If I was ever autistic…. I outgrew it

[Finlandia86]

So to start off, let me say that I am far from ignorant about Autism, I have studied it at length and I know it is a condition present from birth / very early childhood and is not something you can outgrow.

Having learned a lot about Autism, including its presentation in girls, I look back on my childhood and see that I had a whole load of traits, including:

• Difficulty distinguishing fantasy from reality, especially as a young child
• Long running obsessions as a tween and teen (characters in books and TV shows mainly, to the point where it would interfere with my life and I would secretly pretend I was them…see above)
• Fixations on certain people in real life (usually teachers).
• Social difficulties - being thought of as aloof and stand-offish when actually I was shy and didn’t know how to ‘be’.
• Avoided showering (couldn’t be bothered and didn’t see the point).
• Sensory seeking (chewing stuff all the time, humming all the time, tendency to jiggle/rock in my seat)
• Difficulty with eye contact (shyness and low self esteem)
• Difficulty organising myself and terrible procrastination, until hyperfocus kicked in (after days of tears)
• Black and white thinking about right and wrong / good and bad, and giving myself an extremely hard time because of this.
• Lots of examples of supremely cringy behaviour, because I didn’t understand how I would look to other people.

If I was a teen today, pretty sure I’d get a diagnosis.

But… at nearly 40 years of age … I have grown out of all of it.

Okay, not quite all. I am still a terrible pen chewer and procrastinator (although my hyperfocus superpower seems to have left me). But the rigid fixations and the social awkwardness… gone. Gradually, it has to be said. It took until I was about 26 to truly grow into myself and find my social confidence, and it was around then that I stopped fixating on both real and fictional people, which I think had a lot to do with finally developing some self-esteem. You’ll be pleased to know that I now shower daily.

I’m not sure where I’m going with this, as I imagine a lot of people will think I am trying to invalidate their diagnoses or those of their children… I’m not. But I guess I am wondering whether we can be a bit quick to diagnose ‘low support needs’ / Aspergers type autism, when actually it’s just a case of ‘quirky child’ / ‘immature teen’.

Or, I guess a different takeaway could be one of hope: that as a probably autistic person I have learned to navigate and overcome many of life’s difficulties by middle adulthood.

I suppose my question is whether anyone else can identify with my experience, and if anyone has any interesting thoughts about it.

And Another ignorant post.

“I don't like it when you see a perfectly health nt child getting on with life and their parents say well their masking so they need a diagnosis all children play up for their mums this isn't masking this is the person they feel most comfortable with.”

The whole point of masking is you don’t see it until they crumble. My dd successfully masked until she turned 14 and tried to take her own life the first time.

“This is why I get annoyed because anytime a child does anything out of the realms of "normal" 100 people online especially on here say that sounds like autism they need to be assessed even though the school the drs and the family see no issues. They then get added to a waitlist which gets longer and longer which means children in genuine need don't get the help they need.”

This doesn’t happen. You need to be screened to go on the waiting list by CAMHS or your GP. If they see no issues you don’t go on the list.

But camhs are crap and a lot of gp choose the easy life you have 7 minutes with them you say I googled it and my child does this and that can you refer me any gp will say yes their not going to sit their and say no your dramatic go away

I was the pp you are referring to! Agree, @BusMumsHoliday gave a very illuminating answer. I will say in response to your comment that people absolutely do prepare for social interactions with friends - I go back through messages to see what life events of theirs I've missed and should therefore enquire about. When DH and I go to visit friends we always game plan beforehand about what to discuss.

What I (and I suspect most 'NT' people?) don't do is police myself in the way you are describing. I am very unselfconscious in my interactions with others - but I am often told I have got it wrong! DH will tell me (gently, not to rebuke me in any way) that I was too abrupt, or rude, or didn't make eye contact, or changed the subject when it was obviously of interest to the rest of the group, or dominated the conversation. This is partially why I find this thread so interesting - from reading this thread, at least, it seems that a key difference is that autistic people are hyper aware of their own behaviour in a way that other people are not. Even though the behaviours themselves may not be all that different.

