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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Underdressed teens prancing about on school stage

281 replies

tumdedum · 14/07/2024 12:22

I'm feel so old but when did this become a thing?
I've been to a couple of high school showcase evenings this year. Where the kids show off their singing, play musical instruments, do some acting or dancing.
The evenings are really good and it's brilliant for the kids to be able to show off their talents but sometimes the clothes the girls wear for the dancing acts seem a bit inappropriate to me.
The one I went to last week had two teenage girls in what looked like knickers and t-shirts dancing very well but rather erotically to a Beyonce song.
The girls were really good at dancing and would not have been out of place on a stage or a lap dancing club but AIBU to feel it's not very appropriate at a school event?
Do all high schools have these sort of dance classes? Is dancing around in skimpy clothes just a normal thing to do nowadays?
I'll put down the pearls I have been clutching and am fully prepared to be told to get with the times!

OP posts:
hendoop · 14/07/2024 21:13

My dd wears what she wants but it is gym wear or athleisure type outfits. The minute i would tell her what to wear it a) gives her something to rebel about b) repeats the victim blaming message that it's is up to women to deter sexual aggressors and not the fault of the man

ThePearlSloth · 14/07/2024 21:21

I wouldn’t expect to go to a school production and see teenage boys on stage in their underpants or gyrating etc so I don’t see why we should accept it for girls or suggest that it’s victim-blaming. If anything it plays to the notion that girls are sexual objects to be looked at/done to. There’s a difference between people wearing what they want and there being a social expectation that girls should objectify themselves when boys do not.

quantumbutterfly · 14/07/2024 21:22

Should we look forward to a boys re-enactment of the full monty?

steelingmyself · 14/07/2024 21:26

SoftandQuiet · 14/07/2024 12:35

There is a fashion for a type of shorts which do look like pants to me, material seams too thin for outerwear- but girls gyrating provocatively? t’was ever thus

I was joking to OH the other day I remember these shorts / big pants from the last time in the late noughties - I can't BELIEVE they've come back haha.

I also remember a performance of the Moulin Rouge by a group of fifteen year old girls on a school stage years ago.

biscuitandcake · 14/07/2024 21:26

hendoop · 14/07/2024 21:11

Ok re victim blaming:

There is an implied current that if you dress a certain way you invite sexual harrasment / sexual assault as the aggressor won't be able to control themselves. This is constant throughout a females life.

"Don't go upside down on the monkey bars as your knickers will show and the boys will laugh"

"Don't roll your skirt up for school or Bois may think you want sex and harass you or put their hands up your skirt"

"Dressing in a low cut top implies your single and what other reaction except for harassment were you expecting"

When in reality my clothing is not a message- you should only touch with consent and it's the eyes of the viewer sexualising the child not the clothes

I agree with that.
But I also think that schools/teachers/parents have a responsibility to set boundaries for children. Not because if they are harassed for wearing a short skirt its their fault. But because, actually, teenagers do pick up on ideas on how they should view themselves /what behaviour they should accept from how adults treat them.
We had a ridiculously over the top teacher in our secondary school who tried to teach us all how to get out of a car in our school skirts without showing our knickers "knees together and slide girls". (My friend pointed out this wouldn't be an issue if we were allowed to wear trousers). But having an adult basically signalling it is not OK for others to try to see your knickers (this was when celebrity up skirting was a weird trend, and almost seen as positive attention) and that it is a good idea not to show them was probably helpful actually. Because when you are a teenager there are lots and lots of people who will be happy to encourage you to sexualise yourself. Its weird if the adults with authority/responsibility are conveying the same message.
Also, actually, the how to get out of a car without flashing technique is genuinely useful and I have used it since.

I agree - its quite hard to convey those messages without implying that its because boys/men can't control themselves, or that how you are dressed affects how you are treated. But it is possible, and I think too far the other way can harm girls too.

biscuitandcake · 14/07/2024 21:30

steelingmyself · 14/07/2024 21:26

I was joking to OH the other day I remember these shorts / big pants from the last time in the late noughties - I can't BELIEVE they've come back haha.

I also remember a performance of the Moulin Rouge by a group of fifteen year old girls on a school stage years ago.

I loved Moulin Rouge. Do you also remember Playboy branding being really cool at one point? People had tote bags with the bunny symbol on it at school and I really wanted a pair of glasses with the symbol on but my mum said absolutely not (I was 12).

IdLikeToBeAFraser · 14/07/2024 22:02

LondonFox · 14/07/2024 20:47

And my point is that there is no special conspiracy to dress girls in sexual outfits made by hive mind of fashion brands.

It is idiotic parents that decide 3y old girls need mini skirts to play in a park and buy that shit. And after ten years they complain online how 13y olds are sexulized. Well yeah, you kinda decided to dress them like pedophiles dream since they were born.
If parents stop buying it no one would produce baby items made of fishnet and other nonsense.

I never said anything about a conspiracy. I said that we tell girls from a young age that default is tight. Little kids clothing isn't sexualised. But it IS tight and that becomes the default. And then wr are surprised when they wear tight clothes as teenagers.

steelingmyself · 14/07/2024 22:05

The OP asked when did this become a thing... ages ago.

jannier · 14/07/2024 22:09

Is it more revealing than a leotard or swim suit?

