AIBU to think that I shouldn't have bothered working and paying into National Insurance for the 35 years I have done so?

[HauntedBungalow]

When all I will get is the bare State Pension. Whereas other people who did not make these contributions and/or did not work will get Pension Credit plus all the other nice little add ons like Council Tax Support, free boilers and now Winter Fuel Allowance? AIBU to think I'm a mug for bothering to work all those years?

How would people who were poorer, as in because they didn't work orbeven try to better themselves, react if the government said sorry, we won't give extra benefits, only those who worked to earn the benefits of a richer retirement (through working) will reap what they sow (with exception of those who are disabled and couldn't contribute). That's the real position governments should be wondering l.

What? Were you only working for a pension? Not for the wage?

Yes, I don't believe in the needs based approach - its led to all the issues we have, as people always want more and become entitled to the majority of work of others. We should focus on a pay in, get benefits for doing so, including support when struggling based on what you've paid in.

For those who have never paid in, they can't really expect anything.

This has nothing to do with needs, but is core fairness based on what you've done, nobody owes you a living. Those who want to contribute and support like friends and family are free to do so, and that's the model I prefer - make support of others voluntary, don't try and fix all the differences between people.

As I say, not sure why you are correlating this to disability - whatever people do, the more they pay in tax, its only fait they should get access to improved services and those who decide to take a path of doing very little get little back.

It is completely unfair for the OP to work all her life and the person who does SFA to get a similar set of retirement benefits - she should be happy and the other should be regretting it, and maybe shouldn't ever be able to retire at all.

Your situation is unique,
because for most people, they will continue paying NI till state pension age: www.gov.uk/tax-national-insurance-after-state-pension-age#:~:text=Most%20people%20stop%20paying%20National,you%20reach%20State%20Pension%20age.

@Peeler55 So disabled people who have never been able to work should just… what – die? You really can spot a Reform voter a mile off.

Well, quite right too, Peeler. And what if you or your partner/children/friends were unable to work? Should you/they be entitled to nothing?

You seem bitter.
one of my great friends 72, her husband and her paid into a private pension, had their own house, reasonable jobs.
He had a nasty fall, quadriplegic instantly, she left work sheer shock , he went to stock mande ville for a while, house unstuitable, this was 12 years ago.
House had to be sold, nightmare getting council bungalow for him to come home, 8 days away from getting her pension at 60, gets pension credit and lives with her grandson ( yes he works).
i have mid stage Parkinson’s at 62, 7 yrs in, totally unfit for work, left work 3 yrs ago , I ache badly, get brain fog too, yes I get Pip, no remission either.

make support of others voluntary

Good idea. And if their family members become overburdened and simply can't afford to take care of them all, we can send carts down the streets and throw the unproductive scroungers of society onto it where they shall be taken directly to a landfill pit so they can stop stealing oxygen they have no right to breathe.

Sounds as if you want to go back to Victorian workhouses. I’d like to think we’ve moved on as a society since then.

Did you not see the safety net for anyone?

but only if there is absolutely no suitable job available in the world - including self employed. if someone can think, they could be an author for instance.

I'm unclear why disabled people keep being brought up, as there is an implication that disabled people cannot be successful; all people have higher and lower levels of ability to do things.

There would be very few people who have no ability to do anything - although I do accept there are a few. The majority who are less abled than others can work, so we shouldn't get involved in their choices.

You don't pay NI on pension income

I feel so sorry for my friend and her husband - he died earlier this year one day before his 66th birthday, and thus 1 day before he claimed state pension.
She now has to continue to work full time to cover the extra cost of the household, as she no longer has his work or pension contribution, rather than both doing reduced hours as they planned. She has to consider whether to cancel the two holidays they had booked (one was a cruise). Luckily she doesn't have to retire for a few years (much younger) and has been paying into a good pension, so in the longer term once she retires at 68 (or later if she carries on) she'll hopefully be OK - but sadly she is not in best of health.

