Olympic gymnastics humiliates and infantilises grown adult women

[Thebellofstclements]

The ridiculous leotards, the twee hairstyles. Having to do the ridiculous flicky "dance" moves (artistic expression, ha!) and grinning inanely (insanely) in between moves and when presenting...
Arguably the best athletes in the world but these grown adult women have to present themselves in a ridiculous, almost grotesquely infantile manner, looking fairy cheap and tacky.
The men do not.
My family argues that the gymnasts choose to do this.
We know that historically female gymnasts have been abused with no voice, so I'm not convinced this is all what they would necessarily choose given the option. AIBU?

Not everyone wants to wear the unitard though. They are athletes who may be quite comfortable with athletic garb. The choice is great but there shouldn't be pressure to cover up either. None of those women are wearing anything inappropriate.

@crumpet
You are right the Norwegians were finded for wearing shorts - skin tight shorts not baggies like the mens - in 2021

But there was also some team who were disqualified for their bottoms being too big but I can't find anything on it. The max depth at the side seam was 7cm, theirs were maybe 9cm ?
I remember st the time thinking. I hope the ladies weren't wearing them when they were measured!

You’re saying the women aren’t showing skills?

Make up and hairstyles barely registered with me yesterday, because I was too busy noting down all the mind blowing skills those women were throwing.

How can you watch a gymnastics competition and not focus on the actual performances, but choose to categorise it as silly costumes and wiggling? Honestly, how?

Again, I am not defending sexism in sports. But let’s not contribute to that ourselves by taking away from these young people’s achievements.

I'll also point out that until very recently athletes were having to hide food on camps/ major champs so they weren't reported by their chaperones to the managers/ coaches for eating too much so even though the culture is changing in gymnastics it's not in a place where the athlete voice is central. (The food thing happened to Jennifer Pinches in 2012- she was reported for eating fruit as a pudding, and it happened to Ellie Downie with the weighing and diet plans after that).

Gymnastics was utterly broken and although things are improving it has a long way to go.

Yep.

It was an interesting point about age. Oksana Chusovitina, a 49 year old competing gymnast who's missing her first Olympics since 1988 after being injured earlier this year, said words to the effect of I'm not interested in the unitards and don't like them. I suppose when you've been competing for decades you can get very fixed ideas about what you want to wear! She's also never been one for the makeup either.

Not "inferior", or "silly", but reinforcing stereotypical notions of "femininity". And, as another poster mentioned, "pandering to the male gaze".

Posted upthread, but worth posting again

Women receive marks for artistry on floor and beam. The judges are looking for an overall performance, which includes expression, confidence and personal style, with a varied tempo throughout the routine. There’s no such element in the mens’ routines, so they actually have to work harder to stand out.

It’s not ‘wriggling about’ as you so insultingly put it. It’s called Flow. And men have to to ‘flow’ too because the gymnast can be marked down for hesitation.

When my dd was a young gymnast they had matching shorts but were not allowed to wear them to compete. They all took them off at the last possible moment then rushed to put them back on when they finished their routines.

I hear ya OP, and I tend to agree.

If it was clear that women could choose to either compete with the aesthetic choices you've described or compete in a way similar to the men, then I would believe it's a choice. But it seems required in order to have a shot at the big time.

Yes. Interesting that Oksana Chusovitina is mentioned. An athlete so incredible that she’s still competing at 49. I mentioned Kate Bush, who made it despite pushing back against being sexualised in a way she didn’t want. There are women who do make it, despite not conforming to expectations, but they are the exception, not the rule, and the reason they do make it is because they are so exceptional they cannot be ignored.

But this thread is interesting. Once you begin to see sexism, you see it everywhere, but it’s so normalised that it’s virtually invisible.

