To think it’s cruel to bring police dogs into a a massive violent riot as was Southport last night? *edited by MNHQ

[Bullbreedbliss]

The tragedy at Southport has been horrific beyond description and touched us all. However I can’t help but think it was not only ineffective, but irresponsible and cruel to bring dogs into the scene that unfolded during last nights riots. The morning after and we are hearing that dogs have been injured from having bricks thrown in their direction, strangled, kicked and burnt. Bringing half a dozen dogs into a scene where hundreds of people are engaging in such extreme levels of violence and civil unrest was never going to achieve anything except traumatised and injured animals. A poor tactic employed by police at great cost to the animals that did not choose to be there.

You seem to be fixated on eating. I don't eat children or dogs. We are not talking about animals in the food chain and never were. I am concerned with animal welfare and was surprised at the 'don't care' attitude from some people on mumsnet. I can find it in my heart to be full of sorrow for the children and for the animals involved. That's all.

I will care. Though I absolutely agree about giving those dogs to the police to train!

What would be the point of giving XL Bullies to the police if it wasn’t for unleashing them
on violent rioters? They’re no good for anything else.

Fair

I hope this all makes you feel much better.

Have a great weekend.

I can care about people AND dogs.. at the same time.

No I don't think dogs (or horses) in riot situations, is appropriate.

There is no level of training (keeping in mind dog training is and has been my biz for the last 20 years or so) that prepares a dog for a riot situation. There is no level of training that stops them feeling scared, or feeling pain.

But further, taking barking biting frightened dogs who are absolutely willing to use aggression into such a situation is NOT going to de-escalate and the police really need to look at their de-escalation skills across a range of situations.

They are not good and they are getting worse, particularly as standards/requirements for recruits have been lowered in recent years and the police have a really backward stance on training. It is all 'in-house' and in many cases, extremely outdated.

🙄

I agree OP .Dogs are such wonderful creatures,intelligent and caring. A few years back a PC got stabbed in the hand,his dog attacked the criminal and the poor dog got stabbed in the head. Luckily was OK. Still used in war zones ,riots as u say and mountain rescue. Surely must be scared however well trained.maybe time for water hoses to be used.

I watched the riots in Sunderland yesterday, a row of police with plastic shields taunted by 100s of men and trying to ram the police line with what looked like a scaffold poll.
A 12yo arrested for setting fire to a police car in one recent riot.

Now, i'm all for peaceful even disruptive protest but what we seeing now is mindless violence, spurred on by Farage and Robinson with the Police, outnumbered and unable to protect the local communities, due to lack of numbers, all very well, getting police from other areas but then a: who polices those areas? and b: it takes too long.

Once again, slashing Police numbers by 20,000 was a v poor decision.

De-escalate? no what we need is specialist riot control teams, such as the french have or have been used in NI, in these riots, its the only thing these people understand.

Too much softly softly.

Sadly XL's are probably too thick, and certainly aren't agile enough to be police dogs.

Erm, and you @Superfuryanimal 🤷‍♀️

Who said XL bullies should be police dogs?

OMG the police currently can't train their GSD's and Malis well enough to stop them attacking innocent members of the public and their own handlers ... XL bullies would be a nightmare, unless indiscriminately mullering any moving object, police or rioter or innocent passer by is your goal.

We have a family friend who is a dog handler in a high security prison. He says the dogs are sometimes the only effective means of control when tensions overflow.

I did wonder about the innate stupidity of XL Bullies and whether they’d just start attacking police.

But I think the answer is to arm the handlers so that they can shoot any Bullies that turn on them. Leaving the other Bullies to chew rioters.

👍

Those inmates aren't throwing slabs of concrete, using petrol bombs or charging police with scaffold poles.

I prefer the French way of dealing with violent thugs, the residents of these towns are having their areas wrecked, whilst the Police try and "contain the situation"

Weak weak and more weak.

Some people are beyond words! Madness.

Not all the time, but according to the stories he tells, more than you would think.

So that makes it all right to hurl bricks at them? If a trained dog can assist his handler or prevent him being injured then bring him on.

Not in my book, far better ways to deal with these thugs without using dogs i.e water canon and specialised riot police.

Apparently now, the army is being considered, such is the state of our run down police forces.

Where did you hear that about the army?

Was on Sky News, 9 o'clock headlines.

"considered" not that its a definite.

XL bully dogs as police dogs? Nah, I’m sure they could do it but haven’t XL bully dogs been abused enough by people without putting them in situations where they are going to be attacked by thugs? I mean, we are talking about a breed that routinely has its ears and tails chopped off for aesthetic reasons! No other breed has been abused to the same extent and frequency. As for people saying they are thick, I think that says a lot more about your own intelligence but that’s a debate for another day.

It was a dog lover who said XL Bullies are thick. I agree with her, but you seem to think dog lovers are stupid along with everyone else. 🤷‍♀️

If you want to stand up for XL Bullies go for it. I have a sneaking admiration for misguided supporters of lost causes.

While I guess it depends on where you get your information from. If you set your own prejudices aside and look at the breed standards as set by the UKC then ‘This breed does very well in performance events because of its high level of intelligence and its willingness to work.’

‘The ideal American Bully
possesses the athleticism to do well in performance.
Aggressive behavior towards humans is
uncharacteristic of the breed, and highly undesirable.’

https://www.ukcdogs.com/docs/breeds/american-bully-breed.pdf

But who cares what the experts think, when you can just get your information from the daily fail and mumsnet, why would you care.

I can understand using horses as it let's the officers see over the crowds. I'm not sure what the justification for using dogs is but I've seen so many clips of them in these riots without stab vests on or any kind of protection at all. I don't think it's right to deploy dogs to a riot and leave them completely unprotected.