To be irritated by this assumption?

[Ifonlyiknewthennow]

I work in a male dominated role, I have a senior role. I'm very proud of my role, and the position it puts us in as a family. DH was out for drinks with a group of friends from a sports team - a group I don't know well. DH asked me to come and join them for drinks when I'd finished work. One of the group was making the usual small with me and asked what did I do for work, I told him 'I work in construction' - his follow up question was what admin role do you have?
AIBU to be irritated that those stereotypes still exist? Or should I be more direct in telling people what I do, so to leave no room for interpretation?

Why did you not say what your job role was?

Was this person correct or are you a draughtsperson, a brickie, a site manager, an engineer, the finance director, etc, etc?

Answering as you did is usually what someone who's in a lower level role says to make it sound more important.

E.g. I work in a crown court is probably not what a judge would say.

If you don't say what your role is, then 99% of the time the assumption that you, as a woman, work in a back-office position in the sector would be correct.

It's a stereotype but for a reason.

I went to do temp work in a huge business consultancy once and the place was full of women. I remarked how nice it was to see women working in business roles only to be told the women were the admin staff and the male consultants were out on site. Sadly theres only been a handful of instances when my preconceived notions proved incorrect, not quite enough for me to completely abandon the stereotypes sadly.

It wouldn’t occur to me that construction has admin staff (although it’s obvious now I think about it) and would ask what you did.

’Construction’ is quite vague.

Haha, I work in construction too. Often I'll be in the site office and get greeted 'hello love, is the boss about'? I'm the boss.

I worked in construction and some places were better than others - one site had guys who used to call female colleagues 'cunt' instead of by their names. Which was nice.

But you can see why the male/female role split is the default view for most people.

I don’t work in construction but have a lot of dealings with construction businesses, and visit their sites. The only women I’ve ever seen or met are in office roles, either admin or HR. That doesn’t mean there are no women in construction roles but it’s not unreasonable to assume that woman in construction has an office role.

That said it’s a bit rude and patronising to say “what admin role do you do?” rather than just asking generally what your role is.

I work in construction too and not in an admin role, we have many, many other women worldwide who also aren't in admin roles - our CEO is a woman. I get asked what I do, I used to say the same as you and it was presumed I was admin, so I started to say what my job role actually is and then I got accused of being up myself, arrogant and that an admin role was beneath me. Sometimes we just can't win.

So yes, you're not wrong to be irritated.

Construction sounds quite vague so I see why someone would want to ask more questions.

Not wrong as there are loads of office-jobs that aren't 'admin'. And some women working site roles anyway.

I think the industry may be relevant, some people hear construction and think of brickies and the like, not understanding there's a huge range of roles involved.

Or, unfortunately, there is a large number of men who assume all women work as 'admin', whatever the industry.

Fair to ask more questions, not fair to assume admin. OP could be a site manager, project manager, Quantity surveyor, engineer, architect, h&s manager, etc etc.

YANBU.

Though at least you were invited to talk about your work. Quite often when I'm with DH people assume I don't work or have some kind of little job- not that there is anything wrong with that actually doing that but why in this day and age make that assumption or don't ask me what I do?

Do you live some time in the earlier part of the 19th century?!

At a social gathering, I was once asked by a woman how long I'd been a secretary. I said, "I'm not. Why would you think that I am?". She said, "Well, you said you & your husband work in the same office, & he just told me he's an engineer." Yes, dear, that's because I'm an engineer, too.

This happened in the late 70s and early 80s.
My partners friend asked me where l work.
I said l work for the local road safety RAC/ ACU.
He said l bet it's a busy office.
I said actually " I'm a motorcycle instructor " he spit his beer out laughing and said " yeah right l believe you thousands wouldn't ".The other friends starting laughing too.
My partner had to step in and tell him it was the truth.
They honestly want red in the face and didn't know what to say.

I worked in a "hard hat" job (think port side unloading from ships) visitors would go straight to the oldest male- he would point to the boss and go "No, she's the boss".

Also when I worked in the legal world people would always ask "Oh are you a secretary?" No, I'm a paralegal with my own caseload.

People often thought I was the secretary to the male trainee lawyer I supervised in my office when I was a Partner of the firm. He was 22, I was 50 ish. I sat at the big desk. He sat in the corner. Didn't make a scrap of difference.

People assume constantly
I always get asked on the phone if I'm reception despite the fact they've pressed the option for sales
My male colleagues never get asked this

Unfortunately unconscious bias is a real thing. I asked my neighbour, who is a doctor, when I first met her, whether she was a nurse when she told me she was "in geriatrics". I doubled down when she told me she was a doctor and in my embarrassment I said "oh wow". One of those moments I will cringe at for the rest of my life. I did think about apologising after the ever for weeks as I was so mortified but decided it was best to just leave it.

So it happens before you have a have a chance to think about it and I'm female and get much a feminist. So unless he's exhibited other blatantly sexist behaviour, I'd just correct him and move on.

If you haven't already, I'd do an online unconscious bias test. Apparently I'm biased against all the groups you'd expect, even women, even though my conceits self does not hold those views at all.. It's both depressing and eye opening. But the point is it's unconscious so sometimes when you are not actively trying to override it, it will take over.

I worked years ago for a company that managed ambulance crews. One of the drivers (male) said when he was out on a call with the doctor and nurse (both females) that people would walk up to him and address him as the doctor and he would have to clarify: don´t speak to me, ask the boss (and would point at the small blond woman)...

Sometimes it is lack of knowledge. I work in a senior HR role, and if I say 'HR' everyone defaults to HR Admin, as these are the only ones most employees will ever have contact with, and they aren't aware of more senior aspects, and that there are plenty of us only working with Managers/Directors. So I don't get annoyed about that.

Unconscious bias is huge and a real problem in my industry. I generally tell people I work for 'insert company name here' - rather than the industry, especially at industry events or with people in the sector. But in this occasion I didn't. I find it a bit arrogant to say I'm a 'CEO' so generally skirt around it and will say, I head up or something to that effect.
It irritated me because of the assumption, then he really doubled down and said 'oh I would never have picked that' - 'do you find it hard to be taken seriously at work' - just seemed genuinely shocked, asked another one of the guys (who is a close friend), is that really what she does - to which he said yeah mate, she's the boss.
I know it shouldn't upset me but it really did.

This is such a good response and so honest too.

Boy do I hear you - Director at a construction firm here… it’s a great industry with so many interesting roles. I’m so glad that part of my sphere is to promote these opportunities & try my hardest to break down stereotypes & gender boundaries. Actively recruiting for a sustainability manager & bid writer if anyone’s interested - south east!

Bid writers are the hardest to find!!!!!