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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Underdressed teens prancing about on school stage

281 replies

tumdedum · 14/07/2024 12:22

I'm feel so old but when did this become a thing?
I've been to a couple of high school showcase evenings this year. Where the kids show off their singing, play musical instruments, do some acting or dancing.
The evenings are really good and it's brilliant for the kids to be able to show off their talents but sometimes the clothes the girls wear for the dancing acts seem a bit inappropriate to me.
The one I went to last week had two teenage girls in what looked like knickers and t-shirts dancing very well but rather erotically to a Beyonce song.
The girls were really good at dancing and would not have been out of place on a stage or a lap dancing club but AIBU to feel it's not very appropriate at a school event?
Do all high schools have these sort of dance classes? Is dancing around in skimpy clothes just a normal thing to do nowadays?
I'll put down the pearls I have been clutching and am fully prepared to be told to get with the times!

OP posts:
Werweisswohin · 14/07/2024 13:58

Piggywaspushed · 14/07/2024 13:56

They did, but did they not have to really fight for it?

There was definitely a thread on here not so long ago about young girls at gym clubs receiving instructions about underwear and the cuts of their leotards.

Lots of evidence the world of gymnastics is misogynistic and highly controlled.

The level of abuse and control in gymnastics is shocking tbh, not just in the clothes they wear.

GingerIsBest · 14/07/2024 14:01

Bbq1 · 14/07/2024 13:42

People can always choose to buy the boy style for girls.

BUT... wait for it, shocking announcement forthcoming.... they don't.

@Barleysugar86 The shorts in the picture I put up are normal, everyday shorts. Not hot pants for under skirts. Admittedly, in the summer, lots of little girls wear dresses maybe with short leggings/hot pants under. BUT, if they DO want to wear shorts (or their parents want to buy them shorts), they are always shorter, and tighter, than the boy equivalents. From when they are toddlers.

And that's my point. We instil basics in our children from day 1 as a society. And one of the ones we instill in girls is that default clothing is tight/snug fitting - sometimes that's blatantly ysexualised, sometimes it's not. But the basic premise is there. It's oen of the many "norms" our children absorb from "women wear make up, not men" or "women wear dresses, not men" to "pink is a girl's colour, blue is a boy's colour".

biscuitandcake · 14/07/2024 14:01

Werweisswohin · 14/07/2024 13:57

I think if she's pulling up people for dress code then they're not going to take her seriously if she's doing it while breaking the code herself.

My son has to take the teacher's seriously because they are teachers. And because if he didn't, then the school would phone me (if he was lucky) or his dad (if he was unlucky). And obviously I would check why before going ballistic. But "the teacher wasn't dressed appropriately so I shouldn't have to either" isn't a good enough reason. Trust me, I would 100% be bitching about the double standards. But the idea that taking the teachers seriously should be an option for children is ridiculous.
Double standards are better than no standards.

Itstherichthatgetthepleasureasusual · 14/07/2024 14:02

Werweisswohin · 14/07/2024 12:35

Isn't that their issue though?

Really how is it their issue?

Wearing revealing clothing attracts attention. That is a fact. It attracts attention from males and females.
If people don't want to be seen in a sexual way then don't wear clothing that sexualises you.

And no, I'm not saying that what a woman wears entitles a man to sexually assault or rape a woman. Of course not. But it is denying human biology to expect men to look at women dressed and behaving in a sexual way not to react to this at all in their thoughts.

AzureAnt · 14/07/2024 14:02

Xyz1234567 · 14/07/2024 12:43

No! These guys had massive tits, in basically bras, jiggling up and down in front of their faces and arse cheeks hanging out as these young girls were bending over. The teachers looked mortified. I was mortified. All this horseshit about girls being able to go around like half naked porn stars= girl power, good for them, men are pervs if they look at them. No!!

Totally agree. I don't understand why parents allow their pubescent girls to walk around in public virtually naked.
Then complain that they are being leered at .
Once upon a time Young women who had all.the goods on display would be labelled a trollop, easy meat etc
Where is the self respect and dignity.?

Puffalicious · 14/07/2024 14:02

biscuitandcake · 14/07/2024 13:31

Yes, and schools etc have cracked down on it for years.

I don't like the whole "girls can't show their shoulders because it distracts the male students" thing. But at the same time - trying to push the boundaries as a young teenager (by rolling up your skirt, wearing leggings instead of trousers etc, doing very provocative dance routines) is very normal. Girls compete with each other and copy each other as part of a female social hierarchy thing. It is normal but its also normal and healthy though for schools/adults to push back on it. It is important that they do because otherwise it just gets more and more extreme. And girls who are teenagers but still basically children end up sexualising themselves in a way they don't really understand.

Its like the problems with tiktok where younger teenagers start filming stupid stuff and are then encouraged to "twirl for the camera" "do a full body shot of the outfit" etc in exchange for online payment. The (adults) encouraging this are disgusting of course. But there are predatory adults out there and if all the normal adults step back and refuse to show children there are any boundaries on what clothes they should wear/what dance moves are sexualised, you are leaving children to navigate that world themselves. And its not fair.

