AIBU to think that I shouldn't have bothered working and paying into National Insurance for the 35 years I have done so?

[HauntedBungalow]

When all I will get is the bare State Pension. Whereas other people who did not make these contributions and/or did not work will get Pension Credit plus all the other nice little add ons like Council Tax Support, free boilers and now Winter Fuel Allowance? AIBU to think I'm a mug for bothering to work all those years?

You're the one trying to shut down discussion by discounting the desperation felt by many. Suicide hyperbole? I and the PP you quote are obviously feeling marginalised, defeated and having difficulty keeping our shit together for a myriad of complex reasons which we are bringing to the discussion. You are saying our experiences are irrelevant yet they are the real human face of what capitalism and corporatism leads to at the extreme model now in existence. You can't pick and choose contributions to discussion on a public forum.

@Cattery those that live off benefits their entire life are, yes.

Of course people who work and don't turn their area into slums are not scum bags

If you look up research done by the Rowntree foundation you'll discover the "scumbags" of which you speak are virtually mythical.

But it’s true, every time we try to discuss our terrifying welfare bill somebody pops up with ‘well I’ll just end my life then seeing as I’m such a burden’. This is a financial issue, not a moral one - and as tax payers we are absolutely entitled to an opinion and a debate. Monstering us will not work. I do not want this country to increasingly slide into second world status because we are locked into an emotionally blackmailing relationship with social care and benefits.

Agree. From age 12-18 I lived on a social housing estate and although not all, MANY (maybe 60-70%?) could easily have worked but were unemployed, my boyfriend’s aunt was long term unemployed and on benefits due to fibromyalgia but managed to have FIVE babies in that time!!!!! (All while single)

All orchestrated by the likes of Elon musk.
The people at the top hoarding all the money, doing everything they can to keep themselves rich and distract us from that.

Having children and bringing them up is work.
Birth rates are dropping all over the world and governments have been unable to incentivize people to have more children. People who have children are contributing to society.

I can see why you feel as you do op and I can see a few posts from those who are public sector or have good pensions privately

Not everyone is in the position to do the same but many have worked for 35 years or longer and are now thinking about it given the recent decision.

Great so we should all jack our jobs in and live off benefits because we’ve had kids should we? Happy days 🎉🎉🎉🎉

The excuses on here are laughable

It is both a moral and a financial issue. How is it moral that economic policy has allowed many capable and willing people to become unable to participate in that economy at all, leading to that eye watering welfare bill you speak of so glibly, while events like the pandemic allow the biggest transfer of wealth upwards in decades?

How is it moral that housing is allowed to be an unfettered cash cow considered purely as an asset and allowed to be gobbled up by foreign investors while people suffer in substandard accommodation or end up on the streets?

You pick on the "suicide hyperbole" rather than addressing any other point because that's the easy target and you take the pragmatic route of ignoring that fact that financial corruption leads to human misery.

It's so easy to dehumanise people with talk of net contribution, pragmatism and economic units and that's exactly what you're doing.

I'm all for cutting benefits , as long as you start with taking back all that has been stolen by the richest. Then come for the rest.

Ah. Thought not.

@MistressoftheDarkSide not true at all! There are many in the town in which I live! They walk round, thinking they're brilliant, with loads of kids, causing trouble and intimidating people! Without having worked a day in their lives!

The UK is full of work shy scumbags that cause trouble wherever they go! The job centre/benefits staff fawn over them. And the rest of us get the pleasure of paying for them

If you say so 🙄

@MistressoftheDarkSide anyone who lives in the UK who denies this is the case is deluded.

I'm deluded then.

I'll just go and feed my state funded unicorn and then swagger up to the job centre for my extra cookies on the red carpet rolled out for me by the security staff shall I?

