Free breakfast clubs for ALL primary school children? Why?

[Safi7]

I’ve been overseas since the election so a bit out of the loop, but is it true that Labour are going to make it standard that all primary schools must now offer free breakfasts to all children, regardless of need?

Fair enough for children from deprived families - but all children?

Where is the money for this coming from?

Are Labour actually saying that in 2024, its now to much to expect parents to actually bother to feed their own children breakfast? This responsibility can just be pushed onto schools instead - as if they haven’t got enough on? Teachers are leaving in droves as it is. Du much is out in them - the jobs is becoming more like social work in too many cases. Who will staff these breakfast clubs and make sure kids are actually eating?

Surely this is just encouraging lazy parenting - ie parents who can well afford cereal / toast / eggs etc it but just won’t bother if their kids can eat at school instead. Plus children will be dumped at school earlier than necessary, just because parents can now get away with it?

Surely it’s better to direct resources where they are actually needed, rather than turn schools into free cafes? Makes no sense.

No I don’t I just see a system where parents with children under school age are being pushed to work there’s no choice or support if they want or need (that’s a big issue with SEN dc ) to be a sahp. It should be a valid and equal and supported choice if that’s what a parents wants to do or needs to do

The tax I pay is what they take away from me.
I have the right to an opinion, that's what gives me the right. I can agree to disagree with some sort of grown up decorum, you, maybe not so much.

First up, collecting £1 a day (and chasing it up, and doing the banking etc) is lots more admin work than £1 will cover, so you’re already costing the school
money.

Secondly, FSM provision is very tight; a good percentage of those who would have qualified in the past no longer qualify. This means many families unable to afford basics while still not qualifying for FSM - thanks to insane cuts over the last 14 years leaving local authorities destitute. So plenty of people who could benefit wouldn’t be eligible in your proposal.

Thirdly, it stigmatises the children in poverty to be known as the only ones getting “breakfast for free.”

I don’t disagree with you but I’ve asked you to tell me how the government should do this given the extortionate cost of living in this country which requires the vast majority of families to require 2 incomes to operate. And you cannot give me an answer.

They won’t listen to you.

Many posters who actually live on council estates will post about their feckless neighbours and how it’s widely known many game the system. The middle class posters tell them they don’t know what they’re talking about, how they have ‘internalised classism’ blah blah

Another reason we need more affordable / social housing so that people aren’t under this type of pressure

I listed some ideas earlier ?

UK children are comparatively shorter than European peers because of factors including poor diet and you're worried about their parents getting away with a free slice of cheap toast in the morning?

OK. But if you want to be stone cold about it, just put that slice of toast down to the productivity gains you get from not having children who are distracted and in pain from hunger.

Any teacher I know in any English school would be able to find you some kids in that category straight away.

www.theguardian.com/business/2023/jun/21/children-raised-under-uk-austerity-shorter-than-european-peers-study

I ended up in a library working before covid - there was a lad of school age that used to visit every single day to read - he couldn't get a library ticket as his parent/s wouldn't do this for hm. So he would visit and sit in the corner and read for 2 hours after school.

When covid started I gave him around 6/7 books id found ready for the skip - so at least he had some reading material as he wouldn't be able not visit the library and stay - it was order only with a ticket.

We knew that his home life wasn't great

don't assume its parents that take their children to libraries, some take themselves and are important parts of society

PP have covered this, but perhaps you didn't read these replies.

There are absolutely families who can't afford a £1 bag of porridge, though they're in a minority.

Unfortunately less of a minority: families who have no idea why porridge is a better breakfast that x other thing;

Families who are chaotic, financially or otherwise - so the parents and therefore kids aren't up in time for school, or they are but there's no money on the meter to use gas/electric;

Families in temporary accommodation or hostels/hotels, who are supposed to be provided with food but aren't, and who are barred from cooking in their own rooms;

Families where the kids are poorly parented so being told to sit down and eat isn't listened to.

And so on.

You were being sarcastic about uniforms and holiday meals but, yes - if you have one/two sets of uniform but can't wash it, it's not going to get you very far.

(I run a food bank, so I am unfortunately well-placed to see how families are getting on, or not, at the moment. Incidentally, when people have the choice they absolutely do take fresh fruit, veg, porridge etc. The barrier is rarely plain ignorance imo.)

And they were all garbage because universal credit wouldn’t touch the sides of my salary, I don’t care for anybody so don’t get carers allowance and homeschooling doesn’t pay the bills.