They can wear unitards now, which cover their whole legs. The German team wore them at the last Olympics (or worlds, not sure which). Simone Biles said she didn't want to wear them as she found them unflattering.

sorry! That's what I mean but explained badly. Some people on the thread seem disappointed only the Germans wear the unitard and presume that must be as a result of pressure from their federation's. I was saying I think most athletes uncomfortable in the leotard will have already left the sport which is why we don't see much take-up right now. The Germans being so visible in it might mean an 11yo who feels exposed in a leotard now knows they have more options and will stay training, so in 6-10 years we might see more athletes wearing these. But I agree the choice is the athletes and a leotard is a great functional choice also. The change I would like to see from the FIG is the rule on the team all wearing matching can include variations of the same design with varying leg lengths and arm lengths, so even in the team competition everyone gets to wear their cut preference.

If they aren’t inferior or silly, what’s wrong with stereotypical notions of femininity, as long as the women who choose that are happy with it?

I'm deaf actually, so no, but I admire her stamina!
But this is a discussion about elite sports women, not popstars.
It also isn't a discussion about ballet or ballroom dancing, both of which are wonderful, but not sports.

Is anybody going to weigh in with those views about female athletics? Women in athletics wear little more than a bikini to run and jump in and usually have full make up on and jewellery. I imagine leotards and skimpier running kit is for ease of movement but so what if athletes of any discipline enjoy wearing sparkly outfits and wearing make up/jewellery /styling their hair? Shock horror : Lots of women enjoy looking traditionally feminine and choose that. Leave these incredible athletes alone.

If they aren’t inferior or silly, what’s wrong with stereotypical notions of femininity, as long as the women who choose that are happy with it?

The ones who are not happy with it should have left. Why not start making it universal? All athletes do all apparatus (or the option) so women do rings and pommel horse and men can do beam (and both do the same bars whether uneven or not).

My daughter is more of a powerhouse and her favourite gymnastics apparatus was always rings but as a girl can't compete in it- so she quit as male gymnasts suited her more than the female.

I think the sardonic nature of that comment has been lost on you !!

Apologies, yes

There's an interesting documentary about John Curry the ice skater on iPlayer. He was the first skater to incorporate dance moves into skating, and there were plenty of harrumphs of it taking away from the physicality (basically coded message for him not being a proper man..)

To discount ballet or ballroom dancing from the discussion is to deny that there is an artistic element to the floor routine.

This is not my culture, but you see US gymnasts getting massively excited about their leotards, asking for more sparkles, saying what colours they find empowering, setting up their fashion lines and hair accessory companies, signing deals with Nike etc.

All over the world, women concern themselves more with fashion and make up than men. That gap is narrowing I think - men in sparkles and spending more on skin care and hair now. The male gaze is a thing. But millions of women invest in and are excited by fashion and makeup

What I like about gymnastics is that you have the range. Women who love bling. Women who stick their hair in a ponytail and go. Women in unitards. Women in leotards. There are no points for costume. The world's two leading gymnasts, Simone Biles and Rebeca Andrade are very interested in what they wear. Good on them. But plenty of champion gymnasts just look tidy and professional with a ponytail. Obviously we see the superstars most.

These are all women dressed appropriately for their sport.

I don’t think you can really separate out those things. The male gaze is what drives so many of women’s choices, particularly when young. It’s virtually a blanket laid over every realm where women compete with one another and it’s so ubiquitous and conformity to norms and expectations are so much a part of human nature that it’s invisible until you see it… and then you see it everywhere.

Why not start making it universal? All athletes do all apparatus (or the option) so women do rings and pommel horse and men can do beam (and both do the same bars whether uneven or not).

It's interesting, because rings and pommel horse require significant upper body strength, which men will have in far more abundance than women.

Not that there's anything wrong with women doing pommels, but gymnastics is unusual in playing to the strengths of different sexes rather than the women's sport being held back by the fact that men are inherently stronger and more powerful.

Here's an interesting fact ... Women weren't permitted to compete in gymnastic events until the 1920s. Perhaps this is how those costumes and overall look originated. Personally if I had the figure I'd like to wear a nice outfit like that and some make up. I'm assuming all the people with outrage on here, have hairy legs and never wear make up

Sure, I agree.

They can wear different elements of the same design, though. Germans have done that at worlds and euros. They just don't have a team here.