You do know there are genuine reasons why some people can't go to work. It's not always as simple as you should have gone to work then.

Yes, you have to be in receipt of certain benefits.

You talking about £200 a week? If you own house you should've paid off mortgage by then if renting then get housing benefits or whatever it's called

But easy enough to pay bills and feed yourself on that pension amount surely. I manage it now.

Well perhaps it wasn't the best forward planning on your part, if you feel you weren't working for any good purpose and you missed out on seeing your kids. It's hard to foresee what will come, though, and it's probably a good thing to have a full pension. There's no guarantee benefits will always be there. Also, you can live abroad if you have a pension (can't claim pension credit from overseas, I think), so there are some freedoms having a private income gives you.

I don't know about pensions, but people are certainly better off renting at social housing rent rates rather than busting a gut to pay a mortgage every month, then having their house swiped by the state once they need care. It's outrageous to think of the interest people paid in the 80s/90s to pay off a house when they could have been paying rent on a council property, then living there into old age. (Though I realise some areas are a lot better than others.)

HauntedBungalow · I agree it's a lot easier to stick your hand out and say more more more!!!

Anyone who thinks Rachel Reeves is going to have spare cash to spend on redistribution (aka helping the poorest and most vulnerable in our society aka bribing workshy scroungers to vote Labour) has not been paying attention.

The NHS is in crisis, our court system and prisons are in crisis, universities are hanging on by their fingernails, there's a desperate shortage of housing, social care is totally inadequate, which in turn produces knock on challenges for the NHS, the Army can't be wound down in a time of heightened world tensions, the police aren't staffed to turn up for anything less than an armed riot, even the food hygiene regime is creaking at the seams. I could go on.

I'm pretty sure that extra money for UC and other benefits is going to be a long long way down the list.

Apparently we just have to suck it up and see - shock, horror throughout many of the previous decades despite any ability and so-called Sex Equality legislation many, many women worked in roles for much less than equal pay.

We'd have been laughed off a building site if we tried to earn male-orientated money and not all of us were well suited to those traditionally-female public sector roles such as teaching and nursing, with some pension entitlements attached. You didn't even need to have any dc for the knock-on effects of the 'female' circumstance to inhibit earning potential.

Things appear to be quite a bit different now but I do aver that the bulk of female-type household chores and childrearing still remain placed squarely on most women's shoulders; with the added bonus of apparently having a supposed equal playing field regarding earning money and paying into pensions.

Women have been sold a pup, IMO...

Everyone, just give up work. You will be rolling in it.

What you'll get
Pension Credit tops up:
your weekly income to £218.15 if you’re single
your joint weekly income to £332.95 if you have a partner

Hardly rolling in it

You get a shed load of tax relief on inheritance. So don't make out you're taxed to within an inch of your life - £1 million relief on main property as a married couple sharing tax relief. And even then you only pay tax relief on anything above the £1 million. Hardly taxed to hell. And if you gift a lot of the money before death then you don't have to be IHT on that either.

Let's turn it round. Extreme capitalism - like in the US: people having to sell their house to pay for their medical bills; no workers' rights; pathetic holiday entitlement.

There isn't a totally fair way of organising social security benefits. But if you can live with yourself with the idea of elderly people being destitute, why don't you stand for that platform and see how you get on.

My sister has got her pension two years in age before I'll get mine. My mum retired at 60. Is that fair? No not really. Does it make sense because we can't afford people retiring early as a country. Absolutely.

I’m not sure about this…..I bought my first home in 1989….moved into a larger home 7 years later…..mortgage paid off 2011 …..Been mortgage free since I was 46 ( I’m 59 now)…..so had a larger disposable income from then on….very similar circumstances for all my family/friends of a similar age….. then we have all downsized so released money …..mostly all work for nhs or local authority so decent pensions allowing us to retire between 55 and 60…..yes we worked hard to pay our mortgages….but our kids ate well, dressed well and had holidays abroad every year….if I had rented…..I would still be renting now