To think Primary School Teacher could be a great job?

[greyskiesandcarpet]

I hear so many negative things about teaching nowadays, but I wonder how bad primary teaching is, in comparison to any other demanding corporate job? This isn't me washing over the fact that some of the job must be really tough, but I want to hear some positive stories. I know a couple of people that couldn't deal with the stress of corporate life, but have excelled in teaching.

Of course there are good bits, otherwise no one would do it. That's obvious.

You need a balanced picture though, and my advice is... on balance, don't go near it.

Why on EARTH are you working at your weekend? I am a teacher and I refuse. I'm not paid to work weekends. Displays aren't your responsibility either.

Teaching is a fabulous job. However it's the other shit that causes problems for teachers. The constant pressure, having to cover your arse all the time, having your teaching scrutinised regularly, having to deal with disgruntled parents, other staff, middle management mostly being given the positions due to lack of choice and them being completely incapable of being a good manager since they haven't been trained, SLT treating staff like children, pupil power getting out of control... I could go on!

You make it sound easy to just walk into a teaching job. You do realise you’ve got to have a teaching qualification, right? That takes a year (unless you haven’t got a degree, in which case it’ll take longer), and for most people it will involve getting into some debt, unless they are already loaded, which would be very unusual. People who are independently wealthy don’t often become teachers. So having a ‘try’ at primary teaching is a pretty big commitment to make. I think teachers are right to tell the truth to someone who asks them if they’d recommended teaching, before that person commits a year of their life and accumulates a load of debt.

As for your surprise at a teacher saying they didn’t want to take a paycut…this is very common. I have a LOT of friends in teaching. At least half want to leave but feel trapped because they don’t necessarily have the right skills or experience for other roles, and those they could have a go at don’t pay enough. These are people who have mortgages and children to feed. Of course they don’t want to take a pay cut- they need to survive!

This is where teachers' views of other jobs can be unrealistic. There aren't many retail assistants or carers paid at teachers' salaries, or nurses or social workers (who may suffer the same kind of abuse some teachers do, but by adults) who have teachers' holidays or pensions.

All jobs are a balance of demands and rewards. My own family are pretty happy with the balance they have. The OP may feel the same.

How is it unrealistic? I was talking about jobs that may be stressful, not salary. Again - teachers aren't idiots. We do in fact know that retail assistants are not paid as well as teachers . We are also aware that we have longer holidays than other jobs. And yet over 40,000 people left teaching last year. It's not a competition. For the umpteenth time - we are not EVER saying that teaching is the only stressful job. Or that lots of jobs aren't underpaid. Why is it that you persist in thinking we are saying this?

So you attempted not to generalise by.... generalising 😂

And 48,000 people joined the profession!

I'm saying that, to some extent, the pay and conditions balance the stress and disadvantages. That's how recruitment/retention works.

It's stressful and difficult and long hours, but the pay is decent, and the pension and holidays are exceptional. Only an individual can say whether the balance is right for them.

"It's stressful." Yes, I'm sure it is. The package reflects that it's more stressful than working in retail or care

That's a lot. They'll all hate it and leave soon I'm sure. All you see on mumsnet threads about teachers is how desperately unhappy they are.

A poster said "Do I realise that people need to have a teaching qualification."

Yes amazingly I did know that people need to have a teaching qualification to be a primary school teacher!

A lot of people in this day and age have a degree. You only have to do one more year of study to be a primary teacher.

Any course costs money. One year of study is not that expensive compared to other courses.

I know of a good few people who went to do a PGCE in primary teaching in their thirties and forties.

PGCES are more flexible now too. For example some Unis do primary PGCES that are full online , except for the placements.

I also have met several people who used to be a primary teacher, and have moved the other way, into other careers. As they wanted a change.

We don't live in the old days where people used to do one career for life, anymore.

People want change and they move careers.

Another difference is inclusion.

This was sold on the basis of children with SEND being fully funded and fully supported to join mainstream schools.

What has happened is that huge amounts of specialist provision in dedicated settings with high adult:child ratios has been has been lost. Children with high levels of need are expected to cope in settings where little or no finding is provided to support them

I think what pisses people off about many teachers on mumsnet - is they are always moaning and complaining,

When all of us know people in real life who have worse jobs, who don't complain at all.