Yes, but if lots of people posting here met my DS7 (and DS4), would say that they were 'not really autistic', "quirky" and 'it's just their personality'. My DS7 wants to be a medical researcher when he grows up, and I'm pretty confident - if he continues getting the right support - he'll get A-levels, go to uni (if he wants to), get a GF and live independently one day. All the usual milestones. Heck, he's already better at navigating public transport than I am!

DS7 had a classmate for a while whose mum I used to chat with because we both had autistic kiddos who got picked up at the door by a support worker after most of the class had gone in. His classmate was non-speaking autistic, incontinent and had a mental age of 2. He's at special school now. Both her kids were similar, and the older son was still not speaking, not even interacting really at eight years old, and spent his leisure time chewing and shredding plastic bags.

I felt sorry for her. She felt jealous of me. Point is that DS7's classmate is what people think of with 'autistic' and, even some other parents with autistic DCs, read DS7 as merely 'badly behaved' or 'having a tantrum' when he melts down because he's a clever child who can speak.

It's very easy to 'drive by' assess other people's DCs support needs from a superficial encounter because people don't exactly volunteer that their bright, articulate DC was excluded from school. And, if they do, they're just 'bad parents trying to make excuses' - it's not really a special need.

"I find this thread so interesting - from reading this thread, at least, it seems that a key difference is that autistic people are hyper aware of their own behaviour in a way that other people are not. Even though the behaviours themselves may not be all that different"

You get self aware Autistic people and Autistic people that have no self awareness, just the same as you do with NT people.

One of the questions on the initial screening is something like "are you aware that you talk too much and annoy people?"

So the answer for a lot of Autistic people may be "Yes" For me, I wrote that I was aware I did it, but unable to stop myself.

Their lives have been impacted hugely. They were referred by CAMhS to help inform treatment. They then decided they had ADHD too. You need a diagnosis for that for meds and it helps inform treatment too.Knowing there is a reason for struggles helps hugely too. Both are a life long condition. Both other dc have qualified for the extenuating circumstance with uni and will get support there. They may well dip in and out of services later which it will inform. I have had group nhs therapy for my adhd and belong to an nhs support group for my autism. Who is to say what I’ll need later..

CAMHs psychiatrists and highly qualified professionals are not crap.

CAMHs psychiatrists and highly qualified professionals are not crap.

Thing is they are not magic either. They have qualifications, have studies and have had practical experience. However we are in times whereby there is unprecedented access to information. It is possible to study and find out possible solutions to lots of challenges within the press of a few buttons. And regarding experience? No one has the lived experience of what goes on psychologically inside someone else's head apart from the person who is living it.

So when looking at support, I suggest people really look to see if it will realistically be the type of support they think is appropriate. And regarding the feeling of a need for an 'excuse' or 'reason' in order to exist as is currently - that is wrong. We all have strengths and weaknesses and should try to support each other without counting the cost.

I haven't been able to read the entire thread so this may cross over with something someone else has said. I used to teach children with a diagnosis of autism and then I spent some time researching autism. The children I worked with ranged from non-verbal to above average academic ability.

One thing that was very noticeable when working with children with any sort of diagnosis (I also worked/researched with children with down syndrome, dyslexia and other disabilities) was the amount of people who seemed to believe that NT children would change and grow, but non-NT children would basically stay the same throughout their entire life. So, if a four year old had poor language, the expectation was that they would continue to have poor language for their entire life. I found that extremely odd - why wouldn't children with disabilities learn and change, just like any other child? Attitudes affected the children a lot - many of them ended up in situations where expectations of them were very low and, of course, that affected their progress, just like it would with any child.

