Page 20 | Parking in disabled spaces when disabled person sitting in car

TallulahBetty · 18/02/2025 12:41

WalkingonWheels · 18/02/2025 12:27

Christ on a bike. We've returned to the dark ages it seems. I suppose at least it wasn't, "handicapable" 🤮

My husband and I are both disabled and both have badges. I'm a wheelchair user, while he isn't. His disability is invisible.

If we parked somewhere and I didn't want to get out, he is still entitled to park there because HE is also disabled. We all know what they say about assuming.

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Why did you quote me? I was challenging the use of the term!

WalkingonWheels · 18/02/2025 12:53

TallulahBetty · 18/02/2025 12:41

Why did you quote me? I was challenging the use of the term!

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I know. I was responding in support of that.

Sahara123 · 18/02/2025 14:07

Needmoresleep · 18/02/2025 12:19

Hardly as I would have been looking out the whole time, so would have seen you trying to park or heard you honking your horn.

If I had got my mum into the shop and back again it would have been more like 30 minutes, so even more difficult for you. Though presumably you may have enjoyed watching me struggle.

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Of course I wouldn’t. But it’s hard to work out what’s going on when you drive past, and how would you be able to look out for me if you were in a shop ? It took me half an hour to get my daughter sorted and out of the car and into the dentist in this instance instead of you 🤷‍♀️

Cara707 · 18/02/2025 14:14

There are issues with this:

The driver might have a mobility issue that is not evident when you watch them.
The person that the blue badge is used for might be a passenger who is severely disabled (whether physically or with something like severe autism) and can only be left for a few minutes at a time so the carer driver needs to rush in and out of a shop in a hurry.
The driver/carer might be going into the shop to get a trolley with disabled seat/wheelchair space in it or similar.

Needmoresleep · 18/02/2025 14:22

Sahara123 · 18/02/2025 14:07

Of course I wouldn’t. But it’s hard to work out what’s going on when you drive past, and how would you be able to look out for me if you were in a shop ? It took me half an hour to get my daughter sorted and out of the car and into the dentist in this instance instead of you 🤷‍♀️

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Because I would have been constantly looking through the shop window, and standing in the doorway when the pharmacist was making up the prescription.

Sort of the same as if you left a toddler in the car. My mother was a veritable Houdini. You needed to get back before she realised you were gone.

Italianita · 21/02/2025 15:01

Needmoresleep · 17/02/2025 22:57

This is all very weird.

Yes after taking mum mum to the doctors I would park outside the chemist using her badge. I would leave her there, remove the keys and lock the door and dash in, checking regularly that she was still OK.

She had Alzheimers. I would not have left her out of sight. Getting her sorted to come in with me would have taken an age. (90 with mobility problems.) OK I may have taken a space that someone else could use...but for five minutes.

If the police had spotted this huge fraud, I would have happily said it was all her idea and suggested they arrest her.

Caring for someone is tough. Part of it is not to sweat the small stuff. I was driving 100 miles to get her to an appointment, with 100 miles return journey. Picking up thr tablets at the chemist round the corner from the GP seemed obvious. If this means I am disapproved of my MN so be it.

I can't understand why people don't get it?

Reality check.......You may well have prevented a disabled person from using that space for five minutes.

If that had been me (disabled) trying to park and there was no space available because you (non disabled) was in it, I would be very annoyed.

5 minutes or 50, doesn't matter. Get out of disabled spaces !!!!

MontyDonsBlueScarf · 21/02/2025 21:00

If that had been me (disabled) trying to park and there was no space available because you (non disabled) was in it, I would be very annoyed.

What you're missing is that mother (disabled) was in the space. She had a blue badge and had as much right to the space as you did. The car was parked there primarily for her safety (she couldn't be left) and convenience (she couldn't get out easily). The badge was being used for her benefit so it was entirely legitimate. She didn't give the badge to anyone else, she used it herself to stay safe. It might be true that a non disabled person got some benefit but that was incidental.

The rules don't say that the disabled person can only benefit from the badge if no one else is benefitting in any way, despite what a number of posters seem to think. As long as it's being used by the disabled person for their benefit, that's fine.

sashh · 22/02/2025 08:11

MontyDonsBlueScarf · 21/02/2025 21:00

If that had been me (disabled) trying to park and there was no space available because you (non disabled) was in it, I would be very annoyed.

What you're missing is that mother (disabled) was in the space. She had a blue badge and had as much right to the space as you did. The car was parked there primarily for her safety (she couldn't be left) and convenience (she couldn't get out easily). The badge was being used for her benefit so it was entirely legitimate. She didn't give the badge to anyone else, she used it herself to stay safe. It might be true that a non disabled person got some benefit but that was incidental.

The rules don't say that the disabled person can only benefit from the badge if no one else is benefitting in any way, despite what a number of posters seem to think. As long as it's being used by the disabled person for their benefit, that's fine.

What you are missing is that the rules for a BB state the disabled person has to leave the car.

