skilled than warehouse tbh.

Retail workers have to deal with the PUBLIC

They need a bloody medal as well as a payrise!

Customer facing roles are hard because you're dealing with the general public and they can be absolute arseholes

Warehouse work is physically demanding

Different skills are needed for each role.

Shouldn't the market decide which one gets paid more? If you can't get enough staff in one role, then increase the pay offer?

Our fork lifters where I used to work got paid an extra £15 a week

The forklifts used in warehouses were basic and training was quick. No real skull involved

Same with PPT to move pallets. I trained in half a day

The rest is picking stock orders using a handset.....easy job

There's quite an amount of warehouse-style activity at retail premises as well, though. Unloading and loading goods and stacking/ hanging stock as well as inventory management etc. It might not be on the same scale, but then there are other duties which are no less onerous (i.e. customer service).

I don't think they are 'very different', and not different enough to have blanket pay policy approaches.

They are different, but both demanding. Of course they should have equal pay. 🙄

Yes, they're different, but I'd say the customer facing role is more demanding, requiring a more varied skill set and should, if anything, be better paid.

Except roles requiring specific qualifications (I.e. forklift drivers) of course it shouldn't be any different. Just because YOU wouldn't want to do the job doesn't mean it deserves more pay.

This is all about value of the roles to Next and how it informs a pay policy,

The tribunal believes these roles are of equal value to Next. If market forces edge up warehouse rates of pay, this doesn’t mean the job is of more value. Experts look at job descriptions and what is required for each role. It’s not necessarily the same skills but as a whole they are considered to be of equal value. In the Next pay policy, the men in the warehouses get more money. This is not an accurate reflection of their value in
relation to the shop assistants value. They are now deemed to be equal, so equal pay.

Remember the Ford Dagenham car seat ladies? Famous equal pay case. Their work was deemed to be of equal value to Ford as the assembly line workers. They had been paid less. The case became a film.

You can think what you like, OP. Just as the Tribunal did. Next might appeal it, and another Tribunal judge/chair will then be having a think about it, too.

The joys of democracy.

Equal pay for different (your word) jobs?

Yes and I’m free to start a discussion on it. You’re free to not engage if you so wish.

I’d say warehouse work is more physically demanding- I worked in retail and while we had a lot (a lot!!) of lifting to do it was nothing on warehouse staff!!!

I would much rather deal with goods than members of the public. But they are all part of the same operation. Retail operative could be warehouse worker or shop worker. You are all part of the process of selling consumer goods.
If you needed to operate a fork lift for example, then you should be paid more. But if it's just moving produce then there shouldn't be a huge difference in pay.
Some would argue dealing with customers should command a higher wage. It's a skill and you have to look presentable and smile and be polite all the time. In a warehouse it's back end so if you're not feeling sprightly and looking fantastic that day then it's less of a big deal.

Asda retail staff have already won a similar case some years ago. Putting things on shelves in a shop is of equal value to the company as it is putting them on shelves in a warehouse.

The warehouse is unlikely to be more physically demanding because bulk items will be lifted with fork lifts etc. Plus even if it is, shop staff have extra demands and skills re dealing with the public, handling cash, operating tills etc.

Any role which involves dealing with the public should be paid a substantial premium for doing so.

I don't think parking has anything to do with it, it's the job role not how far it is from your house.

Physically demanding doesn't necessarily mean deserving more pay. When I worked in a shop as well as serving customers and putting out deliveries (which involved a lot of heavy lifting), I had to resolve customer complaints, answer phones, do a lot of admin, especially financial admin, order supplies, manage people, plan events, and come up with creative displays and dress windows, etc. It was the kind of shop where everything had to be beautifully gift-wrapped and the service was quite involved. (It was quite a fancy shop). I wasn't even on the management team. I bet most of these companies wouldn't let a lot of their warehouse workers loose on the customers.

I can't imagine Next warehouse is that demanding, it will be mostly done by robots, they can't check anything as I have had some ridiculous errors in the past with orders.

Agree forklift drivers should earn a higher wage, but there is probably forklift driving at bigger retail stores too (or at least there was at the retail store I worked in as a teen). So it's probably not enough evidence of them being such intrinsically different jobs as to be worth different wages.

I think the relative level of difficulty of these types of jobs is mostly subjective. Some people will think it's easier dealing with the public than doing more manual work, some people have the opposite opinion. Both are valid! It isn't like fewer people can do one or the other and it's also not the case that one requires more skills, qualifications or experience.

@ClaudiaWankleman yeah, I agree..
It's like I was an office manager, so I did admin, reception, fixed the appliances/boiler, made food, sometimes had to do cleaning...all same wage because it's to the same end. You don't just do one specific task only. Unless you're on a production line or data entry is your job title.