To agree with this article about issues with the NCT and their focus on ‘natural births’

[Edenspirits73]

My experiences with the NCT were toxic - I had a forceps delivery, episiotomy and all the pain relief including an epidural with my first child. I also struggled to breast feed and had to bottle feed after 3 weeks of endless trying and feeling awful.

NCT made me feel like a failure in every sense because I couldn’t breast feed and had a medical intervention. As it happens, my second baby was the polar opposite - fast natural birth, no drugs, breast fed. But the scars of ‘failure’ and how terrible they made me feel stayed with me.

I think they are quite toxic and women should never be made to feel bad for their birth experiences.

www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/article/2024/aug/27/women-feel-like-failures-if-they-havent-had-a-normal-birth-how-the-nct-has-shaped-childbirth-in-the-uk

I half agree with this. It was 10 years ago but I distinctly remember doing a c-section role play where we counted out how many medical staff would be in the room and not to panic. It was so helpful as I had an EMCS and would have panicked over staff numbers.

i do agree it’s quite breast feeding oriented but isn’t everything.

Same here, tho I had c sections. We were apparently so embarrassing that when they mistakenly invited us to the post birth tell all for the next set of classes, upon realising their mistake they quickly shushed us and asked us to leave.

As an obs anaesthetist NCT does my head in with their horror stories on epidurals so people are either too scared to have one or feel like a failure

Like why be in pain unnecessarily when you can sleep through labour, why reject the safest form (except gas) of pain relief for labour, which if you did need theatre, means you have the means to quickly make you numb enough for what is needed to deliver baby whilst peacefully having it explained by the anaesthetist (rather than still contracting like crazy in a lot of pain whilst we try to rapidly explain consent to the spinal then curl you in a ball and have 10mins to do it under time pressure).

Yes there's lots of people in theatre but we all have our individual roles to keep you safe

Just makes no sense. Most anaesthetists will have one

I didn’t personally have this experience with NCT in 2022 (so post Ockenden) - our course leader was good at actively bringing up both complications and more medicalised births. We had a whole section of a class dealing with plans for if we needed an emergency Caesarian, etc.

The lactation person they brought in for a section was definitely more crunchy. I had a very easy time breastfeeding so this isn’t really my axe to grind, but I think if I hadn’t I might look back on that session with some annoyance I hadn’t had more prep on other feeding methods.

That said! I’m in South London and the people attending the course leaned very much into that whole middle class hypnobirthing, breath-out-your-baby end of the spectrum despite not really being like that in other facets of their life. I think it did influence me into weirdly wanting to avoid an epidural, although I was very open to immediately ditching that plan (which is what happened lol). In the end, out of the 8 of us, 2 actually had emergency caesarians and 3 emergency ventouse/forceps deliveries. I was one of the forceps deliveries - I was put on the sepsis protocol and had a significant haemorrhage, so I definitely wasn’t breathing anything out.

No completely disagree. My nct classes prepped us totally in case we had a c-section. We role played how many people would be in the operating theatre, how quick a crash c-section would be and how we'd know things weren't right.
When unfortunately I did have a crash c-section that knowledge was invaluable for both me and then dh.
In 2009 nct had already renamed itself (national not natural) and was giving informed and helpful info

My recollection is of a helpful, balanced course which introduced us to friends we still have many many years later. I remember the same role play on caesarian procedure!

Reading the article, I am
not convinced that the organisation can be blamed for individual cases and the failings of the professionals involved.

It was 10 years ago now but this wasn’t my experience of NCT. I had heard this about them at the time though. I don’t know whether it’s still the case but I came to think it was dependent upon your instructor to some extent

I think it may depend on the group/teacher. Our group had a lot of women set on no pain relief/hypno birthing, and our teacher was supportive of their choice but stressed the importance of them engaging in the session on pain relief so they’d be informed if they changed their mind (most of them did!). She also gave us a very balance view of epidurals with a lot of up to date research

Interesting comment.

I could say “Most midwives would have a homebirth” but that doesn’t mean it’s the right thing for everyone. We are all experts in our own right and our own knowledge and experiences shape our own choices.

It’s interesting because I remember that same role play (from 14 years ago) and I felt like the takeaway was ‘this will be the worst outcome ever because there will be so many people in the room and it won’t be special’. I did have a caesarean in the end and yes there were lots of people in the room but it was still a special experience. I felt like NCT had fear mongered about caesareans.

Maybe I did have a really bad experience with them but I know I wasn’t the only one. No mention at all of c sections and the issues that might come with birth, epidurals etc. and a crochet boob focussing solely on breast feeding. No mention of pain relief at all actually.

SocksShmocks I think it’s best dependent on the course leader. Same content but slightly different spin on things.

I hear bad and good things about NCT. I think it completely depends on the course leader!

