Olympic gymnastics humiliates and infantilises grown adult women

[Thebellofstclements]

The ridiculous leotards, the twee hairstyles. Having to do the ridiculous flicky "dance" moves (artistic expression, ha!) and grinning inanely (insanely) in between moves and when presenting...
Arguably the best athletes in the world but these grown adult women have to present themselves in a ridiculous, almost grotesquely infantile manner, looking fairy cheap and tacky.
The men do not.
My family argues that the gymnasts choose to do this.
We know that historically female gymnasts have been abused with no voice, so I'm not convinced this is all what they would necessarily choose given the option. AIBU?

...nobody has yet produced a shred of evidence on this thread that any of the Olympic gymnasts being described as tacky are uncomfortable with their chosen leotards

Well, if they didn't feel they could express their discomfort with sexual abuse... 🤔

Perhaps, in a decade or so, if many more female gymnasts are opting for German-style unitards without any detriment to their performance, we might recognise previous pressures. If gymnasts are still choosing to wear the leotards, then that's ok too. It's the choice (genuine, no-pressure, choice) that's important.

And until somebody deigns to point out which leotards they consider inappropriate (and which makeup, and which hair) we won't be in a position to say whether we are dealing with a gymnast who has designed or openly chosen her own leotard / unitard.

The unitards aren't new. They were at the last Olympics. The younger generation of German gymnasts is not embracing them. The Indonesian gymnast facing death threats is not embracing them. The Brazilian team designing their own leotards is not embracing them.

Let's not wait ten years to attribute some agency to these women. I agree with you that choice is what matters. But there are posters on this thread coming from the position that nobody would choose leotards they don't approve of. That's sexualising the choice which these women are making now.

Because being able to own our own bodies to the extent that what someone else feels about what we wear, whether skimpy or covered up, isn't our responsibility is the ultimate goal, surely? Wearing something teeny tiny because someone's told us we must for the sake of male gaze is absolutely wrong. Not wearing something teeny tiny if we wanted to, if we found it the most comfortable for us to do our sport in just because someone else has to make it all about their fetish isn't right either.
When will we get to the stage where what other people think is 'necessary' for a sport isn't as important as what the person doing the sport wants to wear?

This was not about gymnastics

No, but it's an example of the type of cultural pressures/expectations which can be placed unfairly on female athletes, to which gymnasts are not immune (judging by the experiences related on this thread by some PP's). I'm not denigrating the athletes, I'm saying that they shouldn't ever be subjected to these pressures, either directly or indirectly.

Sure, but what we have here is evidence that the US women are unlikely to be subjected to undue pressure without speaking out and prevailing. That's been one of my contentions on this thread all along.

To the extent that any poster has bitten the bullet and said what exactly they object to, it's been the cut of the US team's leotards.

Because being able to own our own bodies to the extent that what someone else feels about what we wear, whether skimpy or covered up, isn't our responsibility is the ultimate goal, surely? Wearing something teeny tiny because someone's told us we must for the sake of male gaze is absolutely wrong. Not wearing something teeny tiny if we wanted to, if we found it the most comfortable for us to do our sport in just because someone else has to make it all about their fetish isn't right either.
When will we get to the stage where what other people think is 'necessary' for a sport isn't as important as what the person doing the sport wants to wear?@ObelixtheGaul

You're making very good points in your posts and it's hard to disagree.

However, men who, no doubt own their bodies and can wear what they choose and expose as much as they want, are not wearing the skimpy pants.
And that is where women need to be. Not needing to prove anything to anybody by exposing their bums while competing in sports.

And yes, the female body shouldn't be sexualised. I think how do we get to that point is where our opinions differ.

These are athletes at the top of their game. I am more bothered by the PE kits girls have to wear at school. Often skorts that do not cover bum cheeks.

Men in the diving are.

@cardibach Men diving have full covered bums. Women in diving - half (or less) covered bums.