Think through what you said, how about you are doing your mother's shopping when she is at home? Would you use it then?

MontyDonsBlueScarf · 22/02/2025 08:52

What you are missing is that the rules for a BB state the disabled person has to leave the car.

No they don't. They say 'You should not use the badge to allow non-disabled people to take advantage of the benefits while you sit in the car.' You seem to be confusing the purpose of using the badge with an incidental by product.

Think through what you said, how about you are doing your mother's shopping when she is at home? Would you use it then?

If course not. That would be giving the badge to someone else to use. The disabled person would be getting no use or benefit from the badge.

I think you have missed my point that as long as the disabled person is using the badge themselves and getting some benefit from it, then any benefit that someone else just happens to be getting is irrelevant. That's completely different to using the badge solely in order to give someone else a benefit.

If you are right then it would mean that it would be wrong to take a disabled person shopping, help them into the shop, and pick up a couple of things for your own use at the same time. I find it hard to see what's wrong with that. You'd be getting an incidental benefit from the badge, do you think that somehow overrides the primary use of it to enable the disabled person to get their own shopping?

Floatlikeafeather2 · 22/02/2025 09:00

Aquamarine1029 · 05/07/2024 14:46

If someone has a blue badge, they are entitled to park in a handicap space, end of, and it's nobody's business what they do from there. You have better things to concern yourself with surely.

It's not "end of" at all. It is one of the things that you can be fined for, according to the explanation of the rules on the gov.uk site. It's logical because it equates to lending the badge to someone else.

SirDanielBrackley · 22/02/2025 09:00

Mokel · 05/07/2024 14:42

If the blue badge holder isn’t going to leave the car, the car shouldn’t be parked in a disabled bay.

The purpose behind disabled bays is for disabled people don’t have to walk far to entrances to shops, doctors etc. If not leaving the car, there’s no need to park up there.

If a non disabled person is going to leave the car leaving the disabled person in the car, they should be parking in a normal parking space.

You have no understanding of the purpose of a blue badge (my wife has one). When we pick up her prescriptions/medical supplies etc, or I have to talk to the social care team face-to-face, she often remains in the car if she does not want to come with me.

The purpose of the badge is not just to transport the badge holder it is to enable the car to be used for their maximum benefit.

YABVVU.

Floatlikeafeather2 · 22/02/2025 09:11

SirDanielBrackley · 22/02/2025 09:00

You have no understanding of the purpose of a blue badge (my wife has one). When we pick up her prescriptions/medical supplies etc, or I have to talk to the social care team face-to-face, she often remains in the car if she does not want to come with me.

The purpose of the badge is not just to transport the badge holder it is to enable the car to be used for their maximum benefit.

YABVVU.

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Sadly, she is still breaking the rules, according to gov.uk guidelines. The fine is up to £1000 but I would imagine it's very, very rarely given. I'm in the process of applying and I've been reading everything diligently. Out of interest, why do you use a disabled bay if she isn't getting out?

TeenDivided · 22/02/2025 09:33

Floatlikeafeather2 · 22/02/2025 09:11

Sadly, she is still breaking the rules, according to gov.uk guidelines. The fine is up to £1000 but I would imagine it's very, very rarely given. I'm in the process of applying and I've been reading everything diligently. Out of interest, why do you use a disabled bay if she isn't getting out?

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One thing I have wondered about is if the disabled person needs 'care' and shouldn't be left for too long.

Leaving them in a nearer disabled space so you can be quicker on the errand?

Or if you have offloaded them but need to park up quickly and safely before they can proceed with your assistance?

sashh · 22/02/2025 09:35

MontyDonsBlueScarf · 22/02/2025 08:52

What you are missing is that the rules for a BB state the disabled person has to leave the car.

No they don't. They say 'You should not use the badge to allow non-disabled people to take advantage of the benefits while you sit in the car.' You seem to be confusing the purpose of using the badge with an incidental by product.

Think through what you said, how about you are doing your mother's shopping when she is at home? Would you use it then?

If course not. That would be giving the badge to someone else to use. The disabled person would be getting no use or benefit from the badge.

I think you have missed my point that as long as the disabled person is using the badge themselves and getting some benefit from it, then any benefit that someone else just happens to be getting is irrelevant. That's completely different to using the badge solely in order to give someone else a benefit.

If you are right then it would mean that it would be wrong to take a disabled person shopping, help them into the shop, and pick up a couple of things for your own use at the same time. I find it hard to see what's wrong with that. You'd be getting an incidental benefit from the badge, do you think that somehow overrides the primary use of it to enable the disabled person to get their own shopping?

And yet all the councils that issue and actually own the badges disagree with you.

https://www.herefordshire.gov.uk/parking-1/blue-badge-scheme/7

"You should not use the badge to allow non-disabled people to take advantage of the benefits while you sit in the car"

Floatlikeafeather2 · 22/02/2025 09:44

TeenDivided · 22/02/2025 09:33

One thing I have wondered about is if the disabled person needs 'care' and shouldn't be left for too long.