One thing I'll never forget is reading the file of a kid when he was diagnosed at 4. The psychologist had listed all his behaviours and then said that in their opinion the child would never attend mainstream school, never do this, never do that. God it was depressing. My job was to follow up with this child, who was now 19. Where was he? In a top university, studying engineering and doing extremely well. What was the point of the psych listing all the things he couldn't do? How could they ever know what was in store?

All that waffle to say that I don't think you ever 'grow out of' autism, but that people with autism grow and change, for the simple reason that they are humans like everyone else.

This is interesting:

I agree

I've only read the first two and most recent two pages, apologies. I was diagnosed as an adult (by a professional, I feel obliged to point out, not Autism4U online).

OP, as others have written - lots of children behave in ways that match autistic behaviours. But a neurotypical child will, as I understand it, "lose" those behaviours. So a child might not make eye contact easily say, but over time learns that that's something that you do to connect with people etc. A child on the spectrum might not. Or might, because they're very compliant and force themselves to, sometimes to their detriment (eg high anxiety linked to masking). I am happy there is more discussion about autism out there, even if that inevitably means more bollocks too. My own gauge really - and I'm in the middle of this with my six year old - is around a cluster of behaviours, which impact adversely on day to day life, and which are persistent. Just not making eye contact, meh. But not making eye contact + difficulty understanding others' intentions + social issues + self harm seemingly linked to anxiety... worth a call to a psych.

I suspect my parents were waiting for me to outgrow my odd behaviour. I didn't. I adapted and started self-harming to cope.

Yes. I had an acquaintance who was diagnosed autistic, dyspraxic and had face blindness. His parents had told he'd never do GCSEs, never live independently, and so on. When I met him, he was living away from home, standing for the local council while researching his PhD.

He presented as the most caring man I'd ever met because, to compensate for the face blindness, he'd regularly gently ask how I was feeling. At some point, he explained why he did that, but - until I knew - he just came across as unbelievably considerate. He wasn't open about his laundry list of diagnoses and, unless he'd told me, I wouldn't have known.

Do you think it's because your pre-frontal cortex was still developing?
I have adhd and won't outgrow it per se but it's traits are gradually getting a bit better after therapy.
Adhd and autism are characterised by pre frontal cortex deficiencies I believe but maybe yours just needed time to grow?

It is a fascinating thread.

My sister was diagnosed at almost 40, her eldest was diagnosed a couple of years ago. My brother was also diagnosed as a late teen, and in hindsight my Dad was absolutely autistic. Me and my Mum couldn't be any more NT if we tried and it led to a lot of conflict in our house in our younger years, because we expected my brother and sister to understand certain things and behave in a certain way, but of course they couldn't.

Even now, despite being very aware of different ways that ASD can present, my sister still takes me by surprise. I will have been convinced my whole life that she understands something the way I do, but she doesn't. One recently she put up a video guide to people with ASD and the creator was saying 'If someone comes into a room and asks what you are watching on TV, they don't want a description of what you are watching, they are asking to join you. If someone sees you playing a game and asks what you are playing, again they don't want a description, they are asking to play too.' This blew her mind and she didn't believe it, but it blew my mind as well that she didn't get that. She sees the world in such a literal way.

What the OP listed was normal teen behaviour, ASD is something way beyond. It is a unique and different way of processing the world, and whilst you can absolutely learn, adapt, mask in order to be 'normal' (whatever that is), you can't fundamentally alter the way your brain processes info. Also, the sensory overwhelm, the meltdowns and the exhaustion in masking are all things that OP never experienced.

Are you not worried the the label will ba a barrier for your child as they get older I say this as someone with a label that has made my life harder not easier. I don't tell people about my diagnosises and I wouldn't put it on a job application or anything but if they checked it would be there. But as much as I try to cover up the label the reality is if I step into any medical setting it's their and I will be treated differently due to it. Then their are certain times it can't be covered up such as travel insurance, dvla ect. Nothing good has come from it and the reality is as someone who is mostly high functioning in public I could of easily managed and learnt coping skills myself without the label.