I think we need to question the whole capitalistic schtick of producing more children for the economy. It’s a bit dystopian IMO and It’s a really bad reason for people to be having more kids and the government and media needs to wind its neck in about the whole decreasing birth rate issue . People aren’t having kids for many reasons, some financial but some simply just don’t want any or more than one and that’s ok. I used to work with kids in foster care and I wish more People opted not to have kids

And tbh I know families in my hometown who haven’t worked for generations. My friend I spoke about upthread is late 30s and has worked between 0 and 16 hours her whole life. Her kids who are older teens seem very unambitious as well and I can see them taking the same route as their parents . There is moral value in raising well adjusted kids of course, but since we are talking economic benefit - it doesn’t always pan out like that.

Additionally I’d say if someone is too unwell to work and they know they are going to be on benefits, they shouldn’t be having 5 kids unless they have a partner who can provide for them. Many people where both are working wouldn’t be able to afford 5 kids. That is of course different from someone who has 5 kids then becomes unemployed or disabled afterwards.

Surely you worked for the salary rather than to pay for a state pension? I don't think you needed to work to make the National Insurance contributions because as people on job seekers allowance get the contributions paid. If you are a SAHP the contributions are paid too if you claim child benefit although I don't think that was always the case.

I assumed most of the people who need pension credit are those who didn't buy a house (I don't think state pension is high enough for rent) or those who didn't work because they were carers rather than people who were unemployed and claiming job seekers allowance. Is that not the case?

Im in a tenant group and HAs dont make it easy to go out to work. This was posted in our group.

"Tuesday we have to stay in all day for a stock report which took ten mins
Wednesday we have to stay in all day for the annual gas check He didnt turn up so will have to do this again
great news we have to stay in for a third day next Monday"

Show me the employer who would put up with this, We had FIVE visits recently ourselves All on weekdays.

Quite frankly i think a law should be brought in that if an HA causes a tenant to lose their job the tenant should be able to live rent free until they find another job no matter how long it takes and then this shit would stop overnight.
You can see why HAs embraced the idea of SH only being for the very desperate or for people with problems drug addicts alcoholics ex offenders It suits their timetable better!

Agree op. Its shit and really not fair.

I am not shutting it down... but the attitudes on here towards people who have to claim whatever from the state is sickening.
It is benefit bashing, but this time they have come for pensioners.

I do agree with a lot of your points...but Terry Pratchett had a phrase "too poor to paint, to proud to not" or something similar. It used to be the poor in this country still had pride and would go and work, conceal the extent of their poverty by "visiting uncle" that is going to the pawn broker. My nan used to tell her kids "you may be poor but you'll be clean. Soap costs pennies and waters free"
It's easier to sit on your backside than to get up and graft. Yes you might get knocked back for a job, but hay, that's life. You keep going. Many companies are actually looking for older worker's. They realise that they have a better attitude to work.
our young have been lied to for decades "go to uni". When I was a manager in an insurance company I was told by a new recruit 3 months into the job she should be on much more "by now"...her degree was in dance.
we need to push reset. We are just out of a period where there were more jobs nationally than applicants. We need to encourage the long term unemployed and those people on "the sick" back into work if they are relying on the government to fund them...or to make some other contribution to society

Yes I remember that

I don't have a problem with people who were on low wages getting pension credit as they have been paying N.I. but i have issues with those who have never paid any N.I to begin with and are hiding their money and being dishonest

How does she get away with not working

There’s usually a diagnosis involved, either them or their children. And NO the majority with diagnoses are not gaming the system 🙄 but some are a matter of persistence and knowing what to put on forms - there are Facebook groups for this very purpose, people egging each other on to get a successful claim. I don’t believe (boyfriends auntie) somebody so disabled by pain is too ill to work but not too ill to go through 5 pregnancies and care for 5 newborns/toddlers/children. The uptick really started when non-pathological diagnoses became a LOT more common - the things there is no hard test for, just a complaint of symptoms.

‘Sickening’? Have you ever read a single comment on here advocating for workhouses, or wanting to abolish benefits completely, or saying the disabled deserve to starve etc? Ever? Or are you just in a position now where anyone who disagrees with you is ‘sickening’?