Leaving them in a nearer disabled space so you can be quicker on the errand?

Or if you have offloaded them but need to park up quickly and safely before they can proceed with your assistance?

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Yes, I think all those scenarios would be seen as mitigating circumstances and a fine wouldn't be issued. My reply was really to point out to all those who think they know the rules, that this is not only one of them but ultimately a fineable offence.

Floatlikeafeather2 · 22/02/2025 09:49

Mokel · 05/07/2024 14:42

If the blue badge holder isn’t going to leave the car, the car shouldn’t be parked in a disabled bay.

The purpose behind disabled bays is for disabled people don’t have to walk far to entrances to shops, doctors etc. If not leaving the car, there’s no need to park up there.

If a non disabled person is going to leave the car leaving the disabled person in the car, they should be parking in a normal parking space.

How certain can you be that the person left in the car is, in fact, the badge holder? The badge holder could be the driver or another person that the driver is accompanying to the shop or whatever. I can see a scenario where my husband and I might go to do the shopping (one of us being the badge holder) and mother/mother in law decides to stay in the car and watch the world go by.

LadyKenya · 22/02/2025 09:57

How certain can you be that the person left in the car is, in fact, the badge holder? The badge holder could be the driver or another person that the driver is accompanying to the shop or whatever. I can see a scenario where my husband and I might go to do the shopping (one of us being the badge holder) and mother/mother in law decides to stay in the car and watch the world go by.

In this scenario that you present, no misuse of the BB is taking place, so it really does not matter. If a traffic warden happened to be on the beat, and approached the car, and was checking badges, then your Mil would just explain that the BB holder was in the shop, or whatever. That is absolutely fine.

Abitorangelooking · 22/02/2025 09:58

sashh · 22/02/2025 09:35

And yet all the councils that issue and actually own the badges disagree with you.

https://www.herefordshire.gov.uk/parking-1/blue-badge-scheme/7

"You should not use the badge to allow non-disabled people to take advantage of the benefits while you sit in the car"

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I think there is a difference between benefitting yourself and acting as an agent for the disabled badge holder. My great aunt had one and although she could drive struggled to walk. She much prefered to take someone with on errrand days and would send them in to collect a prescription. Or go into libary to return books and pick up reserved ones.

It was an important part, to her, of maintaining her independence and of making her own decisions. I think it’s really hard when you lose mobility but retain all your faculties. I know she found it depressing this “second childhood” where you need more and more done for you. So it helps to maintain independence where possible.

MontyDonsBlueScarf · 22/02/2025 10:12

@Floatlikeafeather2 I have tried to explain why I think that these examples are within the rules rather than mitigating circumstances.

People keep saying that there's no difference between "You should not use the badge to allow non-disabled people to take advantage of the benefits while you sit in the car" and "The disabled person must get out of the car". I can see a difference which arises from how the badge is being used. The question is, what are you, the badge holder, using the badge for? Are you using it for your own benefit? If so it seems to me that that's within the rules. If I'm wrong it would be equally against the rules for someone to pick up something for their own use while accompanying a badge holder.

@Abitorangelooking puts it well in drawing a distinction between benefitting yourself and acting as an agent for the badge holder. There's nothing wrong with getting an incidental benefit for yourself while acting as an agent for the badge holder, as long as the holder is also using the badge themself and getting a benefit. Otherwise the rules would have to say "You must never ever allow anyone else to get any kind of benefit from using your badge at the same time as you're using it legitimately."

Floatlikeafeather2 · 22/02/2025 10:30

LadyKenya · 22/02/2025 09:57

How certain can you be that the person left in the car is, in fact, the badge holder? The badge holder could be the driver or another person that the driver is accompanying to the shop or whatever. I can see a scenario where my husband and I might go to do the shopping (one of us being the badge holder) and mother/mother in law decides to stay in the car and watch the world go by.

In this scenario that you present, no misuse of the BB is taking place, so it really does not matter. If a traffic warden happened to be on the beat, and approached the car, and was checking badges, then your Mil would just explain that the BB holder was in the shop, or whatever. That is absolutely fine.

Quite. Which is why I asked OP how she could be sure it was really the badge holder sitting in the car. She doesn't know that it isn't the driver who is the badge holder either. It's a strange thing to be so bothered by if she knows nothing about the actual situation.

LadyKenya · 22/02/2025 10:32

I think that the OP left this thread ages ago!😁

Italianita · 28/02/2025 09:37

SirDanielBrackley · 22/02/2025 09:00

You have no understanding of the purpose of a blue badge (my wife has one). When we pick up her prescriptions/medical supplies etc, or I have to talk to the social care team face-to-face, she often remains in the car if she does not want to come with me.

The purpose of the badge is not just to transport the badge holder it is to enable the car to be used for their maximum benefit.

YABVVU.

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You are using your wife's blue badge for YOU to run errands.
It doesn't matter if the errands are for your wife.
You are preventing a disabled person from parking in that space and going shopping.

If you get caught you will be fined.