Indeed, probably because there is not an easy answer given our economy is inextricably linked to a globalised, capitalist system which has been impacted by conflicts, the covid pandemic and inflation. So, a straightforward way to offer a bit of support to families is a breakfast club.

As others have said, I am not sure you really understand what attachment theory is about. You may have valid points about childcare hours, but getting them confused with the theoretical psychology of development isn’t helpful.

How many kids do you have btw? You make it sound like you have hundreds ;-)

Just hope it won't be sugary cereals or crap like that. A bowl of porridge and fruit or salad bits would be good.

I had a look at some breakfast club menus last week and unfortunately, it is all crap. Fat free flavoured yoghurts full of junk - why not plain Greek yogurt with some fruit and a bit of honey if they want the sweetness? Ditto - no porridge but sugary cereals. It's a shame but the fact is that junk food is cheap.

Then maybe UC needs to be raised significantly and prices lowered or capped on certain things. Rents regulated etc

Im not an economist I’m just saying that I don’t think the current system of ‘work or be sanctioned’ no matter how difficult your circumstances are is fair. I think at the very least they need to remove work commitments under UC till children are at least primary age. Might be helpful to give the 85% childcare costs to all parents too not just those on UC and really regulate the childcare industry to be in line with certain regulations as some are great and some are horrific .

Slightly different but Wales (who have been run by Welsh labour government for a good while) provide feee school lunches to ALL primary school children. It will be fully rolled out by September 2024. While I agree that those in need should have free school dinners, the cost will be huge to now provide it to every child. I would like to understand where the money has been reallocated from.

I do have a large family

Also, in that case - what would actually help you? Because you say my ideas are ‘garbage’ when I’m trying my best so maybe if you give me some insight from your perspective as I’m interested to learn more as I’m trying but I don’t have your experience only you have that. What would help you ?

I agree with a lot of this

Possible few reasons:
To push both parents back into the work force. Very few employers support 9.30-2.30 days so one parent needs to be available for drop off/collecting. The breakfast clubs reduce this need.
This doesn't better the child's bond with the mum and dad though. It's longer separation regardless of how you look it at financially.
It puts a seed of doubt into parents ability to feed their children.
A suggestion that if children were in school from a few weeks old, people would believe that without school and teaching staff with all their training, that children could not learn to walk.
We're currently at the believe that children can't learn without school, this could be the next step: you cannot feed your children as well as the school authority.
It feeds into the nanny state that mums and dad's could not do this parenting alone and without assistance of 'experts'.

yeap - would rather punish a child than allow their taxes to be used on a free breakfast.

It's surely not difficult to work out though that the better you treat all children the better a countries fortune will be, as they grow up to be useful young people with something to give back to society. By treating all children to something they might need it saves those to embarrassed going without

The funny thing about this post is that meals outside term time, funded uniforms, laundry services, and laptops are all things that local primaries have done for years and in most cases, are government funded because of the recognition that that is how you address complex and multiple deprivation. Where it isn't funded, schools and teachers do it anyway.

I wish people who don't know anything about education except through the prism of their own kids wouldn't go on about it as though schools aren't just communities, staffed by people who know about needs and what helps in their communities because they both probably come from the area themselves and help every day.

I strongly doubt you would go into a GP surgery and demand to know why your taxes are paying for social prescribing, but sure. Treat teachers like they're stupid.

A free breakfast club might make my DC actually eat properly in the morning, so I can see why it's a good idea.

They never eat breakfast at home. Ever. They are like me, it's too early to eat before you're up and about out the house type thing. They MIGHT grab a pre packed brioche etc. to eat on the way if I force it on them but then find it squished in their bag a month later

If breakfast club was free I'd use it and then they'd eat a better breakfast as they'd be "up and about" and I imagine being with other kids having brekkie it would also make them eat.

But as it stands I'm not prepared to pay £5 a day for it.

Coconutlattes

rents are to be capped under labour gov. and U.C. don't sanction for work under primary school age

If you are a lone parent, or the nominated responsible carer in a couple, with a child under the age of 5 you won't be asked to work in return for your Universal Credit. When your child reaches the age of 1 you will be asked to attend interviews to discuss plans for a future move into work.

I was a middle class kid from a "nice" well off family, who routinely went a number of days between a proper meals. Nobody ever noticed. I'm all for kids universal breakfast and lunches at school just so no kids fall through the cracks, among other reasons. It's a shame so many parents can't or don't provide properly for their kids, but leaving kids hungry isn't going to improve anything.