I would expect the description is this wrong

Seriously. Stop saying label. I feel like you're doing it on purpose. You've had one comment at least deleted for it already.

So you have 'diagnoses' and us Autistic people have labels? Gotcha. Loud and clear.

Autism isn’t an accessory and it doesn’t come with labels

No I have a label to I didn't realise that word was offensive its funny how peoples brains think differently isn't it

If you have ND kids, and are likely ND yourself, you don't let your kids get to 40 not knowing that...

All NT communication has a social purpose - facts and information are merely the oil that carries the social perfume. Thus, unless it's an emergency, you should assume everything an NT person says is a social entreaty first and a means of providing factual information second. At worst, you should ignore the factual content of any conversation entirely.

It's not intuitive, though, which is why it's so exhausting. It's like being born not knowing how to ride a bike, when everyone else can ride one, and - if you're smart and agile enough - you can learn to ride a bike, but it's never going to feel natural. Also, some people in your position will never learn to ride a bike, however hard they try.

It's dramatically easier talking to ND people where, if they want to talk to you about scooters, the purpose of the conversation is to discuss scooters - you don't have to expend time and effort working out how a simple conversation about scooters is actually the speaker trying to signal their status within the prevailing social group. Just to be clear, if it's two NT people, they won't ask for a description of the TV show, with the unspoken social rule that you should ask them to join you. It just seems unnecessarily complex. Instead, they'll spend ten minutes apologising for taking up space/existing, and then cautiously ask "can I watch TV with you?"

That said, ND conversation can be overly intense at best, and confused and messy at worst. With no indirect conversation or small talk, you end up discussing your grandmother's recent piles operation in graphic detail within ten minutes of meeting. Alternatively, both of you try to interpret the secret social meaning of the other person's conversation, get hugely confused when there isn't one, and eventually one of you takes offence.

Yes! This is me too. Totally capable of functioning in my curated world with other ND people until I'm not.

Yesterday I had to take my pre-schooler to a picnic at the school as a kind of meet and greet with his classmates and their families.

I basically just followed my son around as I had no idea how to talk to the other parents 😂 Very much an 'oh yes, I'm definitely autistic' moment.

Just to say I absolutely agree with @RainbowZebraWarrior below that some autistic people will police themselves more than others! Some just won't have the capacity to "learn" social behaviour like this; others won't want to. But a lot of autistic adults do describe an almost constant feeling of being out of step, feeling like they just don't get stuff that come naturally to everyone else - and I know we all feel like that sometimes, but I think most NT people are not constantly feeling wrongfooted by everyday interactions.

(And, indeed, the debate as to the extent to which learning these kind of skills encourages masking, or is useful goes on amongst autistic people themselves. FWIW, my DH is glad he learnt this stuff; he's also glad he has friends that he doesn't always have to be "on" around, and is comfortable being a bit more his unselfconscious self.)

Also, very much agree with @BallaiLuimni that autistic development may not be typical, or at the same pace but it is still development. I also think that when autistic people are well supported at doing things they find harder, they unlock capacities to excel that they may not have otherwise been able to access because anxiety etc decreases.

Really interesting thread. My 17 year old dad was diagnosed aged 11 and to this day has refused to accept the diagnosis. She wants to look into getting it overturned even though to me she definitely presents as autistic.

Something I struggle with is this argument that if you are not ND you absolutely cannot have an opinion about it because you cannot possibly understand what a ND brain is like.

Ok. But then it surely goes the other way also - so ND people please stop making assumptions about what it’s like to have a NT brain, assumptions like people who are NT can’t possibly be finding things as difficult as someone who is ND, that the ND absolutely will be having it harder.

Maybe they are both finding life equally hard - but just differently?!

We need MORE conversation and exploration, not less - the shutting down is deeply unhelpful for everybody.