Should Labour abolish the two child benefit cap?

[changefromhr]

In two minds about this. Yes for those who find themselves on benefits after having more than two children (job loss, divorce etc) but perhaps not for those who choose to have more than two children when they have never worked (disabled families excepted).

https://www.theguardian.com/society/article/2024/jul/11/uk-two-child-benefit-cap-affected-1-6-million-children-last-year-figures-show

If you are going to continue to produce children then both parents must take responsibility. This in turn will reduce benefit dependence

Unfortunately a high % of men who go around making babies with abandon before deserting them are on benefits themselves and are unlikely to pay anything. I suspect that’s why they don’t really bother changing the law, it would cost a lot in terms of investigation and enforcement only to find Kev with 2 teeth and 10 kids is claiming UC and can’t work because he’s too anxious. Others do cash in hand work to hide their income.

Instead, let’s focus on the free and high reliable choice of contraceptives that we all have access to and encourage women not to spend the rest of their lives tied to deadbeats. Let’s be free.

No, they’ve already said there’s no money. Taxes will have to rise if they start CV angling policies like this I don’t want to pay more then I already do for other peoples life choices. I would only support if if they make it a lot harder for people to get benefits and stay at home or only work part time.

I am fully supportive of low earners receiving top ups. Disabled/elderly people receiving benefits and families being supported to work. Every family should be able to pay for essentials. It's appalling we live in a society where people are starving and most people ignore this or complain about tax on private schools or having to cut back on their luxuries.

But I feel there should be a limit . I have three children I had the third knowing the limit and knowing I could afford to pay for my child.

Having more than two children is generally a choice (though not always).

Being one of more than two children is never a choice though.

Whilst I think the 2 child cap should stay,(it’s been in place since 2017, was widely publicised between 2015-2017 and kids born before 2017 aren’t affected), I can’t believe the rubbish being spouted by some posters. The majority of households being affected by this cap are in work. It’s over 60%. So stop stereotyping them as being lazy, feckless etc?
Also it isn’t just single parents who are entitled to child benefit. Families with 2 parents are also entitled to it. So maybe lay off the vitriol towards single parents?

But the thing is, the baby/child suffers as a direct result

And that costs more in the long run

In addition to that, unplanned pregnancies and births haven't decreased since the cap was introduced. So it hasn't worked anyway - there aren't less unplanned babies. There are just more kids in poverty who will then go on to repeat that cycle

A total of 1.6 million children – equivalent to one in nine of all UK children – were affected by the policy last year, an increase of 100,000, the latest statistics show, while 59% of the 450,000 households hit had at least one parent in work.

In many cases they’ll suffer anyway - the money will be spent on crap. Let’s spend the money on meal clubs, free fruit, free books and in school dentistry.

For all those superficially attracted to the logic of this policy you need to ask yourself

Where is the evidence that it works???

We have had this policy for a number of years now and it is having no effect at all. Why would the numbers of children in poverty be rising if people were sensibly thinking 'ooh I'll not have another child because of that benefit cap'

Most of the target audience are unaware of it or just do not factor it into their thinking. Many pregnancies are unplanned and not everyone can go through with an abortion

It does not have any deterrent effect all it does is penalise children and perpetuate inter generational poverty and deprivation

I am all for making work pay
I do have a public facing support role in which I regularly encounter benefit claimants. Most people I meet do not want to live on benefits alone forever but they do seem to want to limit their work hours because of disincentives to work more.
Or they lack the confidence to apply for jobs as they have no skills
I think this is the stuff that needs to be looked at but I am not for making children suffer for no purpose.

So you care more about holidays than child poverty?

I don't think the parents who have chosen to have multiple children should be given more money. If circumstances change after they have had them that is more complicated.

I would be happy to pay more tax to pay for things that went directly to the children eg breakfast clubs and free school meals for more children that need it. Grants for school uniforms. Free school trips for those free school dinners. Sometimes those things exist at the moment and sometimes they don't.

This. Increase free school meals, maybe, but no more cash to parents who just keep increasing the amount of children they have.

Here’s an idea - let’s get rid of the triple lock on pensions and free up some money to invest in the future. I really don’t need my state pension to increase more than any other benefit every year.

There is supposedly a lack of money, yet he's pledging another 3 BILLION to Ukraine? Okay. I just think priorities aren't in the right place. At the end of the day, it's about the children. I say pay the teachers and give funding for our country's children first, then use whatever you have left if you're so determined. Our government should be putting the children first always. It doesn't matter if they won't have enough to shovel overseas, this country isn't the only one funding them. Our children are the future.
Ps. No hard feelings towards @40somethingme I was just making a point.

I'd like it scrapped. I'm a foster carer. I can tell you that this 2 child rule doesn't stop parents who are living long term on benefits from having more children. It's the children who suffer the most at the hands of selfish parents. But at the same time it's been difficult in the past seeing our ex neighbours living a better life on benefits with a large family while my dh and I worked very hard. But I'd rather not see impoverished children who come to me with no decent clothing or shoes, undernourished and especially the one who was thrilled at owning their own duvet.

No. Why should the taxpayer subsidise people's lifestyle choices to have children? Two per family is plenty to maintain what the country will need in future years.

Yes. Children shouldn't be punished because their parents are poor, unlucky or irresponsible.

Sadly, I think some children suffer no matter what money the parents get, if they are drug users, alcoholics, abusers etc. The money isn't spent on the children.

Yes, they should. We shouldn't have children in poverty.

All the while I'm struggling to have my own children, I couldn't care less either way. Fleece me of money to pay for other people's kids all you like. Every penny will just be backed by a middle finger.

It maybe average but it is still very low. Wages are low in UK, so average is not a hood indicator.

I don't think it should be abolished. IMO there are other priorities to spend the small amount of money the UK has such as education, social care, paediatric mental health etc.

I'm still waiting to see where Labours funding is coming from as well because it looks a bit wooly atm.

@Kriscross most people who are in reality having more kids than they can afford, aren't drug addicts or alcoholics though. They're just making poor decisions but that money would go on the child

No, continue to break the societal contract that rewards work and we'll have more people in poverty.

No, but more needs to be done to force men to pay. Find their names, remove the money from their wages before it reaches their bank account. It cannot continue that men are allowed to reproduce and just walk away and not pay their fair share, it needs to be dealt with. I imagine less children would be in poverty if some fathers would just pay for the children they’ve made.