Eadfrith · 14/07/2024 22:11

I may have worn provocative clothes as a teen myself, but I look at them now think that they’re too young to understand what kind of unwanted attention they’re bringing on themselves.

Another major factor is our culture that objectifies women in ways that men just aren’t and never have been, even when they’re still girls and too naive to understand about sex. Surely we can do more for young girls and show them better role models. I know I’ll get prude comments…bring em on!

Poolstream · 14/07/2024 22:14

PuttingDownRoots · 14/07/2024 12:40

In my day (90s!) We had to athletics and cross country in PE knickers.binnpublic parks

They make the modern shorts look long!

Yes but they were thick enough to withstand nuclear warheads. 😂

quantumbutterfly · 14/07/2024 22:19

Eadfrith · 14/07/2024 22:11

I may have worn provocative clothes as a teen myself, but I look at them now think that they’re too young to understand what kind of unwanted attention they’re bringing on themselves.

Another major factor is our culture that objectifies women in ways that men just aren’t and never have been, even when they’re still girls and too naive to understand about sex. Surely we can do more for young girls and show them better role models. I know I’ll get prude comments…bring em on!

Edited

With the perspective of age I agree with you, especially in the era of 'only fans' .

Magnificentkitteh · 14/07/2024 22:19

I agree that you can't really tell girls they should cover up etc as what they wear is up to them. Ar the same time I do find it sad that overly sexualised clothing is what our kids choose to wear. It feels like feminism has gone wrong somehow.

Eadfrith · 14/07/2024 22:25

quantumbutterfly · 14/07/2024 22:19

With the perspective of age I agree with you, especially in the era of 'only fans' .

Probably a different thread subject, but it really does worry me how vulnerable young girls are to things like Onlyfans and how it probably seems like a quick way to earn cash, especially when they all have smartphones.

jannier · 14/07/2024 22:30

ClaudineMallory · 14/07/2024 13:02

Why is that? Because it's for the male gaze. It's less about freedom and body confidence than displaying in a certain way what men will find attractive.

Is the answer a tent then and anything less is for male attention?

Lentilweaver · 14/07/2024 22:31

I don't know how we have got to the stage where any women who raise concerns against the constant objectification of girls are called prudes, jealous, pearl clutchers and victim blamers. Personally, I think we have gone way too far in the opposite direction. No doubt I am jealous.
Meanwhile the men wander around in cool, comfy, loose clothing being respected for their achievements rather than their thong bikinis.

jannier · 14/07/2024 22:31

GingerIsBest · 14/07/2024 13:13

Here is a photo I took years ago. The shorts on the left are boys age 1. The ones on the right are girls aged 2-3.....

But some if not all of that is nappy room....it's common to get another year out of shorts when you've potty trained.

Lentilweaver · 14/07/2024 22:33

Also discussions like these always end in:: should women be in tents?

There are quite a range of options between tents and the overly sexualised look that teens are being encouraged to adopt because otherwise it's shaming.

GingerIsBest · 14/07/2024 22:37

Lentilweaver · 14/07/2024 22:33

Also discussions like these always end in:: should women be in tents?

There are quite a range of options between tents and the overly sexualised look that teens are being encouraged to adopt because otherwise it's shaming.

Really? So the 1 year old trousers you bought for your children all fit when they're 3 and are now out of nappies?

Talk about getting knotted like a pretzel in an attempt to deny that boys and girls are treated differently.

Lentilweaver · 14/07/2024 22:39

Eh @GingerIsBest I didn't say anything about 1 year old trousers? Have you tagged the wrong poster?

GingerIsBest · 14/07/2024 22:40

Lentilweaver · 14/07/2024 22:39

Eh @GingerIsBest I didn't say anything about 1 year old trousers? Have you tagged the wrong poster?

Sorry! You're right. The post above yours was the one I meant to reply to! @jannier

reluctantbrit · 14/07/2024 22:58

Lentilweaver · 14/07/2024 22:33

Also discussions like these always end in:: should women be in tents?

There are quite a range of options between tents and the overly sexualised look that teens are being encouraged to adopt because otherwise it's shaming.

Women don't need tents, women need boys/men being taught that a women's clothing has no hidden invitation to leer or call or worse.

LondonFox · 14/07/2024 22:59

IdLikeToBeAFraser · 14/07/2024 22:02

I never said anything about a conspiracy. I said that we tell girls from a young age that default is tight. Little kids clothing isn't sexualised. But it IS tight and that becomes the default. And then wr are surprised when they wear tight clothes as teenagers.

And I am telling you that parents should take full responsibility of what they put on their children.
Also,there is nothing wrong that children at some point growing up and starting showing theor own sexuality.

MrWatzisname · 14/07/2024 23:06

I hear what you're saying OP.

Sure, the girls can wear what they want at other times but at school, in a school show, there's a line that can easily be crossed.

If I had a teenage daughter wearing not very much and dancing erotically in front of the dads and male teachers it'd give me the ick.

Lentilweaver · 14/07/2024 23:11

It's a complicated subject, and hard to draw a line, but I feel women have been conned into being "cool girls" like in "Gone Girl" , for those who have read it. Manipulated into thinking objectifying ourselves demonstrates independence and empowerment, because the alternative is apparently body shaming.🙄
Yes, boys absolutely need to be taught that no matter what a woman wears, their behaviour needs to be exemplary. Nevertheless, I refuse to believe twerking is empowering.