TL/DR 20 years on I will grudgingly concede my old form tutor Had A Point and was not just being a grumpy fun sponge.

All of this.

Collexifon · 14/07/2024 14:04

Xyz1234567 · 14/07/2024 12:43

No! These guys had massive tits, in basically bras, jiggling up and down in front of their faces and arse cheeks hanging out as these young girls were bending over. The teachers looked mortified. I was mortified. All this horseshit about girls being able to go around like half naked porn stars= girl power, good for them, men are pervs if they look at them. No!!

They can't help having massive tits.

Perhaps you'd have been happier if they wore a burka?

Werweisswohin · 14/07/2024 14:04

biscuitandcake · 14/07/2024 14:01

My son has to take the teacher's seriously because they are teachers. And because if he didn't, then the school would phone me (if he was lucky) or his dad (if he was unlucky). And obviously I would check why before going ballistic. But "the teacher wasn't dressed appropriately so I shouldn't have to either" isn't a good enough reason. Trust me, I would 100% be bitching about the double standards. But the idea that taking the teachers seriously should be an option for children is ridiculous.
Double standards are better than no standards.

My son never breaks the dress code as he doesn't wear tight or short.
I can wholeheartedly understand why many pupils and parents think this teacher is giving a very mixed message. A double standard isn't a standard. None of the other teachers dress like her but also look nice/trendy/smart.

Collexifon · 14/07/2024 14:05

Then complain that they are being leered at .
Once upon a time Young women who had all.the goods on display would be labelled a trollop, easy meat etc

Jesus.

godmum56 · 14/07/2024 14:06

TheShellBeach · 14/07/2024 12:31

I wore hot pants in the 1970s.

I haven't got the figure for them now

me to and me either

IdLikeToBeAFraser · 14/07/2024 14:06

Itstherichthatgetthepleasureasusual · 14/07/2024 14:02

Really how is it their issue?

Wearing revealing clothing attracts attention. That is a fact. It attracts attention from males and females.
If people don't want to be seen in a sexual way then don't wear clothing that sexualises you.

And no, I'm not saying that what a woman wears entitles a man to sexually assault or rape a woman. Of course not. But it is denying human biology to expect men to look at women dressed and behaving in a sexual way not to react to this at all in their thoughts.

Do you see the slippery slope here? Where is the line? How low cut does the top have to be before it goes from "men - don't get ideas" to "girls - you are inciting men to look at you sexually". What about the skirt? If I wear a short skirt but a high necked top, am I mitigating the short skirt? What about if I wear a revealing outfit but my heair and make up are average? does that count?

I'm so tired of girls and women being blamed. Don't get me wrong, of course some clothes are blatantly and purposefully sexualised and what exactly is classed as that changes as our society and our fashions change. But a short skirt or a low cut top does not necessarily need to be sezualised.

And most young women are fully aware that they get just as much attention wearing baggy trackies and a coat as they do in a short skirt from pervy men.

Werweisswohin · 14/07/2024 14:07

AzureAnt · 14/07/2024 14:02

Totally agree. I don't understand why parents allow their pubescent girls to walk around in public virtually naked.
Then complain that they are being leered at .
Once upon a time Young women who had all.the goods on display would be labelled a trollop, easy meat etc
Where is the self respect and dignity.?

Wearing tight/revealing does not give another person any more access to or right to comment on your body.

Leering men leer regardless.
They are the problem.

EvangelicalAboutButteredToast · 14/07/2024 14:07

I just see this as a sign we are old.

IdLikeToBeAFraser · 14/07/2024 14:08

AzureAnt · 14/07/2024 14:02

Totally agree. I don't understand why parents allow their pubescent girls to walk around in public virtually naked.
Then complain that they are being leered at .
Once upon a time Young women who had all.the goods on display would be labelled a trollop, easy meat etc
Where is the self respect and dignity.?

Where is the self respect and dignity of men perving on young girls!?

biscuitandcake · 14/07/2024 14:08

AzureAnt · 14/07/2024 14:02

Totally agree. I don't understand why parents allow their pubescent girls to walk around in public virtually naked.
Then complain that they are being leered at .
Once upon a time Young women who had all.the goods on display would be labelled a trollop, easy meat etc
Where is the self respect and dignity.?

Young women who had all the goods on display would be labelled a trollop, easy meat etc

Anyone who labels a 15 year old easy meat deserves to be fed into a woodchipper. Once upon a time and today. It would solve a lot of problems.

That doesn't mean I think teenagers should be allowed/encouraged to overly sexualise themselves. But teenage girls (so as young as 13) might have plenty of other reasons for being "on display" (like its hot and its the beach, that is their literal school uniform/gymnastics outfit etc). Basically no-one should sexualise children, but some people do and so reasonable adults put boundaries in place in order to prevent the bad people encouraging children to sexualise themselves. We should also stigmatise those that do leer at schoolchildren.

TonTonMacoute · 14/07/2024 14:08

Xyz1234567 · 14/07/2024 12:43

No! These guys had massive tits, in basically bras, jiggling up and down in front of their faces and arse cheeks hanging out as these young girls were bending over. The teachers looked mortified. I was mortified. All this horseshit about girls being able to go around like half naked porn stars= girl power, good for them, men are pervs if they look at them. No!!