Also the teachers on here who constantly moan and whinge, never seem to ever do anything about it. And people get fed up of listening to the same whinging.

If you don't like your job, leave! There are plenty of other jobs.

I know primary teachers who have moved into completely different jobs.

A friend of mine used to be a primary school teacher- and a very good one! But she gave it up 2 years ago because of the impact it had on her family life. She said that when it got to the point that she was putting her own children to bed early so she could get on with some work and she'd be doing it until midnight, she then realised something had to give. She used to say that she loved teaching, but hated being a teacher....
She now works in insurance.....

Oh no! You can't suggest anyone leaves. I did that once and had my arse handed to me on a plate! But who will teach the kids? I dunno, but not the people who've left teaching clearly.

Teachers are generally responding to OPs asking about the realities of the job.

People who know the answer respond.

If you don’t like reading it, don’t open the thread.

Teachers are very much looked down on in this country. This thread alone has a lot of people shwing their disdain.

I am from a different country. When kids ask me, I will tell them quite freely that I have the equivalent of 10 A-levels at grades A and A*. The question is always "so why the hell did you want to become a teacher?" Whereas in my home country, teaching is a highly-regarded profession that would be perfect for this level of academic achievement. Kids here truly believe the old adage that only those who can't, teach. It's a dreadful saying, but it carries with it what society think of teachers. And they treat them accordingly.

It's not just this thread. Look at mumsnet. There's lots of threads about this topic.

Any time any poster on here talks about maybe going into primary teaching, there is a hundred posters from teachers saying how bad it is.

It's annoying that people are so consistently negative about a career.

And it doesn't make sense either. If you hate it so much, why don't you just leave.

Unqualified teachers, cover supervisors and TAs are the norm in many classes now even in long term cases of classes needing a teacher. When the experienced staff have left, schools will have difficulty in finding someone to mentor new student teachers. Approximately 30% of new teachers leave within their first 5 years. That tells you a lot about the working conditions as the other perceived perks such as pension and holiday do not entice these people to stay.

Im laughing at

"People who know the answer respond "

And the "we want to tell the truth" posts that were written here earlier.

Like we don't know these things.

Do you think that people genuinely don't know that teachers :
work during the day at school,
have parent teacher meetings outside school,
are marked by ofsted for quality,
and have to do lesson prep and marking in the evenings.

We all know that! Everyone knows a teacher.

Itd be like me saying "i want to tell you the truth of what a nurse goes through....you'll have to work night shifts".

Everyone knows that nurses work night shifts.

It's not uncommon on MN for a poster to ask teachers to explain the realities of the job and why people find it so hard, why so many quit etc. Sometimes because they are considering it as a career. Sometimes just because they are curious.

The OP of this thread specifically wrote that she wants to hear 'positive stories' about primary teaching.

I'm sure she wrote that to try to ward off the influx of whingers.

Yet, it still happened.

She wants positive stories people.

Have you seen the current 'golden hellos' running into tens of thousands of pounds offered by the government for candidates to embark on teacher training? That is not 'joining the profession'.
A large portion of fresh-out-of-training ECTs (Early Career Teachers) do not complete their two-year probation period, and many newly qualified teachers tap out within five years. They see contemporaries who went into other sectors out-earning them and (work flexibly!) in other graduate jobs (or trades for that matter) while their own earnings plateau and stagnate almost as soon as they're out of the starting blocks.

You said that many newly qualified teachers leave within five years.

I think that's pretty much the same in a lot of careers though.

People change careers a lot these days.

For example, I know a woman who used to work in business development, she is now training to be a nurse.

People have broken out of the old fashioned mind set of having to stay in one career for life.

People do lots of different jobs these days.

So that people only stay for five years in teaching, is kind of normal across the board

@Machiavellian You're right, but when those are the expectations in black and white as specified by school leaders, it's really hard to not do what everyone is expecting and doing.
Out of interest, who does the displays in your school? We're double mounting and 'wow-ing' left, right and centre, and sure, it looks great, but my time would definitely be better spent planning for teaching and learning.