I don't object, as such. The question I asked myself was "why do the women's costumes need to be so revealing compared to the men's?" I was also watching the men's and women's diving when this thread began, which informed my viewpoint, so I wasn't only referring to gymnastics.

I don't think the costumes need to be so revealing, and I think the fact that they are probably has something to do with costumes “born of patriarchal forces that are no longer welcome or needed to get eyes on women’s sports”. That quote was from coach and retired track star Lauren Fleshman, admittedly in reference to the Nike design, but still relevant, I think.

I haven’t seen these uncovered bums. In fact, while watching I actually thought there seemed to be better coverage than in previous years. Bodies are more than bums. All but about 4 square inches of a male diver’s body is exposed. That bum checks aren’t part of that is probably more to do with having enough structure to coral the necessary bits of male anatomy - which, as has been explained already, is why male gymnasts routinely wear something over their leotard.
You’ve also been told that team USA had input into the design and a gymnast from team Brazil designed their kit. It’s infantilising to suggest they haven’t chosen this cut.

Men and women have different anatomy and participate in different sports in some cases too. Both expose flesh and wear skin tight garments to an extent that would have scandalised previous generations. You don't see the outline of women's genitals in any sport I'm aware of. Not so with men. Like to like comparisons don't work.

Exactly. It’s like everyone has forgotten the (horribly racist and objectifying) focus on ‘Linford’s Lunchbox’ some years age.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/olympics/article-13686067/amp/French-diver-sends-Olympics-fans-WILD-picture-tight-swimming-trunks-goes-viral.html?ico=amp_related_replace

So the male French diver has sent the Internet "wild" and there's a picture taken to show why... which is to do with how his trunk .. enhance... his genitalia but, no, male uniform for these events isn't sexualised...

(Fwiw, I think the reason they wear so little is to do with how the water and air move over them)

That was just awful.

Yes there is sexism everywhere. YOU are contributing to it by suggesting that women gymnastics should be more like men’s. Women’s gymnastics is NOT inferior to men’s. This rando on Twitter gets it.

Sure there’s sexualised behaviour towards men. Occasionally.

Whataboutery, anyone?

I’m done with the desperate attempts by some posters to paint my position as in some way extreme or misogynistic. It’s pathetic. You can be a fan of gymnastics without denying the problems and evident sexism

USSR wanted that back in the day but everyone else was afraid that they'd win gymnastics Cold War with their Bolshoi ballet pirouetting so it never happened.

It is interesting how people here talk as if there is one universal standard for masculinity. I would say male gymnastics has been limited in its development a bit by 1980s frat boy culture and homophobia. It was huge in the US in that decade.

You're done, eh? Convenient that this happened only once you were asked to provide instances of anyone denying sexism exists in gymnastics, as opposed to disagreeing with you about what constitutes it. From positions of clearly greater knowledge, I might add.

Your approach is sexist. It has become no less so with repetition.

If they didn't want to compete they wouldn't
Just like if you don't want to watch you don't have to

A lot of them aren’t grown adult women though? I reckon probably half are, half are teens under 18

You're well out of date there!

The minimum age to compete is 16 the year of the competition, and there are about half a dozen of that age in the Olympics, out of 90 odd. Not sure how many 17 year olds but probably similar. It's more of a 20s sport these days.

As an example, the British team have two teenagers, two in their 20s and one in her 30s. Brazil are all in their 20s and 30s. Simone, the global star of the sport, is 27.

I’m sure I have seen a 14 year competing the last couple of days? I may be wrong though, if so I stand corrected! 🙂

Not in gymnastics you haven’t. There’s a few skateboarders, but their rules are different.

You're wrong if it was in gymnastics. Sixteen is the minimum age. Skateboarding has different rules as one example.

More than 60% of the women competing in gymnastics are 20 and over. This has been a trend for over a decade. 14 year olds were last allowed to compete in the 1990s.