Completely agree with you.

Some people seem to want it all ways, complain like mad about sexual images in advertising , how young children are being sexualised by 'bra' tops for 9 year old girls, toddler t shirts with 'Sexy' on them etc etc. Teenage girls performing like lap dancers at a school show - absolutely fine

Men get a hard time on Mumsnet for leering at young girls, when they say it makes them uncomfortable they get a hard time for that too.

Collexifon · 14/07/2024 14:09

I have teen daughters and a couple of them dance. They don't tend to wear modest clothing to dance in. Ballet dancers and gymnasts wear leotards. Athletes often wear crop tops and knickers.

Is it because they weren't skinny that it bothered you?

LondonFox · 14/07/2024 14:09

GingerIsBest · 14/07/2024 13:56

Oh FFS. No, in fact, statistically, boys and girls are similar, or often boys are smaller, at this age.

Of course I can choose what to dress her in. and I DID. But it's very difficult to avoid the many many mesages that girls clothes must be skimpier and tighter when even as babies it's out there with baggy lose clothing as standard for boys and tight, short clothes is standard for girls.

So I find it so frustrating when parents are horrified that their teenage girls are wearing tight clothing considering that practically since the day they're born, parents put girls in tight clothing. All the pearl clutching and hand wringing and "why do they do this".

It's not sexualised, obviously, but the basic premise is there. Just like from the day they are born we don't put boys in skirts/dresses and therefore, the vast bulk of boys as teenagers do not, in fact, wear skirts or dresses.

And there are always people bleating about "leggings are practical" or "well then choose to put your DD in something else" but I dare you to start paying attention and you'll see - at the park, at sports groups, at nursery - the girls are wearing leggings, maybe dresses, short shorts and the boys aren't.

Idk mate.
My DD is wearing sweatpants, same way my DS did as they are easiest to pull up over nappy.
And I don't do dresses as they pull up on slides and you need to faf with somwthing underneeth it. Not to mention how idiotic dress is for crawling stage.

You can as a parent dress your child in anything you want and I never had difficulty buying sweatpants and hoodies in girls section.
Clothes is produced according to what people buy. If no one wanted crop tops and mini skirts on toddlers, no one would waste resources to produce this shit.
Parents should take full responsibility for what they put on their children.

Also, you are wring about size.
Just go and open red book, it is clear boys of same height and weight would be lower percentage for age than girls. Why are you so uninformed?

Werweisswohin · 14/07/2024 14:10

TonTonMacoute · 14/07/2024 14:08

Completely agree with you.

Some people seem to want it all ways, complain like mad about sexual images in advertising , how young children are being sexualised by 'bra' tops for 9 year old girls, toddler t shirts with 'Sexy' on them etc etc. Teenage girls performing like lap dancers at a school show - absolutely fine

Men get a hard time on Mumsnet for leering at young girls, when they say it makes them uncomfortable they get a hard time for that too.

What do you mean by 'want it all ways' exactly?

AzureAnt · 14/07/2024 14:10

Hotpants and mini skirts are a world away from what girls are wearing now. At least they covered the buttocks .
Now it's crop tops and leggings so tight their whole nether regions are on show. I remember tight jeans and girls being teased if they had camel toe. Now it's seems to be compulsory!!

Werweisswohin · 14/07/2024 14:10

Collexifon · 14/07/2024 14:09

I have teen daughters and a couple of them dance. They don't tend to wear modest clothing to dance in. Ballet dancers and gymnasts wear leotards. Athletes often wear crop tops and knickers.

Is it because they weren't skinny that it bothered you?

Good point (last line).

Puffalicious · 14/07/2024 14:11

Collexifon · 14/07/2024 14:04

They can't help having massive tits.

Perhaps you'd have been happier if they wore a burka?

Of course they can't help it, but a vest-top over for everyone (including boys) would allow the focus to be on their skill as dancers. It's the sexualisation of children which they often don't understand which is concerning.

Werweisswohin · 14/07/2024 14:11

AzureAnt · 14/07/2024 14:10

Hotpants and mini skirts are a world away from what girls are wearing now. At least they covered the buttocks .
Now it's crop tops and leggings so tight their whole nether regions are on show. I remember tight jeans and girls being teased if they had camel toe. Now it's seems to be compulsory!!

'Nether regions'.....did we warp back to 1953?

Collexifon · 14/07/2024 14:12

Puffalicious · 14/07/2024 14:11

Of course they can't help it, but a vest-top over for everyone (including boys) would allow the focus to be on their skill as dancers. It's the sexualisation of children which they often don't understand which is concerning.

Have you seen a ballet dancers in a leotard? They don't even wear knickers underneath.

Werweisswohin · 14/07/2024 14:12

Puffalicious · 14/07/2024 14:11

Of course they can't help it, but a vest-top over for everyone (including boys) would allow the focus to be on their skill as dancers. It's the sexualisation of children which they often don't understand which is concerning.

Why do they have to wear extra clothes just because others cannot cope with a human body?