To think it’s cruel to bring police dogs into a a massive violent riot as was Southport last night? *edited by MNHQ

[Bullbreedbliss]

The tragedy at Southport has been horrific beyond description and touched us all. However I can’t help but think it was not only ineffective, but irresponsible and cruel to bring dogs into the scene that unfolded during last nights riots. The morning after and we are hearing that dogs have been injured from having bricks thrown in their direction, strangled, kicked and burnt. Bringing half a dozen dogs into a scene where hundreds of people are engaging in such extreme levels of violence and civil unrest was never going to achieve anything except traumatised and injured animals. A poor tactic employed by police at great cost to the animals that did not choose to be there.

There's a lot of unstable and illogical thinking on this thread!

One of the oddest thinking is from poster stating (in some form or other) that they'd rather have the dogs injured than human. Can't work that thinking out - it's not like in a riot is a one or the other situation. All present are vulnerable.

Do these posters think the rioters had a target number of beings to injure? So once they got a dog they stopped attacking?

Or is the thinking that the rioters prioritise injuring dogs over people, so the more dogs there are the fewer people will get hurt, so police use dogs in riots to lower the number of officers injured?

Personally, I wouldn't have thought dogs are specifically sent in to for riots though. For cowd control yes, but not an actual riot underway because then the dog handler has an extra responsibility in a dangerous and chaotic situation. Of course they might end up being in a riot - when a hostile situation turns volatile, just as officers not in riot gear end up more vunrable a riot.

Oh spare me your “animal welfare” concern. Little children have been stabbed to death and your worried about a few TRAINED dogs?!

Rethink your outrage and stop being so tone deaf

If we get in front of a dog we would get bitten. You train the tactics so that it can be used without injury to officers. It’s a debate which I understand people rightly have different views on like any use of force and I’m certainly not going to fall out with anyone over it. We police by consent and the elected government have said no because of the risk of injury. I don’t know of them ever causing a death but they certainly hurt and could cause secondary injury by knocking someone down (although hitting someone with a baton will also do that). I do question why water cannon is fine for the citizens of Northern Ireland but can’t be used in England and Wales.

To posters saying about tear gas and rubber bullets. We’re not allowed to use those either. See previous explanation about the reason for using dogs on leads. They’re used to clear space to assist in pushing back and controlling a crowd. It works that’s why the low life’s have attacked them.

To posters saying about tear gas and rubber bullets. We’re not allowed to use those either

I asked that question but why?

The rioters and thugs protesting on our streets are becoming more violent, knife crime is an everyday occurrence but the police have to operate with their hands tied quite often.

No idea. Rubber bullets can be fatal, if it ricochets from the floor and hits you that way rather than directly. Tear gas is extremely unpleasant. Not sure of any significant damage it could do though. With any amount of force there’s always risks and the inevitable risk of human error in its use which is rightly highly scrutinised. There’s no such thing as a safe use of force. I don’t think the home office like the optics of their use in England and Wales. I suspect there will be more disorder this month though given the toxic state of social media coupled with sunny weather. There were incidents in London, Manchester and Hartlepool last night. Bring on the rain 😬

Is this the same "tone deaf" that you're displaying in your ignorance of the many, many, many repeated comments clearly starting people can care about both, that people aren't ignoring the horror of the children's murders, and that very clearly state there are umpteen threads already dedicated to that and this is simply a side note. But by all means have your faux shock at something that isn't accurate.

Well you at least sound more reasonable in this response as opposed to the earlier comment with shouty exclamation marks and snap assumptions, so it would appear you are indeed more chilled this morning. Hope you managed a good sleep. Enjoy your day.

*question marks, not exclamation marks

Police dogs are trained to cope with crowds, they're trained to bring people down and they're trained to intimidate people.

That doesn't mean they should even have been trained to do these things at all. They don't deserve to be injured by being put in situations they shouldn't ethically be in.

They're also, often, treated appalling once they've retired. It's not all dog biscuits and comfy sofas, it's often abandonment and euthanasia.

Police dogs aren’t abandoned and euthanised? They usually stay with their handler after retirement but if that’s not possible an alternative home is found. They’re not randomly violent dogs they’re highly trained and can live in a home with someone who understands their training and what adjustments may need to be made. Some hardly need it as they slot into family life well. The police benevolent fund and other police charity’s assist with vet bills and costs after retirement. I can’t comment on dogs in the military because it’s not my experience.

Agree it's the same with horses.
That incident is so horrible pray for the family of those little ones

It isn't tone deaf to care about all involved, is it?

Or maybe you are not capable of thinking about more than one thing in your tiny little brain?

Presumably the police themselves are best placed to decide when and where to effectively use police dogs.

I expect the dogs are there to trace explosives and weapons, if they are present, amongst other uses.

I think direct your anger at the people who hurt them, not the public servants who were alongside them trying to keep the peace.

It is perfectly possible to be so deeply sorry about the children but also care about the welfare of police dogs. I can do this.

Newsflash. My house has no animal pictures but I find I can manage to be sad and sorry about the children but also concerned with animal welfare.

I agree with this. Animals shouldn't be forced to work for humans, especially not in fighting.

Police dogs spend a massive amount of time in kennels.

They're not particularly well looked after when they retire either. There are charities picking up the pieces across the UK.

They really don’t spend a massive amount of time in kennels. Or get abandoned. They stay with their handler or are found a suitable home. Is there some evidence you want to provide for this?

Yes, you are very right...I though exactly the same and I am bringing this to the attention of PETA UK for stopping police dogs being brought to the scene in riots etc.

Better dogs get hurt than people. Oh.

It's the rioters who harmed them not the police. A police dog can run after offenders and apprehend them sooner. They are trained to bite but not injure. They might also stop to pet them and help calm some situations down. They don't give them the nickname landsharks for nothing. It's just a small minority that are outright thug's.

Well, yes. The same logic by which we eat chickens and not children.

What has that to do with anything? I'm astounded at the reaction to service dogs being hurt in action. The whole situation is utterly tragic. I'm not in the slightest bit sentimental about animals but the thought of them being hurt because of the stupidity and brutality of humans makes me sad and angry.

Presumably you're a vegan then? Inexplicable place to draw the line otherwise.

There’s a great bit of video of a police dog biting a rioter’s arse. Personally, I think it should have been a police leopard, but you can’t have everything.

Maybe that’s what we should do with XL Bullies: give them all to the police who can train them to attack rioters. If those dogs get hurt no one will care.