To ask what you'll be doing to avoid the Labour tax hikes

[OptimismvsRealism]

Pension contributions
Gift aid
Selling my shares now while CGT is relatively low

What really worries me is that all the professionals we actually need to want to be here will just fuck off elsewhere, though.

It's not like we're knee deep in hospital doctors.

Yes - I feel this is just a scare mongering goady post to be honest

Yes! Tbh if the super wealthy take the tax hit as well and I mean in a proportionate way then fine but they won’t, paying the same rate of inheritance tax on a £750k property is not the same as paying that rate on inheritance tax on a £27 million property! The middle always having to bail literally everyone out!

Its harder to be asked to pay more when a lot of the problems are caused by poor management by government or public bodies rather than lack of funding. A lot of the problems in the health service are staffing problems caused by a failure of future planning around staffing. It was well known there was a ticking time bomb of staff due to retire and an increase in part-time working staff, yet little was done to ensure we would have the health staff we need. And as workload pressures increase due to lack of staff, more staff leave and you get in a really vicious loop its very hard to get out of. This was entirely preventable.

Ditto the housing market. The effect of the mass reduction in social housing through selling of council houses should have been predictable and certainly was observable long ago.

I've worked in local government for thirty years, in different LA's and different Depts and have rarely had enough to do, and disturbingly frequently have had next to nothing to do. Despite austerity and the need for mass cutback to services and staff, there are still many staff, including entire teams, who are chronically underworked. This is a failure of effective management, and failure to manage managers, on a mass scale. There are also other staff who are poorly utilised as there is no system of analysing staff strengths and skills and ensuring they are given work which plays to their strengths and skills and experience.

The idea that we have great public services that just need more money to sort their problems out is simply not true.

I only found an ONS report, not an IMF one, if you can find

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/personalandhouseholdfinances/incomeandwealth/bulletins/theeffectsoftaxesandbenefitsonhouseholdincome/financialyearending2022

This only talks about net recipients of tax.

In FYE 2022, 53.8% of all UK individuals were net recipients (living in households receiving more in benefits than they paid in taxes), a reduction of 1.2 percentage points since FYE 2021. A much greater proportion of retired individuals were net recipients (89.2 %) in comparison with non-retired people (46.0%), largely because of the classification of State Pension and Pension Credit as cash benefits.

But the thing is about society is that a persons worth isn't just in how much tax they pay. Many people who are net recipients will be working jobs that allow the net funders to earn.

Would you really be able to earn your money without the society around you to support you? I very much doubt anyone could

Are you proposing that an individual like Murthy who doesn’t live in the UK, wasn’t born in the UK and who built all his wealth outside the UK should be subject to tax in the UK?

Presumably on the basis of his daughter living here? Or his daughter’s spouse’s profession? Do you think we deserve that tax more than India does?

The whole tax system will need to change in a few years anyway when AI takes over a large proportion of jobs and there will need to be a move towards taxing corporations more to deal with the lower income tax take. It will be very interesting to see how governments deal with this shift. Lets just hope that the UK manages to maintain a few of the highly productive AI businesses or we will all be screwed.

@Over40Overdating I didn't say it was better under the Tories, in fact it was terrible. The tax burden is the highest ever I believe and yes I agree re lining their mates pockets.

However during the Blair years, the years where we were awash with money, they managed it badly. We should have been in a very strong position to weather the crash however thanks to the poor management we were not. Selling gold reserves at their lowest point, the PFI scandal. Add onto that the decisions made by Blair on free movement. I could go on. This government have already caved to the unions, that's your starter for 10 and shows where we're heading.

Anyway this thread is about tax and what we're doing. The other thing I'm doing is talking to my DC about looking to work overseas. The state pension won't be around by then (we probably not for them if, like us, they work and progress) so that's another thing not to stay here for it start paying into.

To a point yes. How can you plan for anything until we know what the budget looks like??
We have no idea what their plans are.
I am not an economist but I do hope they don’t put taxes up blanket across the board for everyone. I know people who earn just too much to qualify for any help - no UC or benefits of any kind and are struggling. To put taxes up for them would be madness.

Lots of people will leave the country. In 2023 alone, something like 10,000 millionaires left. I guess even more will leave or reduce their hours or retire early.

Basically all the people who voted Labour thought that Labour were going to tax "the rich" ie not them.

In fact they are going to tax the workers. Anyone that works is going to be hit by swingeing tax rises.

Sunak warned everyone about this. On every TV debate. And quelle surprise, it is actually going to happen. It's going to be interesting to see whether it matches up with the 2K per household that was originally suggested.

Yes, I laughed my head off at that one as well. I’m pretty sure the exodus of doctors didn’t start under a Labour government.

I expect to pay a bit more tax. I can afford to - so I should.

I want to see improvements to basic services and housing. My DS is at a decent school - we have qualified teachers in all sciences and two foreign languages, for example. This should be the case in all schools. I live in a reasonably warm house in a reasonably safe neighbourhood. I know how lucky I am and I don’t have a problem reducing expenditure on luxuries to pay more tax so others can be better supported.

For all those "happy to pay more tax for a fairer society", I do hope you realise there's nothing to stop you making voluntary contributions - and indeed that you're already doing so?

And if further general tax rises arrive, here's hoping you won't be disappointed when it all gets frittered away instead of being spent on actual services

I don't get this obsession with tax among those who are comfortably off. We're not a high tax country and even if Labour increases them we still won't be. I can afford to pay more and frankly I should,I am fine with that. Yes, I'm even fine with not seeing the benefits myself, there are other people who need those more.

That’s a very fair point, but not all charities are corrupt or involved in dodgy practices. I also think it’s the responsibility of the donor to decide where their money should go. If something dodgy comes to light about the charity the donor is donating to, they of course have the right to stop donating and, they wish, to move their money to a different charity.

But the thing is about society is that a persons worth isn't just in how much tax they pay. Many people who are net recipients will be working jobs that allow the net funders to earn

Would you really be able to earn your money without the society around you to support you? I very much doubt anyone could

Very wise words

Let's just pray for a fair tax system where everyone sees rhe same % increase, not just those on higher salaries

● 1950s Highest rate: 90%
● 1960s Highest rate: 91.25%
● 1970s Highest rate: 83%
● 1980s Highest rate: 60%
● 1990s Highest rate: 40%
● 2000s Highest rate: 40%
● 2010s Highest rate: 45%
● 2020s: Highest rate: 45%

So despite all the wailing about the injustice of the tax system the Highest earners in our society have actually had their tax burden cut in half since the 50s.

Thank you, @namename

I truly think it's the only sensible way to go. Money could be re invested into the country's infrastructure, health care, better pay. The extremely wealthy then get better infrastructure for their assets, healthier employees and a richer country to sell to.

I do not understand why the government insists on taking it away from those who already have so little.

I wouldn’t say I was happy to pay more tax. Just won’t lose any sleep over it 😂

That is why I said “the benefit bill overall”

Isn't it shocking how many people are happy to show themselves up as greedy bastards only out for themselves though?

Such a gross thread. I’ll be thankful that this is my biggest concern🙄 and yes I’m from a high earning household.

I know. They’ll still complain about the nhs though!

Clever millionaires dont stay in country long enough to pay taxes and/or use offshore banking/investments

Both higher rate tax payers - planning to work less and retire early to Europe.
DOI I’m a hospital consultant and won’t flog myself into an early grave if the financial rewards and conditions are not right.