I agree op. Is there any point in womens' lives thar is not twisted to make us feel bad.
I had a doula who was inti hypnobirthing..I had a crash c section...i insisted on it...it was grwat!
I should have not had a doula and gone for the drugs!

I agree with you. I see birth as birth- no matter how the child comes out. No need to martyr yourself if you need pain relief or assistance- that's why it exists! All that matters is that the child is delivered safely and is healthy (and if they aren't, that this is quickly recognised and intervention provided).

Your experience sounds almost identical to mine (forceps, episiotomy, spinal block, child wouldn't breast feed etc).

I deliberately chose an alternative to NCT as I didn't like their take on various things as an organisation, or the variation in course leaders (my midwife wasn't a fan if the local one, a d asking around it sounded like they were one of the more judgemental ones) I ended up being in a (private) midwife led class that equipped me much better for all of the eventualities and making decisions.

I don't carry a lot of those same feelings ans burdens you seem to, and have often wondered whether this was why (I did have a breastfeeding panic, which my GP helped to resolve in my head by reminding me that it's not a religion)

The article literally says that the issue is the variation in course leaders because of the lack of centralised control. Your experience doesn't "completely disagree" with what is written. It's acknowledged that some tutors are good.

I feel like half the posters on here haven't actually read what the author wrote, it's a nuanced article, it doesn't say the NCT is universally terrible at all, and it acknowledges they have had a positive role in challenging paternalistic medicine in the past. But there's no question there is very poor and dangerous advice given out by some of their teachers.

I had a fairly positive experience with NCT. The point is its the luck of the draw IMHO. Yes maybe exercise and relaxation do help with a natural birth but it isnt a guarantee. I cant see anything wrong with opting for an epidural.

Totally agree, op. I also think they are 50 years out of date in presenting the experience as being about standing up to a medical team who will be with you throughout labour trying to force interventions on you. These days far more women are left unattended and desperate for some care and support rather than the opposite. I remember writing in my plan that I didn’t want continuous monitoring and the MW saying “that’s lucky as we’ve got one monitor for every four mums today” 😭

The NCT would do better to advocate for more support and resources for women in labour, not less, and to teach women and their partners how to advocate for themselves to receive care in a hospital setting, rather than how to resist it.

I skipped this and opted for a private group that you paid for. With that came welcoming of anyone's experience and choice , nautral/csec, bottle or breast , it didn't matter. The support was there for whatever choices you made. And the women(some are still friends today) all were so welcoming.

I've only heard bad experiences so decided to avoid.

You also pay (substantially I believe) for the NCT. It’s not free.

Was more meant to imply they're incredibly safe and the risks are tiny...

just from lw I don't think most midwives would have home births tbh

same way never ever heard of a home birth in an anaesthetists birth plan (only one that occurred v much accidentally!) - unfortunately because we only ever get involved with emergencies, not the lovely pleasant nil intervention births, our views are somewhat skewed by what can go wrong and the speed at which it can go wrong, none of which is fixable by a pair of midwives in your lounge... plus hospitals are our homeland so don't evoke the same stress response they do in most of the general public

I know 2 colleagues who've done nct in the last year, didn't declare their job role for the first 2 sessions then had to and completely correct the total misinformation/scare stories that were being spouted out

In 2009 nct had already renamed itself (national not natural) and was giving informed and helpful info

It was renamed from natural to national in 1961.

I stayed well away from NCT 25 years ago after hearing what had been said at groups that friends attended. They were pretty critical about some of the advice - one tutor raised doubts about whether going for the 20 week scan was helpful. I would have been one of their ‘failures’ according to what I heard, being induced with DS1 and cs with DS2 and not bf.

I think some tutors have indeed done a lot of damage- just as the breast is best campaign has.

Based on my experience of NCT this year, I whole heartedly can say this wasn’t my experience at all. We went into a lot of depth which c sections, including doing role play for it (which I’m very grateful of, having had an emergency one) as well as a lot around formula feeding during the feeding session. In the end 5 of the 8 couples ended up having a c section- 3 of which were elective, so we did discuss it a lot and I certainly didn’t feel there was any judgement at all- our leader was lovely. I’d always recommend it to people because of the support you get from the group afterwards. I’m so sorry this wasn’t your experience with the organisation.

Interesting, I was very interested in doing NCT but in the end the cost and the fact we were still in many COVID restrictions when I was pregnant meant i never did. My gut feeling is that it is group dependent as I know someone who had a good experience with them and still speaks highly of them 8 years post last child.

I however would have been laughed out of town had I been In the 'wrong' group - I have never been so high on life as I was ion all that has and air I supped, I desperately wanted an epidural but there wasn't time in the end, I had a vantouse and epesiotomy assisted delivery too!
Plus I NEVER wanted to breast feed and the only criticism I had of the hospital I had my baby was they literally grabbed my boob post birth and put baby on to latch! But I very quickly switched to bottles and completely happy with my decision as it was right for me.