Boys are innovators. Girls are compliant. Views?

[WhoTheFriggIsAlice]

I have 2 sons (primary school aged) who are being particularly crazy this summer holidays.

One of my son's was trying to dismantle something in the kitchen.

H said something along the lines of "that's the thing about boys, annoying yes but that's why men are inventors - pushing boundaries"

I said "surely it's just society that means women have had fewer opportunities to be inventors and innovators"

H laughed and said "absolutely not - you see it from such a young age. girls are smarter in a way but naturally compliant, boys don't do as well academically - but they are innovators, disrupters"

I think this is one of many insanely sexist things my husband has come out with in the last few years.

But I wonder what others think? Are his views mainstream./

Oh God, sounds like he's swallowed some "evolutionary psychology" Kool Aid.

It's what underpins the thinking (or lack of it) in the "manosphere" with Jordan Bloody Peterson at one end and Andrew Twatty Tate at the other. And it's re-hashing exist stereotypes from both ends but now you can't argue with it because (allegedly) "Science".

But it's utterly flawed for a number of reasons, not least that society has always been largely patriarchal so you can't really test if it's natural or not because society and culture are our own structures.....Gaaaaah.

I'm glad I'm old.

He sounds like a dick

You haven't met two of my nephews.

(Nearly swore before saying "nephews".)

I think more girls are compliant than boys not because of biology but because of the way they are treated from the day they are born. It takes time to break generational cycles. Boys get cheered on for bouncing off the walls. Girls are told to be careful.

Edited to include. Obviously biological differences do have an impact but where compliance is concerned it's society expectations. Girls are madams if they "rebel" boys are "boisterous". Boisterous is the more acceptable in most circles

”They are more intelligent than women”.

Again, intelligence is 50% heritable characteristic.

Where does he think men’s extreme intelligence is coming from?

The simple fact is that to date, nearly every single man has had a woman doing all the chores of housekeeping and raising a family for him. He’s been able to be obsessive because that’s what society said was ok and has idolised and handsomely rewarded these behaviours.

It sounds more to do with his own ego than the reality of the world.

Poor chap. Bigging up his sex to bolster his self esteem in the face of a more successful wife.

It’s tough to watch the patriarchy unravel, I’m sure, especially if you’re a casualty.

I did actually make the point to H about girls "rebelling"

H's niece is a teenager and taking part in some 'risky' behaviour - boys/booze/late nights/talking back at school etc. I said the family's intepretation of that behaviour is certainly NOT that she is pushing boundaries in some sort of brilliant, rebellious way but that actually a sign of things not being good - low self-esteem/easily led/lack of self-respect etc

But when our boys are destroying the kitchen - H says that could be a sign of brilliance

It was at this point that H said 'I can see you've taken offence at a fairly lighthearted comment'.

I am not at all compliant really, nor am I really an innovator. I was more a destroyer.

i loved taking things apart, but it was so I could mangle them even more.

rules I thought were good, then yes majority of the time I would comply. Rules I thought were stupid or a waste of time etc I would make it a point to break them.

i was never into the more criminal bounds of things. But I very much liked creating havoc, fun etc for the benefit of me.

Nailed it......

It was at this point that H said 'I can see you've taken offence at a fairly lighthearted comment'

Next time tell him repeating stereotypes isn't fairly light hearted and as you want your sons' not only to be as successful and happy as they can be job wise but also within themselves and in their future relationship with their significant other.

Even in this 'enlightened' age of ours women have to be truly exceptional in STEM fields to be noticed and taken seriously, whereas men can be just high performing and lauded the world over. This is why most things were "invented" by men - because women with the same ideas would have been called a witch and killed for being clever or just dismissed as ridiculous.

Whether you're an innovator is probably equal parts nature and nurture...much like most fields of excellence. Give someone the tools and support they need to excel and in most cases they'll take it. Throughout history this has been denied to women in pretty much all disciplines including sport, the arts, literature and definitely STEM.

Frankly, your husband is perpetuating the problem with his attitude.

It was at this point that H said 'I can see you've taken offence at a fairly lighthearted comment'.

Tell him you're not offended. You just think he's an idiot.

What with this and the eye rolling, I don't know how you can bear him tbh.

Very interesting that his career has flatlined. He must be a total charmer at work too (sarcasm)

Horrible thought isn’t it? I’m lucky my children go to school where stem is heavily pushed onto girls.

*It is very clearly noticeable in the home. When my DCs were small we visited friends with DCs the same age (3 out of 4 in nappies). We wanted to go out for brunch. Got up, men showered, shaved, got dressed and waited by the door swinging car keyes, tapping feet and joking among themselves about how long it took women to get ready. The women: got up, ensured children were changed bottled-up/breastfed washed and dressed. Shoes on, baby bags had the right stuff in them, showered, dressed, rechanged the baby, etc etc.

2nd day when we were going for brunch: we got up showered dressed and left the house with a light "see you there". They never showed up. Because they couldn't get themselves and all the kids out of the house. Not even couldn't get them out in time for brunch, just couldn't handle it and just made huge piles of toast for everyone.*

Snort. Love this.

I'm a female.
I wasn't 'taught to be compliant'.
I grew up in a fairly normal household.

When my opposite sex kids were small, neither had much hair and I dressed them generally gender-neutrally. How differently they were treated depending on if people assumed they were a boy or girl was simply astonishing. A few years of that and of course one would be compliant and the other innovative.

Bell curve? Bell end.

Lord no. Wouldn't do for me.

Your DP is very poorly informed. Have a look at how the first women doctors, for one, were not allowed to join medical colleges, harassed, threatened and jeered at. They were brilliant. Men stopped them from advancing.

@Blackthorne "Poor chap. Bigging up his sex to bolster his self esteem in the face of a more successful wife"

😬

It's a quite a tricky pill to swallow for him seemingly. He combines celebrating the brilliance & originality of men, while also being v needy with random comments like 'do you need me for anything anymore' (saying the quiet thing out loud).

I'm reading this after being told (again) by my daughter's nursery that she is not listening to what they say and refusing to follow instructions.

I was a bit down about this but after reading your post have now cheered up with the thought that she is a natural inventor and innovator whose natural brilliance is too bright to be contained...

Women innovate. Men steal the glory.

I had a primary school class years ago. They had to design a water mill using a plastic bottle and various wheels etc. It matters not. The boys got cracking designing, innovating to make the water wheel work. The girls, they were busy designing flowers, birds and butterflies for the pattern on the plastic bottle!

Many girls are TRAINED to be compliant from an early age, and boys - well everyone just says 'boys will be boys' and let them get on with whatever disruptive behaviour they like.

I was watching 'Mums on Strike' on the telly last night, and one of the dads had a bright idea to ask one of the kids to help him lay the table. Which one of his three children did he ask? The girl obviously. 😡

Yeah I have a 7 year old DD and she is anything but compliant.

She'll go out of her way to be non compliant, especially if I ask her to be compliant.

Which should be encouraged, within reason.

I had a primary school class years ago

^

Let's hope 'years ago' is the key takeaway from this point

It was at this point that H said 'I can see you've taken offence at a fairly lighthearted comment'.

^

Gaslighting